Remember when "lock stick" was a good thing?

Aias · Feb 18, 2017

Lapedog said:
I really don't mind abit of stickiness in the lock. Some of those older cold steel models had super stiff locks, like when the spartan first came out. In truth though doesn't lock stick in frame and liner lock designs (galling) cause accelerated wear? I would think the metal surfaces galling like that would scrape away the titanium on the lock face way faster than some designs where the lock holds the tang well in place but doesn't stick. On some knives with no stick the lock seems very robust and some seem more questionable.

Now on some knives like some of my Emersons there was lock stick at first until the bar wore to a point it now locks and unlocks smoothly but still has amazing lockup. I am not sire if lock stick will typically lead to wearing into such a perfect lockup or it was a lucky fluke but I theorize it might. As the lock face galls and wears away it gets to a point where the titanium has been work hardened and smoothed just to the point where lockstick stops and it now sits snugly against the tang. Maybe...or....maybe not....

It atleast seems to do that sometimes.

Now in some

Good post... more like this!

FlaMtnBkr · Feb 18, 2017

Sal has said that the Spyder hole is 'crisp' on purpose because it's been found that it grabs whatever you are sticking in the hole better and provides a more secure opening method. So a somewhat 'sharp' edge on the hole is done on purpose and isn't some sort of drop in fit and finish or quality control. It's how Spyderco has designed their opening method that is meant to function well first and look pretty second. Or third or fourth or not at all since beauty is in the eye of the beholder and many will find Spyderco knives ugly no matter what they do to them.

Another company made a few models with a hole in the blade that they put a 45* chamfer around the hole so it wouldn't be 'sharp' and would look more refined and finished or 'pretty'. A fairly common complaint on the forums was that they were harder to open than the Spyderco version with the sharp edge, and that it didn't grab the finger as well and tended to slip occasionally.

The only time that my fingernail comes into contact with a Spyder hole is when I am flicking the knife open, similar to the way kids used to shoot marbles. Usually just the pad or 'meat' at the end of my thumb is pressed down and into the hole and the blade is then slowly rotated out and open. Maybe try opening a knife in this manner instead of flicking it open if you are having issues with the metal scraping your nail. That or drink more milk and take your gummy or dinosaur vitamins every day.

RevDevil · Feb 18, 2017

I prefer the lock to stick rather than slip. I cannot stand and will not buy knives with poorly made lockbars and bad lock face geometry. With all the technology and machinery involved in knifemaking today, it shouldn't even be a problem any more. Lockbars that slide all the way to the opposite side or that require a screwdriver to unlock are unacceptable.

Lapedog · Feb 18, 2017

Unlike lockstick no one would argue lockslip is a good thing.

craytab · Feb 18, 2017

Jamesh Bond said:
Ironic, isn't it?

Every single person who got hung up on the joking inadvertently became exactly what the jokes were about.

(another thing that really annoys me is having to spell obvious things out)

Here's the deal:

-This is MY thread. That I created. With MY topic in mind.

-I created MY thread to vent some tongue in cheek annoyance, and allow others to do the same. That is not negativity. That is MY chosen topic.

-Anyone who came into MY thread to tell me what's wrong with it not only missed the point of MY thread, but cluttered it up with crap I don't want in it. That is bad form and makes you look petty.

Yet, while you you were insulting my morals and manners, YOU were butting into a conversation not suited to you. YOU were being rude by doing so. Understand?? I hope so, since that is Basic Manners 101.

Doing this also makes you look illiterate since I actually WROTE INSTRUCTIONS for avoiding this in my OP.

*Facepalm*
Wow.

To spell it out blatantly:
If anyone else wants to post in my thread that I created without looking like a douche, post about a knife trend that annoys you (at your own risk of course).

THAT IS THE PURPOSE OF MY THREAD.

THAT I CREATED.

Dear God, I guess I actually have to say this next part out loud:

IF YOU DON'T LIKE WHAT IS IN MY THREAD, THEN DON'T POST IN IT.

Especially when my OP (and what I just wrote here) expressly asked you not to!

That is also Basic Manners 101.

Wow. Jesus.

As many have said, this got way out of hand. The fun is over. Well technically the fun never actually started since it was cut off by offended and smart assed people who would rather attempt to "school" a random Internet stranger than have some simple fun.

Guys, if you take the Internet THAT seriously, then I would suggest staying away from the Internet.

I clearly had my expectations set too high here.

That one was my bad, for sure.

I'm most likely done with this one. I usually come here to learn or solve problems, and avoid the "discussions." This was a stark reminder why.

The old my thread argument. I think you will find that rarely works. And look at your posts. Most are a jab at one sort of knife enthusiasts or another. Expecting to not catch some flak from those you have insulted would make this a very dull discussion forum.

I agree with you for the most part, except when you made fun of deep carry clips, I like those so piss off

, but I also won't look down on others for how the want to participate in this hobby.

I've only had major lock stick on two knives. A 0560blk and the infamous K2. Both of which were solved by taking the knives apart (unrelated to the lock stick) and reassembled. Sometimes things just don't sit well and need a minor adjustment. I don't consider lock stick a feature.

KELAMA · Feb 18, 2017

Jamesh Bond said:
I see so much complaining about sticky locks and I guess I don't get it.

I remember first reading about the new Walker LinerLock in the 90's. One of the many benefits touted was the fact that titanium galls to other metals.

In other words, it made the lock stick open better. Which was a GOOD thing back then.

Now, like anything else in this hobby, we've found a new thing to make into a THING. Then we made it trendy.

Personally, all these trends annoy me. But I have an especially hard time trying to stay open minded to someone complaining :

"My lock is hard to close!"

Whut? Isn't that the POINT?

"But it hurts my thumbs."

Really? Don't be a wussy, then.

I don't think myself especially strong. In fact, I'm pretty much a weenie. But I've had ZERO problem disengaging the stickiest or stiffest of the culprits Im always hearing about. Compression, Triad, titanium liner, titanium frame. . .

I just use the right application of leverage, and there we go. Some of the stiffest have given me a welt. But that's when I'm using it as a toy to play with instead of cutting stuff with it. And I still can't grasp why that's a problem.

Anyway, I'm just as guilty of getting hung up on dumb things as the rest.

But dang, unless you have arthritis or are a 7 year old girl, this one I just can't accept.

What are your thoughts on this and other goofy trends that seem to make or break people's opinion of their knife?

And the fact that many people don't have a thought on the matter until they read about it?

Answers such as "Well if you don't like it then blah blah" need not apply here.

I'm interested in reading some real opinions here.

There was mine.

Thanx.

^ This has to be one of the most enjoyable OP's I've had the pleasure of reading here on BF's. :thumbup: BladeForums has made me even more biased and jaded regarding this subject; regardless- you pretty much nailed both the internet/millennial generations in a nutshell, JB!

As for my opinion, I would be willing to bet that a solid 50+% of the people on this forum, never actually use a knife out in the field. They may use them in the kitchen, helping their mom or significant other spread frosting on birthday cakes, but not outside.

Regarding lockstick: I've purchased several knives from member's on this forum where this so called issue wasn't disclosed. I never mentioned a word to the seller, because it really didn't bother me.

DeadboxHero said:
It breaks in nicely though, most guys never gave that knife a chance

^ +1 < Because they more often than not, they never even removed the knife from it's box.

Lycosa said:
We have become a bunch of wimp whiners.
Just use the freekin knife!!
rolf

^ Please Rolf- don't include me in with this bunch!

I grew up on a ranch, riding bulls, eating mountain oysters cooked right on top of a cut out 30 gallon barrel used to heat up the branding irons, with some of the toughest hard working Salinas Valley cowboys, served my country at a time when we didn't have all of this BS military PC put in place. I could go on & on... If John Steinbeck were still alive, he'd probably be writing a new book: Of Mice And _____ (for fear of not being PC & offending anyone- please fill in the blank).

While this video maybe a bit of an exaggeration, this Owen guy is pretty much like a lot of the younger generation I see out in the World today...except for the fact that they always seem to be holding a phone typing away, or taking selfie pictures of themselves while they're twirling around.
EDIT: Another thing that disgusts me, is the fact that much of our population, is becoming hooked on pharmaceutical medication to help them cope and make it through a freaking simple day. The Vet's coming home from Iraq and Afghanistan, went through hell...while these types do nothing but complain and protest the World around them...and need anxiety medication to help take off the edge of living everyday life. WTF!!! :sorrow:

I don't think I even want to be around in 20 years. It will be like some horror Sci-Fi movie where Doctor's are delivering male babies born without testicles...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGoBlI_fdg

Jamesh Bond said:
But there are just too many people whining for me to believe that the knives are the problem.

Geez, grow a set already lol!

^ Dream on! It ain't gonna happen!

FWIW: Knives aren't the problem! If BladeForums weren't around, these non knife types would find another forum to troll on (probably a clothing forum).

Jamesh Bond said:
Actually, speaking as a Millennial, that statement is PURE fact. Men are not men anymore.

I saw the Spyderco hole thread too, and was reminded for the gazillionth time that I am ashamed to be associated with the same group as the complete wimps that are taking over our country.

There are no words.

^ Key word: "Some"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGoBlI_fdg

austonh said:
This could have been an excellent discussion regarding the positive merits of lockstick vs today's aversion to it. Sadly it's already derailed with comments like "wussies, ladies, wimps, hipsters, real men, etc..."

The subliminal chest thumping just leads to name calling, hurt feelings and closed threads instead of worthwhile discussion... alas this is the internet.

^ Unfortunately, yes, this is the age of the internet. Thanks for the reminder- I need to turn this computer off and get outside in the real World. Thank you! :thumbup:

aleforme said:
I think that was the point of the original posts. His words seemed to encourage this type of thread. It's not directed at any one member so no harm. It's all good fun and lighthearted.

^ +1 This is one of the best 2 pages I've read in quite sometime. I don't really feel a need to read any further past this post... VVV I can already see what's waiting below. :yawn:

Thanks for the fun thread, Jamesh Bond! :thumbup: :thumbup:

KBA · Feb 18, 2017

GasMan1 said:
Brett, I agree as well. But be careful, you may "offend" someone with all that talk about soft hands and sharp spyderco holes. :grumpy:

Understood my friend. I forget to be as sensitive as I need when, when my opinion is not needed or helpful, and to turn off my ipad and walk away. No offense taken.

Someone mentioned the registered users here. I doubt a 10th of those are active.

I have also seen a lot of great folks and knowledgeable people run off bc/ the forum has become a picture show followed by, "great/beatuful knife." Then some knives dont even make practical sense as cutters withtheir grinds, ergos, and blade thickness. In some sub-forums you can read page after page of just pictures and "beautiful knife" Then heaven help the person who buys a nice knife to be a safe queen like an Ebony inlayed Sebenza. He will be hounded to death to use it. It gets old, but is tolerable. What is worse is microscope on such, imo, unimportant issues. Yes, to some those issues are important, I get it. Maybe this needs to be in the GBU as a side topic: I dont care enough to start it.

I stick to my first post and will just keep silent from here out while going with the status que.

Maybe someone can post some pics of lock stick and some without so other can see, an have the opportunity to say, "beautiful knife."

craytab · Feb 18, 2017

KELAMA said:
^ This has to be one of the most enjoyable OP's I've had the pleasure of reading here on BF's. :thumbup: BladeForums has made me even more biased and jaded regarding this subject; regardless- you pretty much nailed both the internet/millennial generations in a nutshell, JB!

As for my opinion, I would be willing to bet that a solid 50+% of the people on this forum, never actually use a knife out in the field. They may use them in the kitchen, helping their mom or significant other spread frosting on birthday cakes, but not outside.

Regarding lockstick: I've purchased several knives member's on this forum where this so called issue wasn't disclosed. I never mentioned a word to the seller, because it really didn't bother me.

^ +1 < Because they more often than not, they most likely never even removed the knife from it's box.

^ Please Rolf- don't include me in with this bunch! I grew up on a ranch, riding bulls, eating mountain oysters cooked right on top of a cut out 30 gallon barrel used to heat up the branding irons, with some of the toughest hard working Salinas Valley cowboys, served my country at a time when we didn't have all of this BS military PC put in place. I could go on & on... If John Steinbeck were still alive, he'd probably be writing a new book: Of Mice And _____ (for fear of not being PC & offending anyone- please fill in the blank).

While this video maybe a bit of an exaggeration, this Owen guy is pretty much like a lot of the younger generation I see out in the World today...except for the fact that they always seem to be holding a phone typing away, or taking selfie pictures of themselves while they're twirling around. I don't think I even want to be around in 20 years. It will be like some horror Sci-Fi movie where Doctor's are delivering male babies born without testicles...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGoBlI_fdg

^ Dream on! It ain't gonna happen! FWIW: Knives aren't the problem! If BladeForums weren't around, these non knife types would find another forum to troll on (probably a clothing forum).

^ X1000
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGoBlI_fdg

^ Unfortunately, yes, this is the age of the internet. Thanks for the reminder- I need to turn this computer off and get outside in the real World. Thank you! :thumbup:

^ +1 This is one of the best 2 pages I've read in quite sometime. I don't really feel a need to read any further past this post... VVV I can already see what's waiting below. :yawn:

Thanks for the fun thread, Jamesh Bond! :thumbup: :thumbup:

:thumbup:

ourgon · Feb 18, 2017

KELAMA · Feb 18, 2017

RevDevil said:
I prefer the lock to stick rather than slip. I cannot stand and will not buy knives with poorly made lockbars and bad lock face geometry. With all the technology and machinery involved in knifemaking today, it shouldn't even be a problem any more. Lockbars that slide all the way to the opposite side or that require a screwdriver to unlock are unacceptable.

^ We'll I'm glad the web browser directed me here to the last page...alas, a very intelligent comment. :thumbup:

I agree- I rarely see any newer production knives with lock stick anymore. Heck, even Strider Knives seems to have corrected this constant complaint/criticism.

Jamesh Bond · Feb 18, 2017

craytab said:
The old my thread argument. I think you will find that rarely works. And look at your posts. Most are a jab at one sort of knife enthusiasts or another. Expecting to not catch some flak from those you have insulted would make this a very dull discussion forum.

I agree with you for the most part, except when you made fun of deep carry clips, I like those so piss off , but I also won't look down on others for how the want to participate in this hobby.

I've only had major lock stick on two knives. A 0560blk and the infamous K2. Both of which were solved by taking the knives apart (unrelated to the lock stick) and reassembled. Sometimes things just don't sit well and need a minor adjustment. I don't consider lock stick a feature.

All good points.

To explain (cuz I respect you and your intelligently presented discussions), It was the missing of the point that chapped my ass.

I've been around long enough to know about the my thread argument. That was purely to drive home the fact that people were attempting to change the actual topic of the thread. That practice is universally frowned upon here. It's called a "derail."
☺

And yeah, I do take jabs. But they are not jabs at the enthusiasts. They are jabs at poorly placed, misguided enthusiasm.

Onto your finer points, I think you summed up a very good one overall. One that underlies the entire theme here at BF: you can't please everyone. That is one reason I like posts of modifications so much.

The ability to make a knife your own, based on your preferences, is fun and useful. And makes for good pictures too!

In fact, the LACK of that ability is one thing that prompted me to whine about the whiners. If the lock sticks too much for you, figure out a way to make it smoother. That's why the forum is here. If the knife is truly too stuck to be useful, then that is an ENTIRELY different thing. But if you can't figure out how to file a hole smoother, loosen a pivot, or sand a liner, then don't blame the knife.

This is a hobby. By nature of being here, I am just as much of a dork as people posting about their train collections, or anyone else I appear to dog on.

Which drives home the most important lesson in life, as well as the ONE, SINGLE reason this thread went south:

Never take yourself too seriously.
😉

Jamesh Bond · Feb 18, 2017

KELAMA said:
^ This has to be one of the most enjoyable OP's I've had the pleasure of reading here on BF's. [emoji106] BladeForums has made me even more biased and jaded regarding this subject; regardless- you pretty much nailed both the internet/millennial generations in a nutshell, JB!

As for my opinion, I would be willing to bet that a solid 50+% of the people on this forum, never actually use a knife out in the field. They may use them in the kitchen, helping their mom or significant other spread frosting on birthday cakes, but not outside.

Regarding lockstick: I've purchased several knives member's on this forum where this so called issue wasn't disclosed. I never mentioned a word to the seller, because it really didn't bother me.

^ +1 < Because they more often than not, they most likely never even removed the knife from it's box.

^ Please Rolf- don't include me in with this bunch! I grew up on a ranch, riding bulls, eating mountain oysters cooked right on top of a cut out 30 gallon barrel used to heat up the branding irons, with some of the toughest hard working Salinas Valley cowboys, served my country at a time when we didn't have all of this BS military PC put in place. I could go on & on... If John Steinbeck were still alive, he'd probably be writing a new book: Of Mice And _____ (for fear of not being PC & offending anyone- please fill in the blank).

While this video maybe a bit of an exaggeration, this Owen guy is pretty much like a lot of the younger generation I see out in the World today...except for the fact that they always seem to be holding a phone typing away, or taking selfie pictures of themselves while they're twirling around. I don't think I even want to be around in 20 years. It will be like some horror Sci-Fi movie where Doctor's are delivering male babies born without testicles...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGoBlI_fdg

^ Dream on! It ain't gonna happen! FWIW: Knives aren't the problem! If BladeForums weren't around, these non knife types would find another forum to troll on (probably a clothing forum).

^ Key word: "Some"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGoBlI_fdg

^ Unfortunately, yes, this is the age of the internet. Thanks for the reminder- I need to turn this computer off and get outside in the real World. Thank you! [emoji106]

^ +1 This is one of the best 2 pages I've read in quite sometime. I don't really feel a need to read any further past this post... VVV I can already see what's waiting below. :yawn:

Thanks for the fun thread, Jamesh Bond! [emoji106] [emoji106]

Thanks back for participating along with the OP.

Exactly what I was after. Right there!

Lycosa · Feb 18, 2017

Best Post goes to KELAMA.
rolf

palonej · Feb 18, 2017

In regards to 'break in' being synonymous with bad design or bad manufacture, I disagree.
Any product that is macbined on an assembly line will need a break in. Stock, not custom.
New car and boat engines need break in. New guns, air and powder need break in. Parts will need to 'bed', or mesh in.
My most used tool at work is a pair of Klein electrical pliers. Excellent tool that costs upward of $50 that comes out of the package so tight you cannot operate them with one hand. It is crucial to be able to use them with one hand!
Little WD and sand in the joint and one day of open and closing, smooth as glass! I have a 15 year old pair that has been used almost every day that will last another 15.
Joe

jstrange · Feb 18, 2017

^
Good post!

Also, being that they will all break in to some degree, wouldn't a super smooth, not sticky, lock become more loose as it wears in? This might make it too loose, whereas a sticky lock eventually wears to become smooth. By that logic, which may be false, wouldn't you want a tool to come tight/sticky? Much like the gentleman's pliers in the above post.

stabman · Feb 18, 2017

Jamesh Bond said:
Ironic, isn't it?

Every single person who got hung up on the joking inadvertently became exactly what the jokes were about.

(another thing that really annoys me is having to spell obvious things out)

Here's the deal:

-This is MY thread. That I created. With MY topic in mind.

-I created MY thread to vent some tongue in cheek annoyance, and allow others to do the same. That is not negativity. That is MY chosen topic.

-Anyone who came into MY thread to tell me what's wrong with it not only missed the point of MY thread, but cluttered it up with crap I don't want in it. That is bad form and makes you look petty.

Yet, while you you were insulting my morals and manners, YOU were butting into a conversation not suited to you. YOU were being rude by doing so. Understand?? I hope so, since that is Basic Manners 101.

Doing this also makes you look illiterate since I actually WROTE INSTRUCTIONS for avoiding this in my OP.

*Facepalm*
Wow.

To spell it out blatantly:
If anyone else wants to post in my thread that I created without looking like a douche, post about a knife trend that annoys you (at your own risk of course).

THAT IS THE PURPOSE OF MY THREAD.

THAT I CREATED.

Dear God, I guess I actually have to say this next part out loud:

IF YOU DON'T LIKE WHAT IS IN MY THREAD, THEN DON'T POST IN IT.

Especially when my OP (and what I just wrote here) expressly asked you not to!

That is also Basic Manners 101.

Wow. Jesus.

As many have said, this got way out of hand. The fun is over. Well technically the fun never actually started since it was cut off by offended and smart assed people who would rather attempt to "school" a random Internet stranger than have some simple fun.

Guys, if you take the Internet THAT seriously, then I would suggest staying away from the Internet.

I clearly had my expectations set too high here.

That one was my bad, for sure.

I'm most likely done with this one. I usually come here to learn or solve problems, and avoid the "discussions." This was a stark reminder why.

Reads like an Emo post.

palonej · Feb 18, 2017

jstrange said:
^
Good post!

Also, being that they will all break in to some degree, wouldn't a super smooth, not sticky, lock become more loose as it wears in? This might make it too loose, whereas a sticky lock eventually wears to become smooth. By that logic, which may be false, wouldn't you want a tool to come tight/sticky? Much like the gentleman's pliers in the above post.

Exactly what I would think JS. It will wear to some degree, hence instead of wearing in it will loosen up.
Joe

chickenfried · Feb 18, 2017

I'm willing to deal with warts but I'm not going to pay a wart free premium price. Or listen to how the warts are a badge of honor and badass.

BenchCo Spydermade · Feb 18, 2017

Well for all the controversy, I thought this was a neat little thread topic. I don't like excessive lock stick that slows me closing the knife for that reason, it slows me down. At the same time, any knives I've had with stick usually lose it with use over time, so it wasn't a big deal.

As far as caring about lock stick indicating one being less manly, I disagree. As knife enthusiasts, we can be very critical and detail oriented, so I get people caring, especially with knives that cost hundreds of dollars. At the same time, I'm not gunna be the guy complaining about my widdle fingers either😎

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

FlaMtnBkr · Feb 18, 2017

chickenfried said:
I'm willing to deal with warts but I'm not going to pay a wart free premium price. Or listen to how the warts are a badge of honor and badass.

What?!?

I'm glad I'm married now and not having to date these days