Over-Under Gun advice for my girlfriend

CUTS LIKE A KRIS

CUTS LIKE A KRIS

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Sep 28, 2005
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We are planning on a month long canoe/kyak trip in the future and I want to get her (or she can buy it too) a nice over-under rifle and shotgun combo in case she gets separated from the rest of the group. She will be in the kyak so I want something compact, yet enough for her to be comfortable getting game with, and possibly defense if the need arises. I have heard of a Savage 20 ga/ .223 combo that seems like it will fit the bill, but I have forsaken guns in favor of knives as I have enough to last me as inheritance.

I know there are threads on 16 Ga. and .223 recently but I have no experience with over-unders. Any comments or questions will be appreciated.
 
I believe Savage also made the model 24 in a .22 rf over a 20 ga.


Phil
 
Any reason to not just get an over-under shotgun and carry different shells? That would increase your choices dramatically. You can get shotgun slugs or buckshot for big stuff and bird shot for small stuff. To add to that why not just a pump action shotgun? Will hold more shells in case she had to use it in self-defense and will more than likely be lighter and easier to tote around.

Not trying to get rid of your original idea, but your choices are more slim with over-under rifle shotgun combos unless you want to get really expensive quickly. I would think in a survival situation buckshot or slugs would suffice for hunting large game as well as plenty of self-defense. Only plus for rifle would be longer range shooting.
 
How about a short barelled pump action? Should take care of getting game and defence....compact too.
 
Sorry, gotta add another 2 cents in that I thought about. You didn't exacly say where the trip was but since you are from Canada I figure it might also be in Canada. Now taking into account what defensive situations she might come upon the first and main thought I think of is BEAR!! In that situation you would definitely not want an over-under combo unless she is just a freakish awesome hunter that could down a bear in one shot. She would only have one shot and then she would have to reload. I shoot all the time and don't think that I would have the time nor the steadiness to break the gun, reload, and fire again with a bear charging. In my opinion go with the pump action shotgun!!!
 
Bear really isn't a big threat in my mind- I've been in the bush many times and the only times I have seen them was going in the other direction. I personally only know one person who has experienced an aggressive bear and he was between her and her cubs. One shot put her down- there was not time for another regardless of type of gun (exception maybe- of a semi-auto) as she dropped within 10 feet of the guy at a full charge- he shot from the hip!

The reason I want a shotgun/rifle combo is for distance- close for the shotgun but she may want game that is farther away (and not necessarily big game)- shotgun won't help that! This is more for food than self defense but any loud bang may send possible predators away. I thought that the smaller size would be less intimidating as well- she is not unexperienced at shooting but not practiced or extremely comfortable with it either. You still get to choose the different shotgun shells- so therefore more choices than shotgun alone.

We will probably be in British Columbia or the Yukon- have not decided yet. It looks like me, Juli, my brother, his girlfriend and any children that we have at the time (one so far). We are in the planning and gear acquisition stage, then the familiarization, then the trip. Just trying to plan for the unforseen (she does start a mean fire with just a firesteel already). Not discounting your opinions, just trying to explain my thought process better.

By expensive- what kind of range are we talking about?
 
The FIRST thing a gun has to do is, be carried by the person who's taking it.

Unless she's more dedicated than most men, I'd suggest a lightweight .22 rifle she can hit with.

More ammo, easier to shoot, etc, etc.

The Savage 24-C ("C" for "camper") is a neat gun, (I have one) but since it takes down and stores in its' own carry case, it won't be much good if you need it fast. Even then, you have to cock the hammer for each shot AND remember which way to move the hammer mounted firing pin selector for which barrel you want to shoot. This might be asking too much for someone not all that interested in guns. (and who probably doesn't even see the need to have her own in the first place.)

.
 
Well, there is the savage models already mentioned and there is a remington 410/22 lr combo I believe. I could be mistaken, but to my knowledge anyways other than that I believe you are easily going to be in the thousands of dollars range with names like beretta, krieghoff, blaser, etc. They all make excellent models of exactly what you are looking for, but for the ordinary person are much too expensive. I believe charles daly may have some models that may be in the midrange, but again don't know the prices.
 
Stoeger makes a great little over/under (20 or 12 gauge), the Condor Outback: http://www.stoegerindustries.com/firearms/condor-outback.tpl

CondorOutback.jpg


Keep things simple instead of a combo rifle. Very simple operation, compact and reliable. You can get the milder 20 gauge and use either slugs or buckshot...or birdshot for hunting/foraging. The nickel version would be good for around water use.

ROCK6
 
Canoe/kayak ?? Your big problem will be rust !! All stainless steel gun or perhaps the 'marine' version .If she's not trained forget it. Make sure the gun fits her .
 
I've always liked the springfield M-6 Scout Rifle it came in .410/22LR & .410/.22 Hornet. Its out of production now but can still be found in gun shops it is small lite weight easy to shoot. it takes down into two peices that will fit in a back pack. also if you reload you can get a small hand loading tool and reload your 22 Hornets on the trail. link below has an interesting article on setting rifle up for survival use.
http://www.oldjimbo.com/survival/v-shrake/m6.html
 
Is a month in the kayak that big of a concern for rust. I have been out with a gun for a couple of weeks (in the case most of the time) and no rust problems. The chosen gun will probably be stored with the kayak until she gets separated from the rest of us- but the idea for the smaller gun is for her comfort- she is very practical and not squeamish about shooting, gutting etc. just not as experienced as I would like.

Dave- why do you feel that she does not need on in the first place?

Thanks for all of the responses so far and keep them coming all.
 
if I was going to go with a combogun I'd go with the savage 24f in .22lr over 20 guage....22 is a great game getter but the 20 is pretty good for protection
 
mete said:
Canoe/kayak ?? Your big problem will be rust !! All stainless steel gun or perhaps the 'marine' version .If she's not trained forget it. Make sure the gun fits her .
Click to expand...

Robert, you are absolutely right about the heightened rust problem around water; even with a SS model, some of the parts of the action and trigger group usually are not made of stainless.
 
Good luck finding a Springfield M-6 Scout Rifle- I have a gun store looking for one for me for 2 yrs now. I passed one up a couple of years ago & regret it ever since.
 
soemtimes you can find m6 scout on auction arms or gun broker for around 3 bills also remington just started marketing the spr-94 last year I've had my eye on them for a bit they come in .22lr or .22 mag over .410 and the .410 gauge has interchangable chokes
 
I'm thinking light, compact, inexpensive, reasonable for protection and small game. A Hi Point carbine.
 
With a suggested retail according to savagearms.com of over $700, you have a TON of options available that are more economical. Plus, the thing weighs 8#, that's a lot of "just in case" weight in a kayak. If you're planning on any portaging, that's even more.

My wife is also "experience but not avid" with firearms and I'd not consider outfitting her with a gun for a trip like that. If there were a chance of bear or other animal attack, we'd spend a year or so training with a proper handgun before hand and I'd change the trip if she still wasn't comfortable defending herself with the gun.

Are you planning on this being a trip in which she could be separated from the group? Kayaking is pretty slow going and calm, not sure I'd be overly concerned. I'd rather plan on redundancies for keeping her within the protection of more advanced members of the group.

just my $.02, you get what you pay for.:)
 
Not to disregard your idea, have you looked at Keltec's folding rifles, while I don't personally have one I heard that they're pretty good . . .
 
I'm not sure what else to tell you, but you might be asking too much of a single gun. Those over-and-unders shotgun/rifle combos were originally built for safari hunting and not really made for long range hunting. They can now be found in some smaller calibers, but it may not be your best choice. You seem to be looking for a rustproof, lightweight, rifle/shotgun combo that is capable of shooting long range while still being accurate with the shotgun. That stuff really just doesn't go together.

Reasons:
1. Over-and-unders are heavier than most guns because they basically have the weight of two barrels so they aren't going to be lightweight

2. The only way to really make it a long range hunter is to put a scope on it; which would have to be on a raised mounting so that you could still see the shotgun bead. That's going to be a quite awkward and heavy gun to shoot and carry in my opinion.

3. Rustproof- don't know of many guns that are totally rustproof; gotta learn how to break it down, clean it, and dry it from time to time. Over and unders aren't the easiest to break down and clean.


My advice would be to decide what the gun will really be used for and then pick either a shotgun or rifle that fits the profile. If you are worried about a rifle not being good for self-defense then get her a little .357 mag revolver to go with the first gun. Not trying to smash your idea, but just giving my opinion on what I think would really be best.
 
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