Ontario Utilitac II - Best modern folding knife under $30?

It has many features that downright impress me though. Like using stop pins to control blade movement. Most brands cheap out and cut the blade so the liner limits movement. Terrible idea. Then you have brands that use the thumb studs to control travel. A much better design, but thumbstuds are still exposed, regularly stressed, and threaded with no captivation.

This is a common misconception. For instance, if you look at a CRKT Ripple it may look like the liner lock acts as a stop pin. The blade certainly appears to be cutout in such a fashion. However, when you take the Ripple apart you will see that it actually has an internal stop pin that works in a slot in the blade. Internal stop pins are really nice because it's harder to get dirt in there to mess things up, and it makes the overall design appear cleaner. It's like your Utilitac stop pin...but better ;)

_11RippleIKBS.jpg

Not my picture.
 
About a year ago I decided it was time to pick up a new knife too replace the Benchmade AFCK that I had carried for nearly 20 years. I picked up a number of knives while looking for a suitable replacement. Kershaw Nerve/Blitz , Kershaw Chill, Ontario Rat 1 , and the Ontario Utilitac II. While I felt the Utilitac II was the nicest of the bunch I actually carried the $15.00 Chill the most out of the above due to it's light weight. Although all of these where high value knives for the money none of them measured up to the old Benchmade. I was never quite satisfied until I purchased a Benchmade 940. So, although there are a lot of high value/ low cost knives out there. For me, they where actually a waste of money, as I would have been further ahead just buying the 940 in the first place.

Just my .02
 
This is a common misconception. For instance, if you look at a CRKT Ripple it may look like the liner lock acts as a stop pin. The blade certainly appears to be cutout in such a fashion. However, when you take the Ripple apart you will see that it actually has an internal stop pin that works in a slot in the blade. Internal stop pins are really nice because it's harder to get dirt in there to mess things up, and it makes the overall design appear cleaner. It's like your Utilitac stop pin...but better ;)

_11RippleIKBS.jpg

Not my picture.
I should have made it clearer, but I was talking about knives under $30, not those costing three times as much like your example.

We'll have to agree to disagree as I think drilling/cutting blades immediate to the pivot is risky when it comes to durability.
 
I should have made it clearer, but I was talking about knives under $30, not those costing three times as much like your example.

We'll have to agree to disagree as I think drilling/cutting blades immediate to the pivot is risky when it comes to durability.

Check your facts before you comment, the Ripple can be had for $30 or less if you look around a little, definitely a great knife falling within your price point. I've had one for about 3 months now and it's a great knife.

I think I'd take it over the Ontario based on ergos and design alone. JMHO.
 
No offense, but after seeing my buddy's broken lock that hapoened after he stated he stabbed a tree, I won't trust an Opinel enough to try using it hard. The Opinel is a great old time pocket knife, but i won't take up that offer for the things I do with knives simply for my own safety.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qKuZskDzmU&feature=youtube_gdata_player
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIKJxGhZC0U&feature=youtube_gdata_player
:confused:

Why the hell did your buddy stab a tree?
 
must have been one of them tree's from The Lord of The Rings movies, ya know got up an walked around.
 
No offense, but after seeing my buddy's broken lock that hapoened after he stated he stabbed a tree, I won't trust an Opinel enough to try using it hard. The Opinel is a great old time pocket knife, but i won't take up that offer for the things I do with knives simply for my own safety.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qKuZskDzmU&feature=youtube_gdata_player
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIKJxGhZC0U&feature=youtube_gdata_player

ROTFL.

Those videos are proof that you can always find something entertainingly foolish on YouTube.

As for the things you do with knives, are you a professional destructive knife tester on YouTube? :D

Ok, seriously, could you explain the circumstances of use under which you would put large closing forces on a locking folder? Serious question. And with respect to your buddy, can you describe why he would stab a tree with a knife of any kind? I've spent my life in the woods and have done a lot of things with a knife and that's not one of them. Just can't figure that out, in all seriousness.

Let's talk about the videos in more detail. They are both badly misguided in my opinion and this gets to the issue of safety with locking folders of any kind, ancient to modern.

This video shows somebody with a closed and locked Opinel forcing the blade open until the lock ring pops off. It is labeled as a "failure".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qKuZskDzmU&feature=youtube_gdata_player

That this video labels this as a failure, pretty much discounts anything else from that YouTuber. The purpose of the lock in this situation is to prevent accidental opening. I can't even dream up a scenario where it would be needed to resist large forces. Utterly silly.

This video shows somebody with an open and locked Opinel applying considerable closing force until, again, the lock ring pops off. +
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIKJxGhZC0U&feature=youtube_gdata_player

This is where we may have very different ideas of knife safety.

I consider there to be 3 broad classes of knives: fixed blades, locking folders, non-locking folders. I use them differently.

I rely on locking folders to stay open under light to moderate closing force and to do so reliably. I don't rely on them to withstand LARGE closing forces because a) any lock can fail and b) I generally don't put those sorts of forces on any knife, including fixed blades.

The closest I get to putting closing force on any knife is when I get it stuck in wood and I rock and twist the handle to free it.

IMO, a locking folder FAILs if it closes under under light to moderate closing forces and worse, if it does so unpredictably. IME, this is prone to happen in 3 primary ways:
a) Repeated hard cutting (opening forces) causes wear and tear damage to the lock assembly (common failure mode of lock backs).
b) Twisting forces on the handle and blade cause the lock assembly to deform (common to both lock backs and frame/liner locks).
c) Sand, dirt or grit foul the lock assembly (common to lock backs and frame/liner locks).

I've found that the Opinel lock ring assembly to pretty much impervious to these failure modes.

Tip 1: keep your thumb on the lock ring to monitor it's position. Unlike other locks, you can visually verify that it's fully engaged or not.

Tip 2: remove the lock ring (see the first video for one of several methods) and file the upper part of the ring so the ring can be turned further around the handle for an even more secure lock up. One of the most common Opie mods.

Tip 3: don't be stupid and think that an Opinel modified in this way will withstand massive closing forces.

Tip 4: if you need top apply massive closing forces to a knife, think the problem through again.

Challenge stands. Grab a free Opinel in the pass around and show us how you use your knives and how the Opinel can't keep up.
 
When an internal pivot gets gummed up you must disassemble to clean it. Rather have mine exposed.
 
Check your facts before you comment, the Ripple can be had for $30 or less if you look around a little, definitely a great knife falling within your price point. I've had one for about 3 months now and it's a great knife.

I think I'd take it over the Ontario based on ergos and design alone. JMHO.

I was under the impression there were two model lines, a budget line and a premium model. The one pictured was the premium. Does the lower cost one still use the pictured bearings and an internal stop pin?

If I remember right, my M16 had plastic bushings and no stop pin.
 
ROTFL.

Those videos are proof that you can always find something entertainingly foolish on YouTube.

As for the things you do with knives, are you a professional destructive knife tester on YouTube? :D

Ok, seriously, could you explain the circumstances of use under which you would put large closing forces on a locking folder? Serious question. And with respect to your buddy, can you describe why he would stab a tree with a knife of any kind? I've spent my life in the woods and have done a lot of things with a knife and that's not one of them. Just can't figure that out, in all seriousness.

Let's talk about the videos in more detail. They are both badly misguided in my opinion and this gets to the issue of safety with locking folders of any kind, ancient to modern.

This video shows somebody with a closed and locked Opinel forcing the blade open until the lock ring pops off. It is labeled as a "failure".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qKuZskDzmU&feature=youtube_gdata_player

That this video labels this as a failure, pretty much discounts anything else from that YouTuber. The purpose of the lock in this situation is to prevent accidental opening. I can't even dream up a scenario where it would be needed to resist large forces. Utterly silly.

This video shows somebody with an open and locked Opinel applying considerable closing force until, again, the lock ring pops off. +
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIKJxGhZC0U&feature=youtube_gdata_player

This is where we may have very different ideas of knife safety.

I consider there to be 3 broad classes of knives: fixed blades, locking folders, non-locking folders. I use them differently.

I rely on locking folders to stay open under light to moderate closing force and to do so reliably. I don't rely on them to withstand LARGE closing forces because a) any lock can fail and b) I generally don't put those sorts of forces on any knife, including fixed blades.

The closest I get to putting closing force on any knife is when I get it stuck in wood and I rock and twist the handle to free it.

IMO, a locking folder FAILs if it closes under under light to moderate closing forces and worse, if it does so unpredictably. IME, this is prone to happen in 3 primary ways:
a) Repeated hard cutting (opening forces) causes wear and tear damage to the lock assembly (common failure mode of lock backs).
b) Twisting forces on the handle and blade cause the lock assembly to deform (common to both lock backs and frame/liner locks).
c) Sand, dirt or grit foul the lock assembly (common to lock backs and frame/liner locks).

I've found that the Opinel lock ring assembly to pretty much impervious to these failure modes.

Tip 1: keep your thumb on the lock ring to monitor it's position. Unlike other locks, you can visually verify that it's fully engaged or not.

Tip 2: remove the lock ring (see the first video for one of several methods) and file the upper part of the ring so the ring can be turned further around the handle for an even more secure lock up. One of the most common Opie mods.

Tip 3: don't be stupid and think that an Opinel modified in this way will withstand massive closing forces.

Tip 4: if you need top apply massive closing forces to a knife, think the problem through again.

Challenge stands. Grab a free Opinel in the pass around and show us how you use your knives and how the Opinel can't keep up.
It's as simple as this. These failures don't happen on modern knives.

I've worked construction and automotive for most of my life and I would eat an Opinel in a week at any of those previous jobs. I do things like chisel, pry, scrape, hammer, and screw with my knives. Yes, I can already hear you screaming knives aren't meant for that, but what about when I find knives that can regularly do that? If the selected tool works, it works.

I can't expand on my current job due to an NDA. I will say that my most needed features of a knife are the ability to open quick and be tough as nails. Don't get me wrong though, if I was going for a trail hike an Opinel would fit the bill well.
 
I was under the impression there were two model lines, a budget line and a premium model. The one pictured was the premium. Does the lower cost one still use the pictured bearings and an internal stop pin?

If I remember right, my M16 had plastic bushings and no stop pin.

The one in the picture is the budget version, it still has IKBS and the internal stop pin :)
 
The one in the picture is the budget version, it still has IKBS and the internal stop pin :)
Huh. Didn't know that. Looks like it's as smooth opening as melted butter. I swore off CRKT after my M16, but might have to try one.
 
Huh. Didn't know that. Looks like it's as smooth opening as melted butter. I swore off CRKT after my M16, but might have to try one.

Mine opens just as smooth as (or smoother than) my $200 knives with caged bearing pivots. I highly recommend it, and I hope it shows you that CRKT can still make some good stuff!
 
Mine opens just as smooth as (or smoother than) my $200 knives with caged bearing pivots. I highly recommend it, and I hope it shows you that CRKT can still make some good stuff!
Yeah, I've been tempted since they reeled Ken Onion in. I'm a big KAI fan too, but I have to admit that the loss of Onion's designs has left me a little less enthused about their new offerings.

And for anyone still reading about the merits of the Utilitac II, I can say with 100% honesty that their black EDP finish is borderline pointless. It's almost shiney and chips off with ease. Jury is still out on the blade steel. All I've really done is cut zip ties and some light prying which doesn't really tell much.
 
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It's as simple as this. These failures don't happen on modern knives.

Hate to break it to you but the only knives that won't have lock failure are fixed blades.

I've worked construction and automotive for most of my life and I would eat an Opinel in a week at any of those previous jobs. I do things like chisel, pry, scrape, hammer, and screw with my knives. Yes, I can already hear you screaming knives aren't meant for that, but what about when I find knives that can regularly do that? If the selected tool works, it works.

Until it doesn't. When that lock fails or the blade snaps and you end up hurting yourself because you were using it improperly I sure hope we get to see a youtube review of how it was the knife that failed.
 
Hate to break it to you but the only knives that won't have lock failure are fixed blades.



Until it doesn't. When that lock fails or the blade snaps and you end up hurting yourself because you were using it improperly I sure hope we get to see a youtube review of how it was the knife that failed.

I've been using knives in this manner for almost two decades now. I find quality and design goes along ways in a knife's usability, and I've rarely been let down. Sorry to disappoint.

I wish I had video of me batoning adhesive concrete with my 0350, using a hammer as the baton. Or notching door frames. Or prying tiles from the floor. Or prying open paint cans. Or cutting steel reinforced rubber tubing. Or puncturing a radiator. Or busting loose rust from body panels. And on, and on, and on.

Some knives make the cut. Some don't. Now my goal is to see how the Utilitac II does. Might be a wait since I'm no longer doing construction or autobody/mechanic work on the side, but I'll find out just how tough it is. If you're safe about it, there's nothing to worry about. In all these years I've cut myself less than 5 times.

Edit: It's kind of funny because you're catching the same flack you're giving me for opening beer bottles with your Emerson.
 
Edit: It's kind of funny because you're catching the same flack you're giving me for opening beer bottles with your Emerson.

I don't own an Emerson. I open beer bottles with the cap lifter on my Vic rambler because that's what it was designed for.
 
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