Overbuilt folders : Yes or no?

[Yonose]

Oddly, the pictures make the blade look shorter and also the tip more fragile looking than it is. The sheath is excellent, having a button/molle strap as well as a regular belt loop.

 

[miso2]

I have one and I will say it is an absolute beast of a folder. It makes Hinderers and Striders look like they are made out of paper. It feels very sturdy (while it still is a liner lock) like a knife that you could definitely do some prying with.
Ñ
Note that it has kjnd of a strange build where they stack a bunch of thinner steel sheets in order to build the knife up so I doubt it is a knife you would want fk take apart. However you could take the blade out by undoing the pivot. I jusf wouldn’t attempt disassembly beyond that.

I don’t know if you can see it well but notice it has double liners on one side and the “backspacer is actually made of three plates of steel the same thickness as the liners.

Wow. Nice wedg blade!

 

[co556guy]

Not really my cup of tea. I've got 2 zt knives and they get the least pocket time due to being obtrusive in the pocket.

A knife that is even more substantial would just be really annoying imho.

I carry a fixed blade if I'm thinking I'm going to need toughness.

My edc folder is a spyderco endura4. Great blade shape, thin profile that disappears in the pocket, grippy handles, not heavy, cheap.

If they made a military that was able to be carried tip up, I'd buy one today.

 

[patrickguignot]

This thread is yet another reminder of how readily we stray into knife theory nitpicking. If we were to listen to every piece of internet commentary, no chunky blade would cut anything, blade stock under .10” would snap readily, folders without jimping would slip out of hands like wet soap, nobody except Demko would have fingers due to lock failures, Benchmade folders would ship with blades standing out 90 degrees to one side of the handle, ZTs would sever entire hands by failing while bludgeoning bananas, etc.

You win this thread !

 

[vox801]

Yes

 

[RBid]

You win this thread !

Ha! I expected to wake up to find that I may have irritated someone, so it felt great to see that some folks received my comment as a lighthearted reminder. Thank you, Patrick.

 

[Dadpool]

Note that it has kjnd of a strange build where they stack a bunch of thinner steel sheets in order to build the knife up so I doubt it is a knife you would want fk take apart. However you could take the blade out by undoing the pivot. I jusf wouldn’t attempt disassembly beyond that.

Is one side thicker than the other? I don't think I've ever seen a knife designed that way.

 

[Dadpool]

Adamas compared to a 3.5 XM. Damn this thing is comically big

Here's another fun Adamas comparison, the Microtech Socom Elite. It might be hard to tell, but the Socom has a thicker blade than the Adamas and its handle is almost as thick at the ends (thinner by comparison in the center, though, because of the swell/contour on the Adamas). It's a different kind of tank.

(I think an argument could be made for the Socom Elite being overbuilt given the thickness of the blade stock, but it's such a relatively light knife thanks to the aluminum, and slim in pocket thanks to its handle design, that it doesn't feel overbuilt.)

 

[Yonose]

Is one side thicker than the other? I don't think I've ever seen a knife designed that way.

Might be the definition of overbuilt. Buck has added an extra sheet of steel to support the liner lock mechanism, I guess. I haven’t measured both sides of mine with a caliper, but it does look like one side is thicker. I only ever saw this in their open season s30v folder, as far as other knives doing so I’m drawing a blank at the moment.
Incidentally, when I was looking to buy this knife I watched a series of reviews in which 2 Eastern European dudes(sounded like Russian language speakers) take this knife(and other linerlocks) with the intention of breaking it and only this one passed their test. I know, it’s YouTube, and I forget which other folders they tested except for the Ontario xm-1d—which failed(liner lock broke).

 

[Yonose]

Here's another fun Adamas comparison, the Microtech Socom Elite. It might be hard to tell, but the Socom has a thicker blade than the Adamas and its handle is almost as thick at the ends (thinner by comparison in the center, though, because of the swell/contour on the Adamas). It's a different kind of tank.

(I think an argument could be made for the Socom Elite being overbuilt given the thickness of the blade stock, but it's such a relatively light knife thanks to the aluminum, and slim in pocket thanks to its handle design, that it doesn't feel overbuilt.)

Is that an automatic? If so, it’s probably the stoutest blade on an auto.

 

[speedkills]

Overbuilt folder? Sometimes they are cool...

However I think it is completely possible to make a tough knife without making it “overbuilt.” Sebenzas are virtually indestructible but aren’t overbuilt.

Then there is the fact that most of these overbuilt ti framelocks have their lockbar cutout be quite thin. So what is all that thick titanium good for if it will just fail where it is thinnest.

Exactly, as strong as their weakest point which is the thin lockbar cutout, and that fact that when dirty and greasy even well made framelocks tend to slip in my experience. In my opinion as far as strength goes the last 2 are in a whole new league then any axis or framelock. Do we need folders this strong? not really but if they can also cut well I like them and I pair them up with a GEC slip when I need a a thin blade for deeper cutting.

 

[speedkills]

The OP asked yes or no

Some have said yes some have said no

No one is right no one is wrong

Heck I edc a small fixed blade most days

Does not mean that that is the best choice for all

I’ve been involved in knives for decades and I’ve seen fads come and go

The overbuilt genre I do believe is here to stay but it does not mean they are for everyone

My biggest issue is with overbuilt frame locks

They just don’t add up

Agreed, I don't understand overbuilt frame and liner locks.

 

[speedkills]

Early lockup is strong lockup, the closer to parallel the lockbar stays the more direct force it is able to resist without deforming. Late lockup only means you have to push the lockbar further before it can close.

Depending on the geometry of the lock face, if the angle is steep like Medford for example the early lock up with a steep angle makes it easy to slip and close.

 

[Lapedog]

Is one side thicker than the other? I don't think I've ever seen a knife designed that way.

One side is thicker making the knife asymetric. Some other asymetric knives are Spyderco Southard, some trevor Burger customs, which are linerlocks with only one liner.

 

[Earl1]

I think if you like them that is fine. For me a griptillian or manix 2 is about as heavy built as I'll get. But if you need them that is fine. Or if you simply like the design and want it that is ok too. I've looked at a zt0566 many times,but never could justify the price .
I think it really comes down to personal taste. A have a buck 301 and a native 5 lightweight on me now. I'm in the doc office so I don't need a big knife.
Carry whatever ya like as long as it is legal

 

[Dadpool]

Is that an automatic? If so, it’s probably the stoutest blade on an auto.

This one is a manual. I believe they come in auto as well.

 

[hugofeynman]

Talking about overbuilt folders, I also think “overbuilt” framelocks are ridiculous, because of the big cutout in the frame that is the weakest point, but what about something like Miller Bros Blades T-1, a framelock with a pin (like the Extrema Ratio RAO but stronger, because Titanium frames are stronger than anticorodal aluminum of the RAO) that makes it almost as strong as a fixed blade? Don’t have one of those I’m afraid, but seems a good idea for an overbuilt folder?

 

[Yonose]

I almost always carry my overbuilt knives as backup. Not that I don’t use them to cut or slice things, and usually also have a multi or a pry bar available for hard use, as well as a thinner ground knife like a spyderco military. If something were to fail during use, most companies have a warranty that would fix or replace it. I haven’t had a frame or linerlock fail on me yet, though.

 

[Yonose]

One side is thicker making the knife asymetric. Some other asymetric knives are Spyderco Southard, some trevor Burger customs, which are linerlocks with only one liner.

Is there a need for a folders handle to be symmetrical? I was just using my zt 0562 and noticed that the cf/steel side of the handle is slightly thinner than the Ti side.

 

[Lapedog]

Is there a need for a folders handle to be symmetrical? I was just using my zt 0562 and noticed that the cf/steel side of the handle is slightly thinner than the Ti side.

It bothers some people apparently when they are asymetrical, however there really isn’t any need for them to be.