Phrases and terms that stick...

[Kevin R. Cashen]

What really gets under my skin is when people ask me "Can you make blades that are sharp enough to cut steel?!" I know it's not so much a term as a phrase, but ... gah it drives me nucking futz

The odd thing about it is that sharpness has much less to do with sharpness than with the geometry and hardness. Steel cutters have more obtuse angles and would not really be “sharp” in the same way knives are. I have never been impressed by blades that can hack on steel, since a $2 cold Chinese made cold chisel will do the same, all you have to have is a tool that is around a point and a half harder than the steel and a beefy edge.

Customers will sometimes comment on my mirror polished knives and say, I like the 'chromed finish'. How do you 'chrome your blades'...

I used to get that a lot from people in times past, I wondered if people had gotten more educated, but I now realize that it has been years since I have had to operate in a venue that dealt with people with no knowledge of knifemaking at all. Local gun and knife shows are the places to go to get the most insulting and idiotic questions. I know I should take time to educate those folks too, but very often on the street I hear some really ridiculous things thrown at me when they don’t known who I am or what I do, and I just nod my head and say “no kidding!” I need to save my energy for folks who have at least got the basics down.

Kevin... Educate where you can, forget the rest. You cannot reach everyone, don't try. You may be "preaching to the choir" here, help us understand what relates to us, and elevate us professionally, don't worry about the unwashed masses.

Oh I’m not too worried about it and although the title may sound like I’m upset, this is really meant to be a fun thread to point out those little quirks that we all notice from time to time; something silly to discuss after some too serious chats we’ve had.

If people can't even use everyday words correctly (your, you're or there, their, they're) how can you expect them to use more technical words correctly. Call those in positions of authority to task, forget the rest. In all fields of endeavor there will be words misused by the uneducated…

Well I will tread lightly there, as I am one of the worst abusers of grammar and spelling there is. It I want anything to be legible I need to slop it together on a word processor and spell check the snot out of it before checking it again for the problems the spell checker will introduce… and I am supposed to write a book?

 

[Kevin R. Cashen]

This is a fun thread, there is so much I agree on that I needed to start another post.

I don't understand a new trend that I see on the forums…
…It is not like these words have 50 letters and need to be abbreviated.
Maybe we are getting too lazy to type 2 or 3 extra letters.

Very seldom do I resort to using the acronyms that are common on the net these days, I find the very concept lazy. Keyboards have already destroyed the concept of proper penmanship, now young people are writing more than ever before yet learning nothing but strings of moronic acronyms. Our language is dying an ugly death.

Robert, please tell me the correct term to use for "marquenching". I'd like to be accurate. Thanks.
- Mitch

I have been chastised by metallurgists for saying “marquenching” so I would suggest that you use martempering when talking to those in the steel industry and marquenching whenever talking to those in the knifemaking field so that we can at least make progress among ourselves.

Hey Kevin et al,

Since I am actually a surgeon, I thought I'd way in one the "surgical steel" thing. First of all, most surgeons don't know or care what kind of steel is used in their instruments...as long as they do what they are supposed to. Since I AM interested, I've done a little investigating. Scalpels are usually 440A - since they are designed like "razors" they have high initial sharpness, but use them near bone and they lose an edge rapidly. No one re-sharpens scalpels, they are disposable - so when it gets dull I just ask for another one!

Many other tools are either 300 series SS, sometime 400 series. Our versions of chisels - "osteotomes" - are usually non-magnetic SS, are badly sharpened and hold no edge at all. I usually take the ones I use home and sharpen them myself, which improves things a little!

"surgical steel" appears to me to be a generic term thrown around by companies that supply the hospital with tools , a sort of loose synonym for "stainless"

Bill

That is an interesting bit of information I didn’t have before. Thank you for that Bill.

"Random pattern"
"Temper line"

Guilty of both charges. I never thought about it before but "random pattern" is indeed an oxymoron. I have been more conscious of “temper line” since a discussion we had here about it. That one is another one that is a direct result of that horrible misapplication of “temper.” The line was put on in the quench, it had nothing to do with tempering.

The term "Tactical Knife" and "Hunting Knife" Drives me crazy....

Hunting knives I make, but I totally agree on the tactical knife thing, as well as a “fighting knife” not only is it just bad P.R. for our business I think the very concept to be a silly marketing shtick to wow wanabe mall ninjas. I am considering how to handle naming groups of knives on my webpage as I rework it, and I have thought about just including many of my large knives into a general Bowie or camp knife category. I don’t do fighters, I think they are all basically camp knives. I think if you are planning on taking a knife to gun fight in the 21st century, even if you get lucky enough to survive the law will make you wish you had lost for using a knife on somebody. Besides I also specialize in the ultimate fighting blade- swords.

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

My favorite peeves are:

"I edge quenched the blade to get a good HAMON". You can get a line where the quench stopped, but it won't be a hamon unless you get the rest of the blade converted to fine pearlite at the same time.

"I quench in XXX and temper at YYY to get my blades at Rockwell 63 to make them SHARPER".

"Quenching is brine makes the blades HARDER".

CRYO TEMPERER

and my very favorite:

ALL SAW BLADES ARE L-6

Stacy

 

[butcher_block]

the cryo thing
if i add that "temper" thing people more understand when im doing it but i guess it really should be called processing or continuation of quench the way i do it

 

[Bruce Evans]

Kevin I will agree that the term Hunting knife has been around and used long enough not to want to change it.Even though when hunting and starting to work on the animal what ever knife you have in your hand and are using would be a hunting knife....

I agree that the term Fighting knife is not good either...and your swords are Great!

Stacy,I also agree that not all saw blades are L-6...Now days if your going to use scrap steel you better be ready to do some experimenting as you never know what your going to get from cheap steel that the manufactureres use now days..

Bruce

 

[scottickes]

Well I will tread lightly there, as I am one of the worst abusers of grammar and spelling there is. It I want anything to be legible I need to slop it together on a word processor and spell check the snot out of it before checking it again for the problems the spell checker will introduce… and I am supposed to write a book?

That's what proof readers are for! I say, make the proof reader earn his/her money!!!

 

[Will52100]

What drives me crazy is the last time I did a mosiac blade and when explaining forge welding kept getting "what kind of welding rod did you use?", from the same person. I don't know if I ever got it through to him that I didn't arc weld all the little pieces together.

edge packing is anouther one that drives me crazy.

A while back a heavy frame made of 12" I beam got bent a little on one end and they beat it back with sledges. The bend was less than 6" away from a 5 pass arch weld. I asked why not heat the area to be bent with a rose bud and get it over with. The answere was that the heat would mess up the molecules in the steel.

 

[Keith_H]

its not like the definition of tempering is new,

i quote Shakespeare, "Tempering extremities with extreme sweet"

now thats not hardening!

 

[jdm61]

When I post on British Blades, I use the term "field knife" for a fighter because you are not allowed to use terms on the forum that indicate that the knife is a "combat knife". Otherwise Martyn will get hassled by the Man.....or perhaps the Guardian. That just makes me want to jump up and down in the middle of Trafalgar Sqaure with a Randall 14 held in a menacing fashion screaming "FIGHTER" over and over again

 

[Sam Salvati]

My favorite peeves are:

"I edge quenched the blade to get a good HAMON". You can get a line where the quench stopped, but it won't be a hamon unless you get the rest of the blade converted to fine pearlite at the same time.

"I quench in XXX and temper at YYY to get my blades at Rockwell 63 to make them SHARPER".

"Quenching is brine makes the blades HARDER".

CRYO TEMPERER

and my very favorite:

ALL SAW BLADES ARE L-6

Stacy

Stacy, youforgot "ALL old used chisels and jackhammer bits are S7".

 

[deker]

Not to be too serious, but I've got a question.

If "temper line" isn't correct, and "Hamon" is only technically correct if the process ends in a pearlite back and a martensite edge, what SHOULD we call all the awesome stuff folks are doing along these lines?

Oh, and my pet peeve... a "knife" is one sharp thing, "knives" are many sharp things. I do not know what a "knive" is, neither do I know what "knifes" are. It amazes me how often I see these errors coming out of people who choose to make and collect knives...

-d

 

[Greg Obach]

how bout " Persian style blade " ... that don't look at all Persian.... just cause the blade is swept up abit..... just bizarre

guess same is true with some tanto stuff

what bout.... sole authorship.... hahaha .... :barf::barf:


G

 

[JR42]

Stacy, youforgot "ALL old used chisels and jackhammer bits are S7".

"All used files are W2"

 

[Kevin R. Cashen]

...Oh, and my pet peeve... a "knife" is one sharp thing, "knives" are many sharp things. I do not know what a "knive" is, neither do I know what "knifes" are. It amazes me how often I see these errors coming out of people who choose to make and collect knives...

-d

I cannot believe the ammount of people that pronounce the "w" in sword!!

 

[Phillip Patton]

I cannot believe the ammount of people that pronounce the "w" in sword!!

So, should I pronounce both m's in "ammount"?

 

[Matthew Gregory]

So, should I pronounce both m's in "ammount"?

That's awesome, Phillip!

SPELLCHECK, you lazy bum Cashen!!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAAA!!!!!

 

[mete]

Sword was originally pronounced SWORD !! Then lazy speakers dropped the W ! Spell check ? That stupid system ! I just disconnected it from my new computer. One word I used three times yet it only flagged it once. It will flag proper metallurical terms ! It even flagged my last name ! It probably doesn't even know what a vorpal is !

 

[sunshadow]

Sword was originally pronounced SWORD !! Then lazy speakers dropped the W ! Spell check ? That stupid system ! I just disconnected it from my new computer. One word I used three times yet it only flagged it once. It will flag proper metallurical terms ! It even flagged my last name ! It probably doesn't even know what a vorpal is !

Let alone "Snicker-snak"

-Page

 

[M. McCord]

Besides, you know what they say about orthopedic surgeons - "strong as an ox and just as smart!"

Bill

Well, I've had the pleasure, or misfortune depending on perspective, of having two fine orthos. In fact if it weren't for them I'd be sitting in a wheelchair right now instead of my desk chair. And yes, one happens to be built like an ox, but he's gifted when it comes to using his hands.

You guys do good work!

 

[fitzo]

Well, I've had the pleasure, or misfortune depending on perspective, of having two fine orthos. In fact if it weren't for them I'd be sitting in a wheelchair right now instead of my desk chair. And yes, one happens to be built like an ox, but he's gifted when it comes to using his hands.

You guys do good work!

My ortho was more like Paul Bunyan than Babe the Blue Ox at nearly 7 feet tall.

I am most grateful for these two metal hips and the end to the torment the originals had become. :thumbup: