Question about what to do with some old knives

Thanks Iris, you shouldn't have been asked that question I don't think. Commercial discussion is discouraged here, and it's particularly relevant as you are not a paid member. I hope that our more longstanding members will be of assistance in terms of respecting the forum guidelines :)

Here's a contemporary photograph of the old Sylvester Works :thumbup:

 
Yes I have seen that picture :) Pretty cool. I've google street map stalked the area lol. Looks pretty miserable nowadays!
 
Amazing find! I can't add anything to the discussion other that what has already been offered. I think they are more valuable as a set with the box. Even in the condition they are in, mint knives of a decent age have great value to collectors.

Thank you for sharing them.
 
I think someone else said that was fine. But I might just leave them alone altogether... I wouldn't know what oil to use anyway. lol
 
Thanks Glennbad. Yes it is fair to say we all felt kinda like we'd stumbled upon some treasure :) Lucky to have done so as the roof was leaking and getting fixed by my bro-in-law and he saw them nestled in a spot invisible from down below :) pretty cool!
 
Iris said:
I think someone else said that was fine. But I might just leave them alone altogether... I wouldn't know what oil to use anyway. lol
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It probably doesn't matter much as long as you're keeping them dry, as of course you are. You wouldn't want to get the box oily anyway.
 
scrteened porch said:
It probably doesn't matter much as long as you're keeping them dry, as of course you are. You wouldn't want to get the box oily anyway.
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True, hadn't even thought about the oil potentially getting on the box! And yes, they are wrapped in tissues kept safely packed away :)
 
Fantastic find, some people are so lucky. :)

Like everyone else said DON"T CLEAN THEM, we have some UK residents who may be able to shed more light on the origin of these knives. To be honest my reply is just so I'm subscribed in order to follow your story. If you can find answers, this'll be the place to find 'em.
 
What a marvelous discovery! Congrats and welcome to the forum.

The obvious consensus is do not attempt to restore them. I agree with that, however, I would try to stabilize the rust from further deteriorating the metal. This can be done by liberally applying mineral oil and lightly working it in with a thick weave cotton cloth (think light canvas). In my experience, it should not alter the metal finish but it will remove some of the red rust and allow the natural black oxidation (patina) to set. They will still be oxidized but in a form that is much less corrosive. You can use a Q-tip with mineral oil to get down in to the blade well and a light coat of oil applied to the handles will help keep them from further drying/drawing.

Edited to add: I am not a collector and there are members here that are far more knowledgeable about what may/may not devalue a knife. That being said, if you get information from one of those members that conflicts with what I have suggested, you should certainly disregard my advice. I have a medical condition not yet named by the science community, in which the sight of red rust on a knife makes me cringe and somewhat physically sick :barf: :)
 
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scrteened porch said:
Does not touching them include not applying oil or something to stabilize the rust?
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Since Iris doesn't intend to keep them, I think she would be better doing nothing at all to them. Presumably, the collector who they go to will be well-prepared to deal with them, and I don't see why their condition would dramatically deteriorate prior to that. It sounds like they were up in the attic a long time :thumbup:
 
Tilley Knife said:
there are members here that are far more knowledgeable about what may/may not devalue a knife
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Jack Black said:
Since Iris doesn't intend to keep them, I think she would be better doing nothing at all to them. Presumably, the collector who they go to will be well-prepared to deal with them, and I don't see why their condition would dramatically deteriorate prior to that. It sounds like they were up in the attic a long time :thumbup:
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Jack is most certainly one of those said members :thumbup:
 
John Lockwood was apprenticed to John Burgin, becoming a Freeman with Hallamshire Company of Cutlers in 1767, when he was assigned the 'CX' mark. He had two sons, John Jnr and William. In 1803, already trading in Arundel Street, William married Ann Sorby, daughter of Thomas Sorby of Sheffield tool-makers Sorby, Hobson & Co. The 'Lockwood Brothers were the four sons of William and Ann - William, John, Joseph and Charles.

By 1837, Lockwood Bros were listed in Arundel Street and partnered by John Sorby & Sons in Spital Hill (at the opposite end of the city). The partnership was dissolved in 1844, with Lockwood Bros acquiring the Sorby marks and business. By 1861, the company claimed to employ 500 hands. In 1865, they further expanded their Arundel Street premises, and leased a portion of the nearby works of W & S Butcher, which still stands as Sterling Works (I should have a photo somewhere).

German counterfeiting of Lockwood knives caused the company to adopt the famous Pampas Rhea mark, with the words 'Pampa' and 'Real Knife' (a phrase which was used by other Sheffield cutlers). The main trade mark was 'C:X'. They also acquired other marks.

Three of the Lockwood Brothers died in the 1870's, but the firm remained one of Sheffield's leading tool and cutlery firms. In 1881, they employed 400 workers. A decade later, they moved to the old Sorby premises, and became a limited company (I recently posted photos of the Sorby premises as it stands today).

By WW1, Lockwood's were in decline, and in 1919, the firm became part of the Sheffield Cutlery Manufacturers Ltd, a group led by Needham, Neall, & Tyzack. This venture did not fare well though, and by 1927, Lockwood's marks and assets had been acquired by Joseph Elliot, who ran Lockwood Brothers as a stand-alone brand from their Sylvester Works.. Elliot's was wound up in 1998.
 
I've moved three posts from the Old Knives thread to this thread. You'll notice some redundency. Best to keep the questions and answers in one place.
 
Iris said:
I had guessed their age to be between 1886-1919
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They're certainly later than that Iris, definitely post-1927, and probably later :thumbup:

Iris said:
Yes I have seen that picture :) Pretty cool. I've google street map stalked the area lol. Looks pretty miserable nowadays!
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Yes, it's been a run-down area for many years I'm afraid. There's been a Wheel/factory on that site for many years though. You'll find some more information here: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1232523-The-Dairy-Maids-of-Porter-Brook-(Part-3)

Peregrin said:
I've moved three posts from the Old Knives thread to this thread. You'll notice some redundency. Best to keep the questions and answers in one place.
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Thanks Gary :thumbup:
 
Neat find ! I'd also like to hear the story about how a box of half dozen knives ended up in the rafters of your moms garage !!
 
I'm a little surprised that the ettrick pattern would have been chosen for a sheep dip company. That being said, I need to read the ettrick thread, to see if it will shed some light. I had thought them more a light pruner style, but again, ignorant of their general usage. What a great find Iris! So interesting, and why were they hidden/placed where they were to begin with? Do you have any knowledge of the previous occupants of the house?, perhaps that would "shed" some light on this wonderful find! Very nifty, I will keep track of this for sure. :D
Thanks, Neal
 
Jack Black said:
John Lockwood was apprenticed to John Burgin, becoming a Freeman with Hallamshire Company of Cutlers in 1767, when he was assigned the 'CX' mark. He had two sons, John Jnr and William. In 1803, already trading in Arundel Street, William married Ann Sorby, daughter of Thomas Sorby of Sheffield tool-makers Sorby, Hobson & Co. The 'Lockwood Brothers were the four sons of William and Ann - William, John, Joseph and Charles.

By 1837, Lockwood Bros were listed in Arundel Street and partnered by John Sorby & Sons in Spital Hill (at the opposite end of the city). The partnership was dissolved in 1844, with Lockwood Bros acquiring the Sorby marks and business. By 1861, the company claimed to employ 500 hands. In 1865, they further expanded their Arundel Street premises, and leased a portion of the nearby works of W & S Butcher, which still stands as Sterling Works (I should have a photo somewhere).

German counterfeiting of Lockwood knives caused the company to adopt the famous Pampas Rhea mark, with the words 'Pampa' and 'Real Knife' (a phrase which was used by other Sheffield cutlers). The main trade mark was 'C:X'. They also acquired other marks.

Three of the Lockwood Brothers died in the 1870's, but the firm remained one of Sheffield's leading tool and cutlery firms. In 1881, they employed 400 workers. A decade later, they moved to the old Sorby premises, and became a limited company (I recently posted photos of the Sorby premises as it stands today).

By WW1, Lockwood's were in decline, and in 1919, the firm became part of the Sheffield Cutlery Manufacturers Ltd, a group led by Needham, Neall, & Tyzack. This venture did not fare well though, and by 1927, Lockwood's marks and assets had been acquired by Joseph Elliot, who ran Lockwood Brothers as a stand-alone brand from their Sylvester Works.. Elliot's was wound up in 1998.
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Thank you Jack there is some interesting facts there I had not found in my searches :) I will try find the info I saved somewhere about 'Young's Sheep Dips' and paste it to give us a better indication of age. From what I found they were very actively selling sheep dips in the early 20th Century (20s-40s) so perhaps the knives could be that old! But you are the expert so if you think later, who am I to argue. ;)
 
Peregrin said:
I've moved three posts from the Old Knives thread to this thread. You'll notice some redundency. Best to keep the questions and answers in one place.
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Thanks so much. I am still trying to figure out how it all works. What is the best way to stay on top of reply's? Is there a place where it shows new reply's to a thread? I just keep clicking on my activity and trying to enter the thread that way.
 
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