Pics or Knockoffs ???

[MORIMOTOM]

Cool story, bro. :thumbup:

is this meant to be bait?

Okay, I see where you're coming from. I wonder, though, to what extent this applies for you: A knife company mimicking another's designs or innovations is a no-go for you, but what about guns? How many companies make an Armalite or Kalashnikov rifle? Are people of inferior character because they don't buy from the right company? How about cars? Musical instruments? If a guitar uses a humbucking pickup and isn't a Gibson, is its owner morally inferior? Unoriginal ideas and products are produced and sold everywhere you look; where do you draw the line between the acceptable and unacceptable use of someone else's ideas or hard work?

i see a difference between unoriginal and a ripoff, perhaps you don't. i know nothing about guitars, so can't comment on a pickup. is it lisenced? is it an industry standard?

if i believe or know a product to be an intentional copy/ripoff, i dont buy it. that's where i draw the line.

Cute, but no thank you; I read the trite elitist BS the first time. It didn't merit another helping.

more bait? enjoy yourself.

at least you quoted my entire post this time.

 

[Knife Crazied]

Okay well when it comes to knock off it depends if I'll buy it or not. For example I have always wanted a Microtech Scarab auto, well I can't come to affording it. Then they came out with the Titan auto. It looked exactly the same basically, so I bought one. It helped for the time being but my desire to own a "REAL" Microtech is still very strong.

 

[bld522]

Um…seriously?

Do you really expect me to believe that when time and time again in this thread you’ve asked for others who share your views to chime in?

You clearly misunderstand my motives. I'm not interested in being supported. I'm interested in getting to the truth. And those who would make my inquiry all about me are running down a tunnel with no cheese at the end. As T.K.C. likes to say, I don't give a rat's patoot what anybody thinks about the knives I buy.

My sense is that those who buy knockoffs are unwilling to tell the truth about their knife buying habits for fear that others will browbeat them. But when you're immune to that kind of behavior, you're no longer afraid to ask the tough questions. So take your best shots. I guarantee you won't hit me.

.

 

[gundude73]

well from your first post it sounds like you were eying a CRK one piece, now those are extremely high quality cutting tools, and are being discontinued, now the schrade on the other hand may have a hollow handle but lacks the high quality steel, craftsmanship, F&F, etc. now nothing is stopping you from buying it but to me i still would just save up and get the CRK. as Sal Glesser said "you get what you pay for"

 

[Trent Rock]

I bought a "Neely Lock" Timberlite off EBAY for 6 bucks

The selelr claimed it was made in USA
In the ad it said it was made in Mancos, CO
It looks Chinese to me
I mostly bought it because I collect knives that say COLORADO on the knife
or, are made in Colorado

I had never heard of The Neely Lock System
I found the patent online
I didn't look at it closely....

So the knife arrives
It pretty cheaply made
The blade was razor sharp
The steel is really thin
I don't think it would pass any lateral stress test
Has a PLASTIC thumbstud

I opened it and closed it
"Where the heck is the lock??"
"The much ballyhooed Neely Lock?"
I EDC'd it for a few days
I liked the light weight

Then I looked at the patent more closely
I saw a spring
I raced to go get the knife
I PULLED the blade!! Woot!!!
I "figured" out how it worked!!
You have to pull the blade out to unlock it
And push it in to lock it
I liked the lock design........

So, from a consumer standpoint, it allowed me to test out the Neely Lock system for 6 bucks
I ended up buying a REAL Timberline (Made In Mancos, CO) knife a few months later for 30 bucks
If I run across another REAL Timberline knife (Anyone ever BEEN to Mancos,CO? )
And the price is right===>
I will buy another one

I'm not sure the legalities over the Neely Lock
On the knock off it has the patent # listed

Maybe that is just a gimmick?
Or maybe the proper funds are being transferred to the proper patent recipients??
It's not my job as a knife consumer to verify that..IMHO
I leave that determination to the lawyers.........

It also led me to find out more about Bud Neely and his past line of knives
And how Timberline came about
And next time I am in Mancos, CO...I'm gonna stop by the shop(s) of some of the knife makers there
(If they are still there.....I can't seem to find the page where the guy had a store and gave "shop tours"?)
Apparently, Mancos, CO is a knife making hot spot
So, I'm gonna help with Mancos, CO tourism $$$$$'s
I'm sure I'll stop and buy a green chile burritto and a beer somewhere.........

(If anyone has any info on knifemakers I can visit in Mancos, CO
A pm would be greatly appreciated)

That is the only knock-off i have bought
I still EDC the 6 dollar Timberlite from time to time
Gotta get my 6 bucks worth of utility!..ya know

I did get duped into buying a Taylor LLC "New Schrade" in my early days of EBAY knife buying
It had a picture of a US flag on the box
But, that's a whole different story....................

 

[Knife Crazied]

I'm going to make another post to try and answer your question better. I was always told to each their own. If it tickles your fancy and gets your rocks off go for it.

 

[3Guardsmen]

I was totally willing to buy one of the Cold-Steel knockoff SOG bowies (can't remember what they're called...UWK? OSS?) because they used to cost something like a quarter of the cost of a SOG 2.0 bowie. I wasn't overly interested in really using either knife, I just admired the looks of them and wanted to get ahold of one.

Didn't end up getting one because they were discontinued right around the time I put in the order, but yeah, there was definitely a time when I was A-okay with buying cheap knockoffs. Come to think of it, I think that knife had better steel the original...Carbon-V versus Aus-8? Yes please!

You obviously have little to no knowledge of the origin of knives. SOG knives did not design the "SOG Bowie" (Ben Baker did), and the "original" did not have "AUS-8" (it had SK-3). Get a clue before you get sanctimonious!

 

[LX_Emergency]

I own 2 "knockoff knives" At the time of buying I didn't know they were knockoffs.

I bought them secondhand at a craigslist type website.

One is a Klötzli knockoff. It's larger than the original, comes in 440C steel, has steel handles in stead of the original Titanium and frankly....isn't built all that amazing which is what I always hear about Klötzli's being so. (Amazing, sebanza like, precise etc).

Also...it says "Waker" design instead of Walker

The other one is an imitation Magnum with a Böker Arbolito logo on it.

It's rock solid, a nice little blade and I can't really find any fault in this knife.

Would I buy them again knowing that they were knockoffs? Nope.

Do I have a big problem with them being knockoffs? Not really.

I one of the Klotzli's (I had two) to my dad....he couldn't be happier with it.

I've had a Sanrenmu 710 It's a cool little knife. Do i pretend it's a Sebenza? Nope. Do I like the way it looks? Yup. Do I find it funny that what Chris Reeve charges $350 for I can buy the almost exact thing except for the material specs? Offcourse.

Cheap design copies have their place in the market just like anything else. I have no problem buying them as long as I know what I'm getting into. (Offcourse I'd have been happier if the Klötzli had turned out to be a real one that I got for a very low price. but hey, c'est la vie)

 

[bld522]

well from your first post it sounds like you were eying a CRK one piece, now those are extremely high quality cutting tools, and are being discontinued, now the schrade on the other hand may have a hollow handle but lacks the high quality steel, craftsmanship, F&F, etc. now nothing is stopping you from buying it but to me i still would just save up and get the CRK. as Sal Glesser said "you get what you pay for"

Again, nothing about buying knockoffs has to do with the QUALITY of the originals. It has to do with the AFFORDABILITY of the originals. Let me try this again:

I CANNOT AFFORD WHAT I CANNOT AFFORD!

Now with that as an unassailable premise, I'm left with two alternatives when it comes to unaffordable knives whose designs I covet. I can look at their pictures and drool or I can purchase something similar (if not practically identical) in design but far less expensive . . . something I can actually hold in my hand and use if I feel like it. I've chosen the latter approach with two simple conditions . . . whatever I buy can't be a piece of junk and it can't masquerade as an original. My question at the outset was and still is whether I'm alone in applying that strategy.

No matter how much certain folks would like to convince me and others that the real motive behind my inquiry is to seek out people who are willing to support me, that's simply not the case. I'm just trying to draw folks out who might otherwise be bullied into remaining silent.

Other than to commit illegal acts, there are no RIGHT reasons or WRONG reasons for buying knives. There are only MY reasons and YOUR reasons. So keep those cards and letters coming.

.

 

[batosai117]

I suppose as a tool, one could look at the situation as this:

In the electrical industry, there's electric meters, Fluke being the best and greenlee and others as OK. You could look and drool over pics of the Fluke (window shopping) or go out and buy the more affordable Greenlee meter which will still perform OK, but not nearly as well or accurate as the Fluke....something like that?

Also: Dewalt Drill > black and decker drill

 

[LX_Emergency]

Again, nothing about buying knockoffs has to do with the QUALITY of the originals. It has to do with the AFFORDABILITY of the originals. Let me try this again:

I CANNOT AFFORD WHAT I CANNOT AFFORD!

Now with that as an unassailable premise, I'm left with two alternatives when it comes to unaffordable knives whose designs I covet. I can look at their pictures and drool or I can purchase something similar (if not practically identical) in design but far less expensive . . . something I can actually hold in my hand and use if I feel like it. I've chosen the latter approach with two simple conditions . . . whatever I buy can't be a piece of junk and it can't masquerade as an original. My question at the outset was and still is whether I'm alone in applying that strategy.

No matter how much certain folks would like to convince me and others that the real motive behind my inquiry is to seek out people who are willing to support me, that's simply not the case. I'm just trying to draw folks out who might otherwise be bullied into remaining silent.

Keep those cards and letters coming.

I know that feeling. Untill I learnt to save up to spend some serious money.

Serious, save your pennies and instead of 10 cheapies, you'll buy one that is expensive.

 

[bld522]

Point well taken. And saving up to buy originals is certainly a valid approach . . . one I myself have employed on more than one occasion. But that's not what I'm trying to find out in this thread. The question isn't what people SHOULD or SHOULDN'T do when it comes to buying knives, it's what they're actually doing that I'm interested in finding out.

.

 

[shaneinhisroom]

Again, nothing about buying knockoffs has to do with the QUALITY of the originals. It has to do with the AFFORDABILITY of the originals. Let me try this again:

I CANNOT AFFORD WHAT I CANNOT AFFORD!

Now with that as an unassailable premise, I'm left with two alternatives when it comes to unaffordable knives whose designs I covet. I can look at their pictures and drool or I can purchase something similar (if not practically identical) in design but far less expensive . . . something I can actually hold in my hand and use if I feel like it. I've chosen the latter approach with two simple conditions . . . whatever I buy can't be a piece of junk and it can't masquerade as an original. My question at the outset was and still is whether I'm alone in applying that strategy.

No matter how much certain folks would like to convince me and others that the real motive behind my inquiry is to seek out people who are willing to support me, that's simply not the case. I'm just trying to draw folks out who might otherwise be bullied into remaining silent.

Other than to commit illegal acts, there are no RIGHT reasons or WRONG reasons for buying knives. There are only MY reasons and YOUR reasons. So keep those cards and letters coming.

.

Do you have a steady form of income? Do you have the ability to put some in the bank instead of spending it [on cheaper knockoffs]? Then you can afford any knife. If a knife you really want costs $300, but you can get a knockoff for $50, then save up for 6 paychecks and get that $300 knife! Might take you a while, but it will be worth it; the anticipation and having the knife finally arrive will make it that much better!

If you can afford cheaper knockoffs, you can afford the real deal.

EDIT: I'm a newb when it comes to knives, but I use this philosophy on everything I buy; flashlights, computer equipment, guitars, camera equipment, car equipment, etc. It's all the same.

 

[gundude73]

Again, nothing about buying knockoffs has to do with the QUALITY of the originals. It has to do with the AFFORDABILITY of the originals. Let me try this again:

I CANNOT AFFORD WHAT I CANNOT AFFORD!

Now with that as an unassailable premise, I'm left with two alternatives when it comes to unaffordable knives whose designs I covet. I can look at their pictures and drool or I can purchase something similar (if not practically identical) in design but far less expensive . . . something I can actually hold in my hand and use if I feel like it. I've chosen the latter approach with two simple conditions . . . whatever I buy can't be a piece of junk and it can't masquerade as an original. My question at the outset was and still is whether I'm alone in applying that strategy.

No matter how much certain folks would like to convince me and others that the real motive behind my inquiry is to seek out people who are willing to support me, that's simply not the case. I'm just trying to draw folks out who might otherwise be bullied into remaining silent.

Other than to commit illegal acts, there are no RIGHT reasons or WRONG reasons for buying knives. There are only MY reasons and YOUR reasons. So keep those cards and letters coming.

.

i was more or less talking about the quality of the knockoff, if you buy a cheap knock off that is poorly made but has the same design as something more expensive it will most likely fall apart fairly quick on you, it is the combination of the quality and materials, with design, that make the more expensive knives last longer, if you buy a schrade one piece made form 440A and expect it to perform like a CRK that is unrealistic. and if you just want to own a knife that looks like a CRK one piece i say just save your money, yea it might take awhile, but in the end it will be more satisfying, for example. i had been wanting a sebenza for the longest time, who doesnt want one? then knives such as the bradley alias and spyderco sage 2 came out, similiar design, same materials, etc. but neither are a sebenza. so i waited i saved and i hunted for a good deal and got a very nice used sebenza, i couldnt be happier. i guess what matters is what makes you happy, if buying a cheap knockoff one piece makes you happy by all means get it, but for me i would rather save and get what i really want. also if you plan on using this knock off i doubt it would last very long, they are cheap for a reason.

 

[Dorito Monk]

You obviously have little to no knowledge of the origin of knives. SOG knives did not design the "SOG Bowie" (Ben Baker did), and the "original" did not have "AUS-8" (it had SK-3). Get a clue before you get sanctimonious!

Wow, is it your time of the month or something?

I really don't care about the semantics of the origins of SOG knives. It doesn't change what I was saying in the least:

I wanted a cheap version of a big-name knife. I did not and do not CARE what it was made of, who patented it, what sweatshop it was produced in, any of that. As I said, "I just admired the looks of them and wanted to get ahold of one".

Unless the point buried in that post was to indicate that that particular Cold Steel knife was not a cheap rip-off at all and was in fact a totally wholesome, legit, original design, and therefore I was incorrect to liken my search for one to the purchasing of knockoff designs, I don't see a relevant point to your post. If it was anything other than whining about semantics, please, show me the error of my ways.

 

[the kid]

Do you have a steady form of income? Do you have the ability to put some in the bank instead of spending it [on cheaper knockoffs]? Then you can afford any knife. If a knife you really want costs $300, but you can get a knockoff for $50, then save up for 6 paychecks and get that $300 knife! Might take you a while, but it will be worth it; the anticipation and having the knife finally arrive will make it that much better!

If you can afford cheaper knockoffs, you can afford the real deal.

EDIT: I'm a newb when it comes to knives, but I use this philosophy on everything I buy; flashlights, computer equipment, guitars, camera equipment, car equipment, etc. It's all the same.

I rather have six $50 knives then one $300 knife.
I don't think any knife is worth $300 except when it has a build in flatscreen TV. I would feel like an idiot if I bought the "real deal" instead of the value for your money "knock off".

If I want a camera, new PC, flashlight, mediaplayer, portable hard drive, mobile phone. I could save up and get all of those things in three years time.
Or buy cheaper stuff and get them all in six months time.

Edit
Although I do tend to buy quality brands with most of these items, the idea you can afford anything is in my opinion ludicrous.

 

[Bill1170]

Why do people get so worked up about this topic? Everyone is different and will do what their character dictates. Each person has an inner compass that is the final determinant of their decisions in life, and gets to experience the results of their selections. This is how we learn.

Do what works for you and allow others to do the same. So long as nobody is directly harmed, it is all education.

Personally I do not desire "fakes" and go for the real thing. I also don't lust after very expensive blades, so I am fortunate in that. If everyone was like me, the high end knifemakers of this world would be out of a job, and that would be a loss for all of us.

 

[FlaMtnBkr]

I have no desire for wall hangers that are junk. I don't care what the design is if it is made poorly and with bad materials it is a piece of junk that is a waste of whatever money you did spend on it. I would rather have a different design that uses good materials and is priced well. You can spend 60 bucks on a Benchmade Griptilian or you can spend it on some elaborate knock off piece of tin junk.

Do you eat at McDonalds? Do you watch TV? Are you posting this from your home or from the library? If you do any of those then you can afford to buy the real deal you just have to save a little. You choose to spend your money on different things and you choose to spend your money on a questionable copy instead of the real thing. You could buy the real thing you just choose not to.

I am disabled and not able to work right now and I am able to buy a quality knife. It's about being smart with your money and making an informed purchase.

I would rather save and buy quality that I can use and use hard then something that looks cool I can play around with. Anything I buy I go for quality and save up for the purchase. I would rather buy something that is more expensive and will last a lifetime than a cheaper item that will fall apart in a few months or just not work well at all.

So, no, I do not buy cheap knives or cheap anything else for that matter.

 

[shaneinhisroom]

I rather have six $50 knives then one $300 knife.
I don't think any knife is worth $300 except when it has a build in flatscreen TV. I would feel like an idiot if I bought the "real deal" instead of the value for your money "knock off".

If I want a camera, new PC, flashlight, mediaplayer, portable hard drive, mobile phone. I could save up and get all of those things in three years time.
Or buy cheaper stuff and get them all in six months time.

Edit
Although I do tend to buy quality brands with most of these items, the idea you can afford anything is in my opinion ludicrous.

Maybe you're taking my post out of context. A lot of people would rather buy six $50 knives than one $300 knife. UNLESS you REALLY want that $300 knife, then no amount of other knives can satisfy you until you get it. It's like going out to eat; would I rather eat 3 double cheeseburgers or a really good philly cheese steak sandwich. Sometimes, yes, I want to have the quantity of 3 double cheeseburgers...but there are those times when a really really good philly cheese steak just hits the spot.

And yeah, you can afford anything, if you keep this within the context of the argument. I'm not saying you can go out and instantly start saving for a million dollar house if all you do is flip burgers at a joint. But within reason, it's possible.

Arguing on the internet is like the special olympics...even if you win, you're still... special.

EDIT: My friend above nailed it home. Oh- and about this:

I don't think any knife is worth $300 except when it has a build in flatscreen TV. I would feel like an idiot if I bought the "real deal" instead of the value for your money "knock off".

Ever heard of the Sebenza?

 

[the kid]

Maybe you're taking my post out of context. A lot of people would rather buy six $50 knives than one $300 knife. UNLESS you REALLY want that $300 knife, then no amount of other knives can satisfy you until you get it. It's like going out to eat; would I rather eat 3 double cheeseburgers or a really good philly cheese steak sandwich. Sometimes, yes, I want to have the quantity of 3 double cheeseburgers...but there are those times when a really really good philly cheese steak just hits the spot.

And yeah, you can afford anything, if you keep this within the context of the argument. I'm not saying you can go out and instantly start saving for a million dollar house if all you do is flip burgers at a joint. But within reason, it's possible.

Arguing on the internet is like the special olympics...even if you win, you're still... special.

EDIT: My friend above nailed it home. Oh- and about this:

Ever heard of the Sebenza?

Yes, far to often

I agree you CAN buy any knife you want if you save up long enough. But I think most people want to buy other stuff as well and knife collection is just one of their hobby's.
I rather buy a new graphics card plus portable hard drive for instance then a $300 knife. Even if I really really like the knife.

This is when buying a similar design but with less quality material is a good alternative.