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Randall 14 Vs Busse Sarsquatch
- Thread starter MARSUS
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that is a micrograph of the steel, and the "globular debris" as you call it and see is called Carbide, too big too ..
in practice, is a very bad example of hardening ..
Now, I try to repeat for the third time my question, always hoping
to speak with:
an expert metallurgist / mechanical engineer / or passionate
who has already had micrographic tests such as described above ..
What has changed in the 'steel' Infi "after the 2006/2007?
1 - composition?
2 - tempering?
3 - the type of oven used?
4 - the man in charge of tempering?
in practice, is a very bad example of hardening ..
Now, I try to repeat for the third time my question, always hoping
to speak with:
an expert metallurgist / mechanical engineer / or passionate
who has already had micrographic tests such as described above ..
What has changed in the 'steel' Infi "after the 2006/2007?
1 - composition?
2 - tempering?
3 - the type of oven used?
4 - the man in charge of tempering?
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2001
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- 18,959
Don't feed the troll...
dericdesmond
Gold Member
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- 15,466
F, none of the above.
Modern era They are not allowed to exceed a 6 pack before lunch :thumbup:
thanks for the answer
depending on what you are sure that nothing has changed?
You work for the production of Busse knives?
no owner has noticed a difference between the knives in the steel Infi
between 2006/2007 and models from those after these dates?
No one has noticed deterioration in the use?
Don't want to spam, but I am very very impressed about your post! Well said!
Mr.Mathieu85 Thanks for having understood the meaning of my questions ..
I have heard from owners of knives busse, who say the steel Infi
worsened after the year 2006/2007 ..
the questions are simple, but techniques ...
the problem is that only a technician can respond to questions asked ..
the questions are very simple .. and above all, the answers are useful for all
owners busse...
Jerry Busse
Moderator
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- 12,049
Amazingly, you are the only one who has heard these rumors. We have NEVER heard anything like this before. . . and I kinda think that we would be the first to know if any of this garbage were true.
You are the definition of a major troll. You have been here 7 days, you have 7 posts, all on this 2 year old thread, all of which attack our reputation with make believe hearsay.
You may not know how hard it is to build a reputation, although you have a really good start so far, but it takes little for it to be damaged by trolls like yourself.
You should be banned for major trolling.
Let's Drink! :thumbup:
Jerry
.
Liu Kang
BANNED
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- 6,936
And who have you heard this from? What proof have you heard? I know people from Italy and sell to them and have never heard anything bad about INFI. Exactly what is the problem with the INFI that you have heard about? It has a lifetime warranty!
Ankerson
Knife and Computer Geek
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- Nov 2, 2002
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- 21,094
Amazingly, you are the only one who has heard these rumors. We have NEVER heard anything like this before. . . and I kinda think that we would be the first to know if any of this garbage were true.
You are the definition of a major troll. You have been here 7 days, you have 7 posts, all on this 2 year old thread, all of which attack our reputation with make believe hearsay.
You may not know how hard it is to build a reputation, although you have a really good start so far, but it takes little for it to be damaged by trolls like yourself.
You should be banned for major trolling.
Let's Drink! :thumbup:
Jerry
.
Jerry,
You are correct.
Not one single thing wrong with INFI.
Keep up the excellent work.
Jim
Jerry, noone here wants to ruin your reputation. I'm sure that Gurzo has not intentions to start "flames". He is a very curious person and loves to study and understand everything involving knives and metallurgy.
I made the same questions to you through email some months ago and never got an answer. So it's not true that you never heard such a thing before, at least from ME you've heard that there was a rumour spreading in Italy about a decreased Infi performance in the last years (some say after 2004, others after 2006 etc...) in particular, some say that "older" INFI had a better edge retention than newer one.
Noone I know (not even Gurzo) talks bad about INFI, some just say that it changed.
I've owned a couple of dozens of your blades and every piece was made after 2007 and I can guarantee that the steel is the same. Same hardness, same edge retention, same stain resistance, same everything.
I knew that older Busse knives were tempered harder, for example the battle mistress was tempered 61hrc, so maybe the better edge retention came only from the higher hardness... Lower hardness means more thoughness, so maybe the edge lasts a little less but the blades are more durable. Who knows?
You wrote that nothing in composition or HT has changed in your knives and for me your word is enough.
Please, don't be upset with Gurzo, he is just questioning here to put an end to the rumors spreading in Italy, plus, the language is a problem so he can't write in the same respectful and kind way he usually writes in Italy.
Ale
I made the same questions to you through email some months ago and never got an answer. So it's not true that you never heard such a thing before, at least from ME you've heard that there was a rumour spreading in Italy about a decreased Infi performance in the last years (some say after 2004, others after 2006 etc...) in particular, some say that "older" INFI had a better edge retention than newer one.
Noone I know (not even Gurzo) talks bad about INFI, some just say that it changed.
I've owned a couple of dozens of your blades and every piece was made after 2007 and I can guarantee that the steel is the same. Same hardness, same edge retention, same stain resistance, same everything.
I knew that older Busse knives were tempered harder, for example the battle mistress was tempered 61hrc, so maybe the better edge retention came only from the higher hardness... Lower hardness means more thoughness, so maybe the edge lasts a little less but the blades are more durable. Who knows?
You wrote that nothing in composition or HT has changed in your knives and for me your word is enough.
Please, don't be upset with Gurzo, he is just questioning here to put an end to the rumors spreading in Italy, plus, the language is a problem so he can't write in the same respectful and kind way he usually writes in Italy.
Ale
You have more Busse knives than anyone I know of. Could you please post a list or send me one of the knives you currently have in your possession that you are willing to sell for $300 or less shipped (with no handling fees, finder fees or whatnot). I would be interested in buying some of your inventory.
Liu Kang
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Okay, I think I figured out what rumor was and how it was started. After exchanging a few email with my friend Alessandro (istarr88) I think I know what it is all about. Alessandro has never had an older Busse (pre 2004), he has only ever handled it but NEVER used it.
So it has been said by people that the older Busse are better, but that's only because the people who have the older Busse would like to think they have the best. But then again, everyone would like they think they own the best and it is worth the most. But no tests have ever been done. I have never see tests of the older stuff compared to the newer offerings.
They only thing that about the older Busse knives is that it is more likely to be hand made by Jerry Busse himself. There are much less made and because of that, the market prices is higher. This does not mean the older steel is any better/worse. Busse will warranty any Busse for life...
So the only thing you have to worry about is how to get your hands on a Busse being that there aren't that many in Italy. Jerry will warranty it for life so you don't have to worry about it not performing beyond your expectations. There are thousands of pictures, videos and documentaries out there that show the ability of what INFI can do. I am sure Jerry is using the very best steel he has ever used before and it is tested daily buy people who purchase them.
So it has been said by people that the older Busse are better, but that's only because the people who have the older Busse would like to think they have the best. But then again, everyone would like they think they own the best and it is worth the most. But no tests have ever been done. I have never see tests of the older stuff compared to the newer offerings.
They only thing that about the older Busse knives is that it is more likely to be hand made by Jerry Busse himself. There are much less made and because of that, the market prices is higher. This does not mean the older steel is any better/worse. Busse will warranty any Busse for life...
So the only thing you have to worry about is how to get your hands on a Busse being that there aren't that many in Italy. Jerry will warranty it for life so you don't have to worry about it not performing beyond your expectations. There are thousands of pictures, videos and documentaries out there that show the ability of what INFI can do. I am sure Jerry is using the very best steel he has ever used before and it is tested daily buy people who purchase them.
Ankerson
Knife and Computer Geek
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2002
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- 21,094
Maybe back when Jerry was making one knife at a time in his small shop, but then he was using A2 way back then....
But then the Phrase Two Weeks would take on a whole new meaning if he was still doing them by hand like that today.
But then the Phrase Two Weeks would take on a whole new meaning if he was still doing them by hand like that today.
Jerry Busse
Moderator
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- Aug 20, 1999
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- 12,049
Ale,
I can't find the email that you sent. Sorry about that. It either got lost or I somehow missed it.
I also apologize for railing against Gurzo now that you have explained his intentions.
I really don't know anything about these rumors in Italy but I can assure you that they are only rumors.
Our performance has remained the same throughout the years.
On a related note, we have been experimenting with a new heat treating procedure for INFI that promises to deliver a considerable increase in cutting performance. At this time, however, it is still in the experimental stage.
Again, I apologize if I came on a bit strong. Gurzo's post just struck me as very troll-like at first glance.
I believe that Dan and the others have answered quite well and hope that the info they have provided will help to calm the rumors.
Thanks,
Jerry
.
@komondor
As Liu Kang wrote, there can be many reasons for possessors of older Busse knives to say such a thing. One above all could be the market value of their pieces but I'm pretty sure that the main reason si that some older Busse were tempered harder (61 hrc) and it's the normality for a steel to have a better edge retention if the hardness is higher. On the other hand, higher hardness means a bit less thoughness of course...
@Jerry
Thanks for the reply. It clears everything. As said before, your word is enough to me.
In my experience, Infi is one of the more sharpenable (I mean maximum sharpness achievable after an accurate sharpening process) steels around as it is, so I can't wait to see what improvements will do!
Don't worry about the lost email, I understand.
Keep up the good work!
Thanks for everything,
Ale
As Liu Kang wrote, there can be many reasons for possessors of older Busse knives to say such a thing. One above all could be the market value of their pieces but I'm pretty sure that the main reason si that some older Busse were tempered harder (61 hrc) and it's the normality for a steel to have a better edge retention if the hardness is higher. On the other hand, higher hardness means a bit less thoughness of course...
@Jerry
Thanks for the reply. It clears everything. As said before, your word is enough to me.
In my experience, Infi is one of the more sharpenable (I mean maximum sharpness achievable after an accurate sharpening process) steels around as it is, so I can't wait to see what improvements will do!
Don't worry about the lost email, I understand.
Keep up the good work!
Thanks for everything,
Ale
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