Phrases and terms that stick...

[Rob!]

K.I.S.S.

"Stainless Steel"

Rob!

 

[billf]

Hey Kevin et al,

Since I am actually a surgeon, I thought I'd way in one the "surgical steel" thing. First of all, most surgeons don't know or care what kind of steel is used in their instruments...as long as they do what they are supposed to. Since I AM interested, I've done a little investigating. Scalpels are usually 440A - since they are designed like "razors" they have high initial sharpness, but use them near bone and they lose an edge rapidly. No one re-sharpens scalpels, they are disposable - so when it gets dull I just ask for another one!

Many other tools are either 300 series SS, sometime 400 series. Our versions of chisels - "osteotomes" - are usually non-magnetic SS, are badly sharpened and hold no edge at all. I usually take the ones I use home and sharpen them myself, which improves things a little!

"surgical steel" appears to me to be a generic term thrown around by companies that supply the hospital with tools , a sort of loose synonym for "stainless"

Bill

 

[billf]

oops,

That should be "weigh in " and "on" - I think my kids have infected me with "text messaging" spelling!!

Bill

 

[sunshadow]

Hey Kevin et al,



Many other tools are either 300 series SS, sometime 400 series. Our versions of chisels - "osteotomes" - are usually non-magnetic SS, are badly sharpened and hold no edge at all. I usually take the ones I use home and sharpen them myself, which improves things a little!


Bill

Doesn't it do more damage to the patient to use dull tools?

If you'll pardon the pun "blunt trauma" from an instrument that is flat where it should be sharp?

-Page

 

[scottickes]

oops,

That should be "weigh in " and "on" - I think my kids have infected me with "text messaging" spelling!!

Bill

You made my day Bill. I was reading your original post with the two grammar errors and was cringing. I was thinking to myself, "my god, he's a doctor for crying out loud". You then corrected it immediately. You've restored my faith in doctors, after briefly scaring the daylights out of me.

 

[mete]

Mitch, Many people have no clue when it comes to speaking English. Here's an example from an otherwise excellent metallurgy book "Martempering....applied to steels prone to quench cracking......The piece is then QUENCHED into molten salt " Not a word about tempering !!! I always used the proper Marquenching !!!...Now you can all go back to making you're "genuine reproductions "

 

[Larrin]

I agree with you about the damascus thing only being wootz, it drives me nuts.

Edit: Looking back on that sentence it could be pretty confusing. I don't agree with those that say that only wootz should be called damascus steel.

 

[fitzo]

"Random pattern"
"Temper line"

 

[sunshadow]

I agree with you about the damascus thing only being wootz, it drives me nuts.

Edit: Looking back on that sentence it could be pretty confusing. I don't agree with those that say that only wootz should be called damascus steel.

According to Anne Feurbach (IIRC) the term "Wootz" is a britishism of an Indian regional term, and the proper term is actually "Bulat"

-Page

 

[Bruce Evans]

The term "Tactical Knife" and "Hunting Knife" Drives me crazy....

I feel that what ever knife you have on you in a situation is the one for the job,not the Tactical knife or the Hunting Knife at home when you need it...

English was my worst subject and I dont remember when to use which there-their-they're or rite-right-wright....heck I get to typing and then know I dont know which to use and it just ends up as what ever my hands type...sorry for my bad english and grammer..I would rather have to take off and ruin a set of Ivory scales than take another english class (lolol)

Bruce

 

[Bruce Evans]

Reproduction Knives or exact copies are bad terms also..I have used the term reprodution but heck all I do is make my own version of what I see in the picture of a antique Knife...How can you reproduce or copy something without it in your hands and you make it down to the last micro scratch....we need a new term for this,any ideas anyone?

Great thread,
Bruce

 

[Troop]

Reproduction Knives or exact copies are bad terms also..I have used the term reprodution but heck all I do is make my own version of what I see in the picture of a antique Knife...How can you reproduce or copy something without it in your hands and you make it down to the last micro scratch....we need a new term for this,any ideas anyone?

Great thread,
Bruce

Bruce, If you used the terms "modeled after", or "based on the classic design of .....", that might be more accurate.

- Mitch

 

[Bruce Evans]

Troop great suggestions,I was also thinking "in the style of" would be good also..

here is another one allot of us use "Frontier" or "Rustic" didnt those guys use what ever they had with them or could make....I heard once that when this guy heard someone call his knives Rustic he just thought of lazy un-finished work,had to laugh at that one...

Heck you dont here the modern Oriental sword master calling the swords they make reproductions,they just make swords with the same names.

Ever have a guy call you and what a certain material used for his bolster when he is really meaning the guard,throws me off everytime...

Bruce

 

[Troop]

Troop great suggestions,I was also thinking "in the style of" would be good also..

here is another one allot of us use "Frontier" or "Rustic" didnt those guys use what ever they had with them or could make....I heard once that when this guy heard someone call his knives Rustic he just thought of lazy un-finished work,had to laugh at that one...

Heck you dont here the modern Oriental sword master calling the swords they make reproductions,they just make swords with the same names.

Ever have a guy call you and what a certain material used for his bolster when he is really meaning the guard,throws me off everytime...

Bruce

That's so true and funny... Back when, I'm sure the last thing those fellers had on their minds was to make it look "rustic".
- Mitch

 

[scottickes]

I really have a hard time with "stainless" knife steel or "440" knife steel. These terms are mostly used on cheap import factory produced knives, but it doesn't really tell you anything. I had a guy show me his wonderful pocket knife one time in Wyoming, and it was made in China and was stamped "Stainless". He told me he bought it because the knife was advertised in the magazine as having been made "real stainless steel" that would hold an edge and not rust ever. I asked him if he remembered what kind of stainless steel the magazine had stated it was, and he looked at me like I had two heads, and said, "It's stainless, which is the best steel in the world". I thought about trying to educate him about steels, but decided I was better off just buying him a drink.

As far as 440 is concerned, have you ever noticed how often the factories leave off what kind of 440 steel it is. They don't tell you 440A or 440B or 440C. Just 440. Aaaarrrrghhhhhh!

 

[Esav Benyamin]

... "Wootz" is a britishism of an Indian regional term, and the proper term is actually "Bulat"

Bulat is a type of steel alloy known in Russia from medieval times and regularly mentioned in Russian legends as material of choice for cold steel. The name bulat is a Russian transliteration of the Persian word pulad, meaning steel. There are no known sources indicating that the origin of bulat is Russian while the name suggests that the immediate source of it was Persia. It is highly possible that bulat steel is made using the same process as wootz steel.
​

 

[sunshadow]

Bulat is a type of steel alloy known in Russia from medieval times and regularly mentioned in Russian legends as material of choice for cold steel. The name bulat is a Russian transliteration of the Persian word pulad, meaning steel. There are no known sources indicating that the origin of bulat is Russian while the name suggests that the immediate source of it was Persia. It is highly possible that bulat steel is made using the same process as wootz steel.
​

According Anne's lecture the Russian term while being a transliteration of the Persian (which is the culture of the area where the steel was produced including the city of Merv which had quite an industrial complex producing the steel we are both discussing) is the generally used term for the steel that the british called Wootz during their period of occupancy of India

Yes technically the culture that actually was making the steel called it something that can be phonetically translated into english as "pulat", but according to what I remember of her lecture, the term Wootz is not used outside of the British sphere of influence



-Page

 

[sunshadow]

Esav, we should sit down with a bottle of Scotch sometime and bore each other like gentlemen! ;D

-Page

 

[billf]

Hey Scott and Sun,

yeah, the "Internet lifestyle"/keyboarding has contributed to my typing miscues in a big way! Fortunately, I still remember how to read

Besides, you know what they say about orthopedic surgeons - "strong as an ox and just as smart!"

As far as the dull tools thing - yeah, that is a pet peeve of mine, which I why I take the stuff home and sharpen it myself! Osteotomes are not used for really "fine" work anyway, so it probably doesn't make a big difference, and of course the "edgeholding" is crummy on these things, and you REALLY don't want chips coming off, so I think the companies err on the side of thick and dull rather than hear about chipping!

Bill

 

[messinger]

What really gets under my skin is when people ask me "Can you make blades that are sharp enough to cut steel?!" I know it's not so much a term as a phrase, but ... gah it drives me nucking futz

Give 'em a carbide lathe bit with a handle stuck on the end. Or a machinists scraper.

-Ben