Questions about gun safety

I think your caution is well-founded. Like Chef, I've had an unfortunately close-call with impromptu field-instruction with handguns. After emphasizing muzzle control until the cows came home (and the seemingly simple concept that semi-auto means the gun is ready to fire immediately after discharging a round), I found my new student excitedly turning around after squeezing off his first shot to express his giddy happiness and pointing my 9mm pistol back uprange at us with his finger still on the trigger. Luckily, nothing worse happened...

I think if you're raised in a culture of firearms you can be safely taught to handle a gun at a young age by any responsible firearm owner - because even youngsters understand the stigma attached to breaking cultural taboos (and where I grew up, lack of muzzle control was a big taboo). But if you weren't raised in the appropriate culture, a qualified instructor is properly required. A qualified instructor will know all the techniques to safely introduce someone to handling a firearm responsibly. Otherwise you risk repeating the mistake I made.
 
akennedy, I hear ya.
My dad wouldn't allow us to point a toy gun at the dog.

OK, here is the story I've been holding back, wasn't sure if it was appropriate, but, here it goes...

This is indeed true, happened at my rifle/pistol range, about 12 to 15 years ago.

A guy we knew met a nice lady and they had gone out on a couple of dates. She expressed interest in everything he did, including pistol shooting. A lady who wanted to go pistol shooting with you? wow. cool.

He addressed safety safety safety. She was no dummy, and followed his instructions. They had established proper method for gun down on bench, "hands off", unloaded, while someone was changing targets, and all the other safety rules that go with running a safe range.

He was changing targets and BLAM!!!!! One shot rang out. He thought, "WTF!!!"
He spun around, and she was on the ground, shot in the head. No lie.

To make a long story short, She lived. It was no accident. It seems she had some boughts with mental problems in the past, and had attempted suicide before.
This time she almost pulled it off.

There is no way he could have known anything without doing a background check on her.

But, hopefully this also explains my hesitancy to say,
"SURE, yeah, buddy, go buy a gun, and I'll take you to the range and teach you the basics."

Know thy gun buddy.
 
SkunkWerX said:
There is no way he could have known anything without doing a background check on her.

Know thy gun buddy.
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I do a background check on ALL my girlfriends..

Ok, not really (I've been married 10 years to a Competative Pistol Shooter)

But DAMN!!

Clearly your friend provided some first aid and called 911 FAST since she lived, but still....... I'd be in therapy for YEARS after something like that. I should probably be in therapy now, except I've got to finish that faux-poon...


No bearing on skunk's story..
I met a guy about 5 years ago at a SAR Conference. He talked all about guns, and how he wanted to be a cop, etc... So, as we chatted, I learned that there was a Firearms School about an hour away from me. So we made plans to go and take a Basic Pistol class together.

5 Years later..
He was hired by the Sheriffs Dept, worked about 3 years, and has since quit, and went back to work for the hospital, as a Certified Hyperbarics Tech, and is finishing Med School. We went through many classes together, and have both received out Handgun Master Cert..

Caution is the better part of valor, however, maybe all this kid needs is a gentle nudge in the right direction. If you're not a qualified instructor, help him find one. THEN OFFER TO TAKE THE CLASS WITH HIM!!! We could ALL use a refresher in the basics now and again. Also, having a friend there sometimes eases the tension a bit.



Just my own humble opinion, worth exactly what you paid for it.... :)
 
So im not clear on the certifacation on fireares at all in the states, what are the prerequisits of owning a firearm?

I know in canada if you hunt with a firearm, you either have to have to have a minors firearms license with firearm and hunter safty courses(under 18). Or of you are 18 or over, you can file for your PAL after firearm training course, then your hunter education and hunt. Now, there are restricted and non-restricted(hunting rifles) firearm licenses.
So, do you need a training(courses) to own a firearm in the us?

I mean, for me to hunt I needed two courses, books and then had to file for a PAL(possession and acquisition License)
 
I agree with his taking an NRA course, but I think that I would just mention this to him and let him make the decision to enroll and take it. Then several weeks down the road, ask if he completed his safety course. I'm willing to bet that he only wanted to shoot a real gun and if he's flippin from one subject to another, then his mind is doing the same thing and I'm not so sure I'd want him handling my weapons.
 
when I decided to get a pistol I wanted my wife to be comfortable w/ it. So being a smart husband I found a NRA course close to home knowing my wife would listen to someone other than myself. When she froze the 1st time she was to fire the instructor helped her, whereas I couldn't. As ya can tell I too took the course. There is something special when the 2 of us go to the range together :) :)
 
thats another thing in canada, you need people to vouch for you that you are compitient to own a firearm when regestering for your PAL.
 
Trust your gut, hikeeba.

SkunkWerX said:
My dad wouldn't allow us to point a toy gun at the dog.
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Same here. My first gun was a Daisy (8th birthday), and Pops and my favorite uncle both hammered into my brain, "Never even AIM at anything you don't intend to kill." Safe backdrop, muzzle control, "Never trust a safety", "Assume every gun is loaded" and so forth. Took my DNR Hunter Safety course (Dad came with me for moral support) as soon as I turned 12. (have a great story about that, but now isn't the time.) I consider myself very fortunate to have had that background.

I'm in the keep-your-distance camp on this one. I've known many guys like you describe; they're generally a pain in the ass at best, and could be worse. Encourage him to learn, share some (NON-"tactical") magazines or books with him and discuss them with him later, point him in the direction of qualified professional instructors. If he doesn't show the stick-with-itness to do some of that on his own, I doubt he's ready to handle a firearm. If, at the age of 24, he's not prepared to take that much responsibilty, well... screw him. He'll likely move on to tuner cars or fancy stereos or some other fantasy and do nothing with that, either.

Sorry to sound like a cranky sonofagun, I just don't have much patience for scatterbrains.
 
I take a lot of guys "out shooting" many of them for the first time. One thing I say consistantly is that if you point a weapon at someone and pull the trigger that person may die. it makes no difference if it was on purpose or not. Usually that brings sobriety to the group. No matter how experienced the group, we go through safety protocol etc. But one thing for beginners is it is much easier to monitor a long gun than a hand gun both for the user as well as those around him. it takes a lot more effort to swing a shotgun around than a 9" glock.
we mainly shoot clay pigeons with specified stations and once a guy feels comfortable we move to rifles or handguns. If I'm with a beginner with a hand gun, he's under direct supervision. If he / she's shooting, I do nothing, but watch.

One story, I took a girlfriend out to shoot and threw like the second pigeon, it was really windy that day. the pigeon broke as it came off and so came off the thrower a little funny, the wind caught it, and like a frisbee on a windy day, it came right back at us. I don't know what she was looking at, but the thing came back and hit her right in the face. Cut her forehead and home we went. she still stuck with me for a year or so after that, but she wasn't going shooting anymore.
 
I would take the guy out to the range and teach him the right way.
But I would not go it alone, I would bring a trusted and experienced friend who was also a shooter along....make it a threesome at the range.
That way one of us could keep an eye on the newbie at all times.
 
It's amazing how oblivious new shooters can be even AFTER the safety protocols are drummed into their heads. People think guns are movie props; they go bang and knock bad guy down, good guy gets shot at, never gets hit, never dies, durka durka.
I absloutely hate it when you've just finished telling someone to do or not to do something, and they look at you like you're being a penis, then do exactly the opposite. At this point, I smack them in the head and take the gun away. If they can't respect the magical powers a gun has to kill unintentionally, they have no business even THINKING about looking at a gun!

Little rant there. Point is, some people are just not capable of the thought proccesses needed to safely handle a firearm. They just don't get it and never will. So keep an eye on anyone shooting with you. If someone repeatedly forgets the same safety protocol, they're a lost cause. Stay away if you value your ass!
 
I used to be a member of a gun club and we were allowed to bring in visitors. This would be a good start for a newbie as they are under constant supervision by the membership.

The other bennefit was that the visitors could get a chance to shoot different guns. Most of them enjoyed shooting .22 handguns and would start there before moving on to larger center fire, and bigger cals on the rifle range.

It was a good way to introduce newbies to the sport of firearms and some would even join the club.
 
Thanks again to everyone for all the great advice and ideas.

Jamesh Bond said:
It's amazing how oblivious new shooters can be even AFTER the safety protocols are drummed into their heads. People think guns are movie props; they go bang and knock bad guy down, good guy gets shot at, never gets hit, never dies, durka durka.
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JB, are you making a reference to the movie Team America: World Police there with the 'durka durka?' I perceived that as such, and laughed right out loud!

Today's update: Upon arrival, the person in question with whom I work with headed straight to my office before he even took off his jacket. He handed me a GUNS magazine and stated that he and his dad spent 2.5 hours at Barnes and Nobles looking at gun magazines last night. "All sorts of cool stuff in this issue; Sigs, Glocks, Smiths... Cool stuff." I told him that the Shooters Shop in Racine offered professional instruction at all levels for $20/hour. He said, "Yeah. (The gun store/range near work here) also gives lessons. I guess the guy is on the City PD. I'd probably do that."

So at first I thought he was a total lost cause, but that last comment "I'd probably do that," leads me to believe there is hope for him yet. And a funny thing, the GUNS magazine he left for me to look at had a good article about training/practicing with Soft Air and Pellet guns. Hmmm... I gave the issue back to him and marked the page where that article started.
 
Hikeeba,
Like the TA:WP terrorists, I find Durka a good language to use when stating nosensical jibberish. :)

Sounds like your guy has the willingness to learn as well as enthusiasm. You could invite him to handle your unloaded guns to let him familiarize himself with them, and to see if he obseves muzzle awareness. People who practice the rules even with unloaded weapons are definitely going to be safety conscious with loaded ones. Just something to consider. If you decide to take him shooting, drum the protocols into his head weeks before.

Whatever you do, have fun and stay safe!
 
Like someone else mentioned, start with airsoft/ pellet gun. When we were kinds, me and my cousins weren't allowed to touch a gun until we've proven that we are responsible enough with pellet guns.
 
Hooray! My co-worker signed up for a 4-hour class at the range/shop just down the road from our building. $60 includes instruction, ammo, range time, and an opportunity to try different handguns. Today he has gone from 125% enthusiasm/.125% willingness to learn to id say about a 60/40 ratio. I am proud of him. Oh, and he says he is now leaning more towards a Glock in 9mm rather than a 40 mm HK :) .
 
hikeeba said:
Hooray! My co-worker signed up for a 4-hour class at the range/shop just down the road from our building. $60 includes instruction, ammo, range time, and an opportunity to try different handguns. Today he has gone from 125% enthusiasm/.125% willingness to learn to id say about a 60/40 ratio. I am proud of him. Oh, and he says he is now leaning more towards a Glock in 9mm rather than a 40 mm HK :) .
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Hikeeba, this is great!
Now you have someone (and his dad) who is taking accountability for himself. and making his own decisions. It shouldn't fall to you.

I agree with some of the past posts, once he has taken his classes, and is at least aware of the safety and usage issues, then you can meet as "peers" and do some shooting.

You must feel a bit relieved not be put in that position, eh?
(Doc's "Canadianese" is rubbing off on me, eh?) :D

Good deal.
 
willowdog said:
I am a certified NRA Instructor in all the disciplines. As such, I am qualified to conduct a beginners class in firearms for such an individual. I would suggest you contact the NRA and find my counterpart (an NRA Instructor) in your area and have your friend enroll in a basic firearms course. This course has nothing to do with hunting and is a basic introduction to firearms.
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Indeed I agree with this and I am glad to hear he opted for a class. I work at a range and will be a certified NRA Instructor (for the pistol classes) in not too long myself. These classes cover all of the bases for safe, proper, and legal gun handling and are ideal for people who have had no prior experience.

If you do take him shooting, don't let him start with a 40mm...that might hurt ;)
 
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