Overbuilt folders : Yes or no?

Lapedog said:
Overbuilt folder? Sometimes they are cool...

However I think it is completely possible to make a tough knife without making it “overbuilt.” Sebenzas are virtually indestructible but aren’t overbuilt.

Then there is the fact that most of these overbuilt ti framelocks have their lockbar cutout be quite thin. So what is all that thick titanium good for if it will just fail where it is thinnest.
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Good point.
I ve often wondered how strong a frame lock can really be, no matter how heavy (overbuilt) it is, due to the thin lock bar cut out.
 
hkyew said:
Overbuilt doesn’t mean stronger. Some of the strongest knives that people can actually edc i.e. cold steel American lawman are only 3.9oz but i bet it can out-cut and out-baton any of the “built like a tank” folders out there.
In fact most of the triad lock folders are stronger yet ligher than knives of similar size.
Overbuilt=/=strength, a good design is more important.
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Well said.
Weight and strength don t necessarily equate.

For me too much weight is a draw back unless it adds a lot of strength , which I don t see too often. My heaviest knife now is my CS SR1.
While I like it and admire the strength, for my use, short of an end of the world scenario, I can t use anything stronger than my Recon1 or Ultimate Hunter. I don t see the purpose of thick, full steel liners on a folder, when the points of weakness will be the lock and the pivot.

While I appreciate a nice thin slicy blade as much as most people, I see the value of a thicker blade on an outdoor work knife. But maybe a thick blade isn t really necessary on that kind of knife if it it used only for cutting. I find myself torquing mine from time to time.
 
patrickguignot said:
I know they are heavy. I know they are large. I know it's better to use a fixed blade for hard tasks. I know it's better to use a thin and light folder for EDC. I'm sure Freud would have something to say about this...
But I still like my overbuilt folders :)

- Benchmade Adamas
- Grayman Satu
- Crusader Forge VIS-T
- Strider SMF
- Cold Steel 4-Max
- Cold Steel SR1

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From your post, I'll take overbuilt to mean heavy and with a thick blade. If that's the case, then for me, no. I always prefer lighter if it's a choice, and I much more often need an excellent slicer than I need a thick blade for heavy duty. But I get that other's needs are different, so it's nice there's such a variety of knifes out there.

What's bugged me a bit lately is that as I get into more expensive knives, it seems that thicker blades are more common, while perhaps for many owners the active use of a knife, especially for hard tasks, is inversely proportional to its cost.
 
I love little big knives with a passion, but I also like knives I think of as 'fullsize' like the Rike/HX Outdoors ZD-006. It's ~5.2 ounces, 3.75" blade, thick in a normal way blade stock, and has an excellent action. At a glance it looks kind of meh in some ways, but up close the handle milling and everything else about the knife oozes excellence.

I also happily convince myself to carry two different knives without much trouble.
 
GermanyChris said:
Combined with an obsession with early lockup..
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Early lockup is strong lockup, the closer to parallel the lockbar stays the more direct force it is able to resist without deforming. Late lockup only means you have to push the lockbar further before it can close.
 
What is the reason for the hole in the finger guard of the 4max? I’m talking about the one in the same place as the talon hole on a busse?

I figure it can’t be for tieing a lanyard from the butt to the finger guard because that would prevent the knife from opening and closing.

So just out of curiosity, what is that hole all about?
 
Weird... I carry a few folders that some consider overbuilt, yet they suit my purpose just fine. There is always an undercurrent of disdain for heavily built folders, and I can only guess it is by those that only need a certain type of cutlery. Their needs are probably satisfied with small knife. And since they have identified their own personal baseline, they cannot comprehend those of others.

Except as personal preference, I can't really see a set of rules for what is "overbuilt", what is "perfectly suited", what is "too lightweight", etc. I like my heavy duty knives for job site use. I like their larger size for better grip, thicker blades that are suited for all manner of use, and appreciate the fact that the blades don't flex, the locks don't wear out, the blade edges are cut a bit more obtuse than a slicer, and they feel like a sturdy tool in hand when working. So are they overbuilt? Not for me.

If I carry one of them on the weekend, it is probably out of habit or I am going hunting or hiking. For cutting just about everything else, my small traditional stockman will open mail, cut up fruit, half a sandwich, sharpen my carpentry pencils, open an Amazon package, etc. I carry that knife or something of similar size regardless of the work knife I have, so likely I have two knives I carry. Since I carry two knives... maybe I am doing an overkill on the knife carry? Can't easily trim a shingle with my small stockman, and can't easily pluck out a splinter or open an plain envelope with my ZT 0909.

This thread kind of reminds me of when I started in the trades and had a Buck 110. The old hands on the job gladly pulled out small trappers, small stockman, and sneered loudly at my Buck. I heard comments that ranged from "why don't you just carry a hatchet or machete" to "if I need a boat anchor, I'll be sure to call you". Later, that knife became a job site staple of it ability to last under tough conditions and overall reliability. Same thing, though. Waaaayyyy overbuilt to the eyes of some.

Seems to me there is a place for just about all knives when matched up to the job correctly. Then of course, there are those of us that just carry the knives we want when we want.

Robert
 
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DocJD said:
If you are going to bother with an "overbuilt" folder for hard abusive use , it just makes sense to have the strongest possible lock . Cold Steel Tri-ad ! :cool::thumbsup::thumbsup:
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There’s no doubt that it’s a superior piece of design and engineering. However, I have no qualms that the Adamas, with its Axis lock, would withstand any abuse that I would ever inflict on a folder. There is a long test video where a Russian basically tries to destroy one, and it doesn’t need a Russian linguist to realise that he was rather taken aback by how well it held up.

I have been ‘lucky’ with Axis locks for many years. Never failed or even broke a spring, and I own six Axis lock knives, a few of which have seen a lot of use. :thumbsup:

I do agree with the poster earlier who mentioned the frame lock elephant in the room...
 
I've been in the military for a long time. This weekend I was reminded of the reason why some overbuilt knives are marketed for military use.

A lot of military people are not knife enthusiasts, but sometimes operations require them to use a knife for utilitarian purposes. This is especially true in a deployed environment where most members are issued a folding knife or multi-tool.

Yet because most are not enthusiasts with a practical knowledge of knives, they can have a tendency to use their knives extremely hard. Going back to this weekend, I watched as a group of fellow military members used their folding knives to pry and dig. They also jammed them into the ground blade-first when not using them.

It made me cringe, but it also made an argument for the overbuilt Adamas 275...or better yet, a cheap knife and a prybar, lol.
 
Lapedog said:
What is the reason for the hole in the finger guard of the 4max? I’m talking about the one in the same place as the talon hole on a busse?

I figure it can’t be for tieing a lanyard from the butt to the finger guard because that would prevent the knife from opening and closing.

So just out of curiosity, what is that hole all about?
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Lashing for spear ? That's what it would be for a fixed . And for a temporary lanyard .
 
stabman said:
Sounds to me like you're screwed when the Lobster Uprising happens. ;)

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Meanwhile, I will be feasting on the flesh of our enemies!!! :D
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Crustacean Enemies are most tasty dipped in fresh melted butter . I'm salivating on my keyboard . :p
 
I'm more of a less-is-more minimalist kind of person. The odd overbuilt knife appeals to me, but overall (aesthetically and functionally) I don't pay much attention to them.
 
Darkera said:
I'm more of a less-is-more minimalist kind of person. The odd overbuilt knife appeals to me, but overall (aesthetically and functionally) I don't pay much attention to them.
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Less is more, in this context, does rely on an advanced skill set. As a poster noted above, some people abuse pocket knives in ignorance, and an overbuilt folder would suit them very well.

Of course, really skilled people can get by outdoors with a SAK, but it isn’t a bad thing to carry a robust knife. YMMV
 
I'm drawn to overbuilt folders, even though I don't always hang onto them. I currently own an Adamas, a Super Commander, and an XM-18 3.5. I've previously owned a Grayman Satu, a ZT 0200, and a ZT 0350, and I've lusted after many others.

I've been using my Adamas with carefree abandon for the past few days, and it's great. There's something about overbuilt knives that says "Go ahead, try me," that I really like. The Adamas also came out of the box feeling like a tool, made to be thumped around without worry, and I love that about it.

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