Rike ripping off a Lundquist design

willc said:
Some of you guys really don’t understand that the Chinese don’t have a concept of IP.
That is their culture.
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While culturally it may indeed be the case that the Chinese have a rich tradition of imitation - they do, as it happens - the year is 2018 and China is big international power. It is faintly patronising, not to say to disingenuous to assert that they 'don't understand'. They understand perfectly: they choose to act in contravention of international conventions. The Chinese are well aware of the loathing and outrage that manufacturers in the rest of the world feel, due to their laissez-faire attitude towards IP theft. Knife manufacturers represent a tiny, tiny fraction of the aggrieved businesses, and this issue continues to be hammered out at the highest levels of diplomacy. The Chinese most certainly do understand the concept, let's just clear that one up.
 
salduchi said:
View attachment 995871

Blatantly and Maliciously...I see no evidence of malice. Therefore, since you use the word “and” it means you condone this. Did Lundquist or whatever his name is want the blade to come out the side? Which side? Did he intend for it to be an otf maybe? His drawing does not depict that. Did he intend it to be a necklace knife like Rike? Probably not. Did he intended to be a 3-4” inch blade? I dunno as their are no specs. Now, what if Asheville Steel comes around and says, screw both these jerkoffs as the the basic design idea originated with us? I’m just using this blade as an example I’m sure I can find others. Do you understand my point?
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Your point is rounded :P . Ignoring the fact that Justin's drawing DOES indicate that it's meant to side open, Justin said the blade profile is identical and the fuller is also identical dimensions (the real nail in the coffin IMO - when the small details match, it's not a coincidence).

Pilsner said:
While culturally it may indeed be the case that the Chinese have a rich tradition of imitation - they do, as it happens - the year is 2018 and China is big international power. It is faintly patronising, not to say to disingenuous to assert that they 'don't understand'. They understand perfectly: they choose to act in contravention of international conventions. The Chinese are well aware of the loathing and outrage that manufacturers in the rest of the world feel, due to their laissez-faire attitude towards IP theft. Knife manufacturers represent a tiny, tiny fraction of the aggrieved businesses, and this issue continues to be hammered out at the highest levels of diplomacy. The Chinese most certainly do understand the concept, let's just clear that one up.
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He's saying he same thing you are. He's saying, why don't we understand that the Chinese don't care about IP.
 
Dfunk1210 said:
But, there has always been an unspoken rule in the knife enthusiast world that designers will not blatantly and maliciously copy another.
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When big business gets involved, that’s a bad idea. Putting your future at the mercy of “unspoken rules” is very risky.

The knife making world is a mix of smaller individuals in a moral community, and international amoral organizations. Goldfish and sharks in the same tank.
 
When somebody talks about so-called “unspoken rules”, those “unspoken rules” are that one person's theoretical vision of the line(s) that everybody else should toe and how the world should work. GFL with that one.

As for the Chinese -- Alibaba and Aliexpress (the two global homes of counterfeits, copies, knockoffs and fakes) demonstrate with indisputable clarity how far the concepts of “unspoken rules” and IP go in Chinese business and culture. They even market counterfeits of the Chinese Panda series of gold and silver coins--the Chinese national series of gold and silver coins.
 
What's sad to me is that Rike can seemingly design and produce incredible pieces (like the Thor series) all on their own. But instead, they go copying designs like the Spyderco Tropen and now this.

It's been pointed out that this is totally above the board, legally speaking. Thankfully, we there's tons of other choices in the Chinese OEM market, and those like myself who aren't a fan of design theft can get something good from companies that don't seem to offer clones or steal IP (Kizer, Reate, WE, etc).
 
Right or wrong doesn't matter, but, it seems like they would pick up on the overall negative perception of their potential customers and modify their procedures.
 
Pilsner said:
While culturally it may indeed be the case that the Chinese have a rich tradition of imitation - they do, as it happens - the year is 2018 and China is big international power. It is faintly patronising, not to say to disingenuous to assert that they 'don't understand'. They understand perfectly: they choose to act in contravention of international conventions. The Chinese are well aware of the loathing and outrage that manufacturers in the rest of the world feel, due to their laissez-faire attitude towards IP theft. Knife manufacturers represent a tiny, tiny fraction of the aggrieved businesses, and this issue continues to be hammered out at the highest levels of diplomacy. The Chinese most certainly do understand the concept, let's just clear that one up.
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Well put, but I will go past patronizing to call it "bigoted."

Its not part of "their culture" any more than anything negative that happens in any country is.

It's a business practice. A slimy one that not be supported or excused in any way, in my opinion.

But saying "Oh, you know those people. That's how those Chinese are." is a gross generalization. I.e, bigotry.
 
marrenmiller said:
What's sad to me is that Rike can seemingly design and produce incredible pieces (like the Thor series) all on their own. But instead, they go copying designs like the Spyderco Tropen and now this.

It's been pointed out that this is totally above the board, legally speaking. Thankfully, we there's tons of other choices in the Chinese OEM market, and those like myself who aren't a fan of design theft can get something good from companies that don't seem to offer clones or steal IP (Kizer, Reate, WE, etc).
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Unfortunately it seems like alot of these companies are actually related in one way or another. They often get other factories to make certain designs for them. For example Kizer may not produce anything, instead they may outsource to 4 factories.

I recently found out WE knives has the same address as Wayeah Knives and Tool co. who has many clones in their line up. Do they just both rent factory space from the same address? Hard to tell...

There are so many rumors, I have heard there is some connection between Reate and Samier. Real Steel is owned by Sanrenmu who has clones in their line up.

They are all often connected. It seems like some of these brands have tried to sanatize the idea of a Chinese knife when often they are actually outsourcing perhaps even 1 model in their lineup to a factory who uses to profits to make clones.

Chinese knife production is freakin’ nuts.
 
marcinek said:
They would if there was one. Do you think they knock off stuff knowing it won't sell?

They knock off stuff knowing it will sell.
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This! Theres plenty of YouTubers that show this stuff and get thousands of view. No different than all the people that buy knock off parts in the car scene...
 
Lapedog said:
Unfortunately it seems like alot of these companies are actually related in one way or another. They often get other factories to make certain designs for them. For example Kizer may not produce anything, instead they may outsource to 4 factories.

I recently found out WE knives has the same address as Wayeah Knives and Tool co. who has many clones in their line up. Do they just both rent factory space from the same address? Hard to tell...

There are so many rumors, I have heard there is some connection between Reate and Samier. Real Steel is owned by Sanrenmu who has clones in their line up.

They are all often connected. It seems like some of these brands have tried to sanatize the idea of a Chinese knife when often they are actually outsourcing perhaps even 1 model in their lineup to a factory who uses to profits to make clones.

Chinese knife production is freakin’ nuts.
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IIRC Wayeah became WE when they wanted to clean up their image.
 
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