[Re titled] Designing 2 custom Bowie's to be built

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As far as production knives go, Al Mar has put out some beautiful bowies over the years. Arizona Custom Knives has a couple available, I think.
 
Coke said:
I had a look at them.

That Gerber is the best fighting knife around? You can't be serious? Cold Steel's 3V dagger would slice that thing in half and then you'd be left with what's known as 2 Goobers. It's obvious you're suffering from the Dunning-Kruger effect. Have you heard of that? Have a look in your dictionary.

The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias wherein unskilled individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly assessing their ability to be much higher than is accurate. This bias is attributed to a meta-cognitive inability of the unskilled to recognize their ineptitude.

But it seems that I'm suffering from it too, because the same effect can take place "conversely", whereby it's defined in medical journals that the same effect can take place in some highly skilled individuals who tend to underestimate their relative competence, erroneously assuming that tasks that are easy for them are also easy for others.

So I'll try to think of easier ways of putting things in future instead of presenting a more analytical approach to any given situation than you're capable of comprehending. I didn't mean it at the time, I just wasn't thinking about it.

So a point of order on your interminable gabble: Some of us breath oxygen, and we find the mephitic fumes of your oratory a lethal challenge to our pulmonary capacities.

Now there's a swag of words you can go and look up in your dictionary.

"Ready please Mr Music." :D
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Nice one.
Too many smart people around here are going to ruin the place.;)
 
Which Brend handle :confused:

brancron, I agree with you... mar has made one bowie that I've seen that was not a large bowie, but it was one of the best looking bowie profiles that I've ever seen. It was sensational.

I've also tried to find one of these to no avail yet... it's an exceptional mass produced bowie in my view, discontinued, it seems some knifemakers just don't need to sell too many knives :D:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9vRzsCW1CY
 
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Coke said:
You're welcome Aias. It's refreshing to see some users herein can actually comprehend some fundamental applied Physics that I present in layman's terms.

I am quite taken by the IQ level of some herein... it's a worry. LOL
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Comprehended and tested! Results were pretty dead on! So, holding a ruler in a fencing-type grip, the tip of my thumb just reaches the 4.5" mark. Which would bring me into the sphere of a 9" blade comfort zone... that is just about where my gunfighter bowie maxes out. I can control it pretty well--but--the balance is a little different on it than, say, my custom Busse TGLB (pic below). It has a shorter blade (not my much), but the balance is more neutral; the gunfighter is balanced for chopping when my hand is fully back not the handle, and the blade is faster when I hold it with my finger in the forward choil. Center of mass indeed.

I've done some slashing tests with them for kicks at various times; I hang a milk gallon full of water off a hook in my yard. There the jug is attached to the hook by a bungee cord... so free hanging, and the jug w/ water has some give... thus sharpness, geometry, and the angle of the slash will matter. Both knives mentioned had the desired effects... the TGLB being faster, but the geometry on the Gunfighter being better.

Faster than both, with excellent geometry was my RMK #16 SP1... a true dedicated fighter. While I considered it a little short for my taste (and thanks to Coke, I get why), it performs exactly as it should.

Thanks for the info again... much appreciated. Besides being a knife-nut, I practice martial arts (including sword training), and have a couple masters degrees and a PhD to boot. Not in Physics... but I once studied to be an engineer. Now I'm an authority on how and why people kill each other en masse for ideas...

The pics:

10qx5xt.jpg


2usig4g.jpg

wvy0aw.jpg
 
I'm a bit long winded but... Its good for a giggle.

[video=youtube;qJNKPRp3K7w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJNKPRp3K7w[/video]
 
Damn CM, I know you heard it before... but you've got some sweet blades man. The Vigo portrait is classic, BTW. :thumbup:
 
Cheers Aias.

Glad you like it, it's elementary stuff that is not seen by most, which is always the case. lol
 
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Whatever fits your style of fighting.

Generally something fast in your hand. Pure fighting Bowie has back cut sharpened edge even if its only the tip. I don't own one.
Find one that you trust the maker and fits you and your style. For this kind of thing its the trust in the maker that is just as important as anything else.
Don't turn up at a gunfight with one.

Here is my hunting/fighting knife. Its very light weight for its size in the hand, and made so it won't break. Loads of makers can make a good one, there is no "best" as they don't have to do much but survive one fight at a time. Mine is for Australian Razerback pig sticking:
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Excellent ^ point. Beyond that, my needs are dictated by comfort in EDC and state law (no double edge or concealed carry). As much as I'd love to carry my larger Patton recurve damascus fighter, it would hang up on stuff while seated and driving.
 
The Steve Fillicietti is and even more so in the hand. Unfortunately the maker for all his talent (1990's) then had health issues, and let a few good people down. His names dirt among many in the knife world. His damascus work was exceptional and all his blades were meant to work at what they were designed for. Think he encouraged a few others to do similar big blades again.
There are plenty of custom makers who can do this kind of work, just depends on what you want to pay. You pay for the expertise, craftsmanship, and reputation.
Most factory play safe and build on the heavy side. A Cold Steel SRK would do.

My advice is go as thin as you dare and bend before snap. If you want to chop logs then thats a different knife. It really doesn't take much knife to be lethal. The edge is to slash, less lethal; and the point to make holes, more lethal. The Bowie was meant to counter swords and once parried and past do the biz. No swords today, so no need for the scale or weight.
One reason for the "big" knife is its presence. To stop a fight before it started by their "fck that" lets not go there. Same reason a Cop draws his weapon: not to use but to stop the fight before it kicks off.
If you have no martial art training, high level, then its all bluff. A hatchet would do as no one wants to be hit by one of those.
Big subject.
 
Ballpeen hammer.
 
That will do and call it Bowie, as in David. Beats a baseball bat with barbed wire, The Walking Dead type! Whats that called?
 
gadunz said:
A victim, soon to be a corpse? You haven't mentioned hiking or hunting, so presumably not for bear/puma defence.
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Not sure what you're trying to say? That I'm going to kill someone just because I want to buy a nice Bowie knife? I want to buy the "best" or a very nice one to fully understand how the knife was supposed to feel, move etc. I've never had a proper Bowie and thought I would ask for suggestions so I could buy a nice one.

BladeScout said:
The construction of the knives in question works just fine for the intended purpose of the blades.
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I'm sure it does, they still disgust me.
 
Coke said:
Bacon,

9" blade is about an inch too long to allow one to move it as fast as they can when they have no knife in their hand at all. It's got to do with pivot points and fulcrum distances needed in establishing the right amount, or at least NOT exceeding the right amount, of torque needed by a man's hand and arm to move an object they're holding within it, almost as fast as they can move their bare hand.

If you hold a ruler in your hand, grasp it as you would a knife, and measure the distance that your hand covers the ruler, then you'll know what the best length of FULL TANG knife is for you, with tapered tang, that distance shortens, contrary to popular (mis)belief.

On average, that grasping distance is about 3 & 3/4", mine is a tad over 4". The way the maths works if you want to have a knife that is an EXTENSION of your arm, ie, the center of mass of the knife REMAINS in the clasp of your hand and doesn't extend PAST or beyond your hand, is that the maximum length of blade of a solidly built FULL TANG FLAT GROUND knife (say 1/4" stock or near that) should NOT exceed TWICE the measured clasping distance beyond the hand. If the knife is a full convex grind, then that distance decreases a little, and if hollow ground, it increases a smidgen. So if you have a grasping distance on the handle of let's say 3.75", then with a FULL TANG, you don't want to exceed a blade length of 7.5". With a tapered tang in the same hand, that distance is less because the COMass of a TTang knife extends further up the front of a knife of equivalent length. So the position of the COM of a tapered tang that is the same total length of the right sized full tang knife places more mass or weight BEYOND your hand, which then means that you have a "non-releasing slingshot" effect going on with the tip of the knife when you move the knife in your hand. The extra mass outside your grasp means it will take MORE effort/strength to pull up such a knife and change its direction than it would a full tang of the same length. Sure, the balance or pivot point of a tapered tang is often closer to the ricasso than an equivalent full tang, but that's only good if you intend on using the knife as a THROWER. A fighter is not a throwing knife. Sorry to all those who have been telling others that a tapered tang gives you better balance whilst implying that such balance is what one should seek in a fighter. Nothing could be further from the truth, the balance, or COM of a fighter is needed IN THE HAND, not on the edge of it nor on the outside of it. This is why so many makers produce seemingly long handles with respect to the blades lengths even with relatively short knives, because the longer handle helps in keeping the COM of the knife IN YOUR GRASP. It pulls the pivot point of the knife further BACK, not forward like a TTAng does. IOW, it gives the knife "MORE BRAKES" in your hand.

That's why I would NEVER go for a Tapered tang fighter... it defeats the purpose of the knife. Even when you're just holding a TTang in your hand you can feel the missing mass from within your hand... like a part of the knife is missing. That's your instinct talking to you... feel your instinct, it's there for a purpose.

So for big hands, I'd suggest a 7.5-8" blade length in full tang (ie, total length of 4.5" + 8"= 12.5"), for average sized hands, 7-7.25inch, and small blokes with small hands, 7-6.5". But if you have hands like Adam Vigil, then you can go up to a 9"" blade length. I know because I've approximated his grasping distance from all the pics he posts, and its a solid hand, not a slim fingered hand, he has a distance of at least 4.5", so a hand like that can go 8.5-9" in full tang, and the knife would still work like an extension of the hand, not like a protrusion, the balance would be in check and where it belongs.

As for the best mass produced fighter; if you're a big bloke, I can't see how you could go past and Attack 14 with single finger grip. Get one of those in your hand, and you'll fast know what I mean; they're not a small knife and they're heavy, solidly built. If you're a smaller bloke, you should go NO more than a 7.5" full tang or 6.5-7" tapered-tang or reduced tang. I would then consider a SFGrip Model 1-7 or 1-6.5. That would fit a smaller hand like a glove, the holder could move almost as if it weren't even there.

As for custom knives, work out your blade length, pick the blade material, blade profile and your knifemaker... and go for your life.
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Fantastic write up. Thank you, Coke!

Btw, you from Australia too mate?
 
Gaston444 said:
This is the dictionary definition of: gob·ble·dy·gook.

NOUN
1.
informal

language that is meaningless or is made unintelligible by excessive use of abstruse technical terms; nonsense.

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If you want the best fighting knife, get one the anniversary or limited editions Gerber Mark IIs.

70th and 2002 Specials are very good, but the cat's tongue grip of the 70th (and others) is really a plus.

The reason you want the Gerber specials is that they are better made and have a sharper point geometry than regular runs. Avoid Mark IIs with rounded looking points, which includes most of the very old ones...

The reason you want the Gerber Mark II is that it is usually near zero-ground, which is unique among factory daggers, and this makes them sharper than most plucky single edge knives...

Yes it is too short at 6.9", but everything else meant for fighting is duller, and duller pointed, so do you want duller or sharper?

Gaston
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Keep your opinion to yourself because no one wants to hear it buddy.
 
Just read all the posts here. Thanks everyone for the input I really appreciate it. For a long time I was thinking "bigger is better" as long as I could keep the balance point in the handle (using thicker stock and flat ground blades) but I will do as Coke said and try the ruler method and see how it goes. I'll mock a few up out of cardboard and see what I like and likely go with a custom maker unless there is a extremely close production of want I end up wanting.

Thanks again.

Cheers.
 
Anyone who has an interest in swords doesn't automatically mean they are going to ever use one for real. Bowies come is many forms, just like Kukuris. Therefore you need to find one that you like, feels right for you, just like.

Think we are big boys here and can manage a discussion.

Two bowies can look similar but feel completely different. Its all very personal.
 
Alright. I'm going to toss out the Becker BK9 and Ontario SP10 as options, simply because nobody's mentioned them yet, and they fulfill a great deal of the requirements listed.

Also, you simply can't have a pure fighting knife discussion without at least one person bringing up shivs, since they really have no other purpose.
 
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