Rough Rider junk

[Ruukuu]

Do you mean why do Case knives have a loyal following outside the USA?

Not really. I was curious why....specifically Americans, would buy Case when they could buy similar knives for a lot less. I think the reply Lee D gave was the one i thought might be right.
As for a following outside the USA.....well the knife carrying arena is WAY smaller than in the States so im not sure what kind of following they have in Europe. I know they are liked and bought though...including by me. Though i have a few now so cant justify the expense of buying any more at the moment.

 

[JPD1998]

RR's are definitely a good value, they also make a few patterns that are consistently excellent (like the barlow pattern and stockman).
I have a RR pocket hunter that is one of my favorite knives to carry.

And as with all companies, they have their QC issues too. I have a few RR's with cracked scales around the main spring pin. (mostly the yellow scaled knives).
I have a few with wobbly blades after light use ( camp king ). Then there's some mismatched scales and bleeding dyes.....
But since they cost $10 - $15 in the US, I overlook that.

There's other Chinese made traditional slipjoints , that cost more, but are finished better ( Marbles, Colt, Schrade).

On the other hand Case knives are more hand finished than RR's. Their mirror polished blades are usually perfect, the blades are swedged, rounded off and fit better in the frame.
The frame edges are rounded. Case backsrpings are mirror polished , while RR leaves a satin finish to hide the "waves" in the unevenly ground backsprings.

Of course Case has their QC issues too.
I own about 20 Case knives and only 1 was returned to Case for a QC issue. When I contacted Case they were very interested in seeing the fault and promptly replaced my knife.
And to be fair , if you buy a RR, they will replace a defective knife too. ( Smoky Mountain Knife Works is the US importer).

When I place a Case knife next to a RR, I can see the difference immediately. And it's not because Case knives cost 5 times more, a few of the $20 Colt knives I have are definitely close to Case quality. But IMO RR isn't.

 

[Ruukuu]

There's other Chinese made traditional slipjoints , that cost more, but are finished better ( Marbles, Colt, Schrade).

I didn't realise these brands were also made in China.
Which traditional slipjoint making Amercan companies still make their knives only in the USA?

 

[Henry Beige]

If Rough Rider slippys can reach the quality of Case knives at times. How come Case cost so much more and have such a loyal following?
Is it because they are still made in the USA, (and the expense that incurs) and not China. Is it a deeply ingrained loyalty to an established American company? or am i missing something.
I mean no disrespect at all...... I just wish to learn.
I have had quite a few Case knives in my time, I have a good half dozen at the moment including a lovely raindrop Damascus congress, but i admit sometimes i have been a little disappointed in the fit and finish for what i had to pay.

The cost can be chalked up to the difference in labor costs. The other is due to a widely held sentiment of “Buy American, to the exclusion of anything else, by jingo!” on the part of people who nevertheless persist in shopping at WalMart.

 

[Henry Beige]

RR's are definitely a good value, they also make a few patterns that are consistently excellent (like the barlow pattern and stockman).
I have a RR pocket hunter that is one of my favorite knives to carry.

And as with all companies, they have their QC issues too. I have a few RR's with cracked scales around the main spring pin. (mostly the yellow scaled knives).
I have a few with wobbly blades after light use ( camp king ). Then there's some mismatched scales and bleeding dyes.....
But since they cost $10 - $15 in the US, I overlook that.

There's other Chinese made traditional slipjoints , that cost more, but are finished better ( Marbles, Colt, Schrade).

On the other hand Case knives are more hand finished than RR's. Their mirror polished blades are usually perfect, the blades are swedged, rounded off and fit better in the frame.
The frame edges are rounded. Case backsrpings are mirror polished , while RR leaves a satin finish to hide the "waves" in the unevenly ground backsprings.

Of course Case has their QC issues too.
I own about 20 Case knives and only 1 was returned to Case for a QC issue. When I contacted Case they were very interested in seeing the fault and promptly replaced my knife.
And to be fair , if you buy a RR, they will replace a defective knife too. ( Smoky Mountain Knife Works is the US importer).

When I place a Case knife next to a RR, I can see the difference immediately. And it's not because Case knives cost 5 times more, a few of the $20 Colt knives I have are definitely close to Case quality. But IMO RR isn't.

View attachment 1365285


View attachment 1365288

Now put a yellow delrin Case up next to the RR.

 

[JPD1998]

I didn't realise these brands were also made in China.
Which traditional slipjoint making Amercan companies still make their knives only in the USA?

Case , Great Eastern, Bear & Sons, Colonial ... I'm sure there's a few more , but that's all I can remember

 

[Ruukuu]

Case , Great Eastern, Bear & Sons, Colonial ... I'm sure there's a few more , but that's all I can remember

I've heard good things of Great Eastern. They are not too well known over here though.

 

[Lee D]

I've heard good things of Great Eastern. They are not too well known over here though.

I love the quality, but mine were all nail breakers, so I sold them. I will say they seem to hold their value quite well.

 

[JPD1998]

I've heard good things of Great Eastern. They are not too well known over here though.

IMO there is nothing better than a Great Eastern knife with Stag scales.

 

[Ruukuu]

Nothing to do with the thread, but ive just been hunting and ive found a scaleless Case knife and a big box of mammoth ivory and tooth.
I'm gonna sort me a new edc

 

[JPD1998]

Now put a yellow delrin Case up next to the RR.

Ok, I included a bonus picture of two RR's with cracked scales near the pin. ( the Case knife doesn't have any cracks)

 

[afishhunter]

I've never had a Rough Rider with a blade lock or one of their fixed blades.
Of the 30 or 40 plus multi-blade slipjoints I have (Barlow, Canoe, Trapper, Stockman, Moose, "Half Hawk"/"Loom Fixer"/"Rope Knife", (large) Sunfish/ "British Rope Knife"/"Pocket Axe"/"Emergency Spatula"/"Elephant Toenail"/"Whaler", or whichever of the dozen plus names for the pattern you prefer, (single blade) large "Coke Bottle", and 4 blade "Scout/Camp" knife, I've never had any "defects" that affect functionality.
The Coke Bottle had a small crack at the center pin (white bone covers) not a biggie. Bone is a natural material and can crack. Case, Boker, GEC, or any other "premium" brand can have a cracked bone cover. A drop of super glue worked in permanently fixed it.
The "Twisted Bone" canoe I had arrived with the laying in the bottom of the box when I took the knife out. Again, not a biggie. A drop of super glue fixed it. There are plenty of threads here about losing the shield on a Case or other "premium" brand knife. A glued shield from anyone can fall off. Big deal. It does not affect the functionality. (and if you cannot find the shield it gives you an excuse to make a custom shield put of a contrasting wood, different metal, synthetic material, or even something like Abalone or Coral.)

I've found the Rough Riders to have a consistent "5" pull on all the blades, regardless of pattern, even grinds, minimal blade rub and minor gaps that cannot be seen without a bright light and you are specifically looking for gaps. I've yet to get one with a case of blade Wiggly-Wobblies or any defect that affects the functionality. Rough Rider has also been consistently among the sharpest knives out of the box I've gotten.

Like I said, I've never owned or handled one of their liner locks. I've read here on the forums that their locking version of the "Sodbuster Jr." has issues with the liner lock or pivot, but the full size version does not. Personally, I avoid liner locks, no matter who makes the knife. If I get a locking blade, it is a backlock.
I have not seen anything here on their lockbacks - good or bad - which leaves me to think they don't have problem. I'm pretty sure if they did have problems, someone here would have mentioned it by now.

Contact the manufacturer. (SMKW) Rough Ryder/Rough Rider has a lifetime guarantee. They will send you another, no problem.
I don't know if they still have the "satisfaction guarantee" of years past.
They sent me a replacement Marbles MR278 that arrived with a busted backspring because the idiot in marketing thought it would be a "good idea" to display the knife in the hang pack with all four blades half open. (FYI: That is a "very bad idea" on any 2 spring 4 blade knife, or for any two blades that share a spring, for that matter, no matter who made it.) The knife in question came with a Marbles SPORK, it was not the knife by itself. Those come in a regular box, all blades closed.
Marbles/Marbles Outdoors is another SMKW brand with a lifetime guarantee.
In the case of the Marbles MR278, they did not want the defective one sent back to them.

 

[johnnywizzo]

I have over thirty RR knives, and with the exception of one, they all came razor sharp right out of the box. Out of all of them, I had minor QC issues with three. SMKW made good by sending me new knives in each case. In truth, I have had similar QC issues with Case knives.

I will continue to buy from both companies because they stand behind their knives.

 

[22-rimfire]

I've never had a Rough Rider with a blade lock or one of their fixed blades.
Of the 30 or 40 plus multi-blade slipjoints I have (Barlow, Canoe, Trapper, Stockman, Moose, "Half Hawk"/"Loom Fixer"/"Rope Knife", (large) Sunfish/ "British Rope Knife"/"Pocket Axe"/"Emergency Spatula"/"Elephant Toenail"/"Whaler", or whichever of the dozen plus names for the pattern you prefer, (single blade) large "Coke Bottle", and 4 blade "Scout/Camp" knife, I've never had any "defects" that affect functionality.
The Coke Bottle had a small crack at the center pin (white bone covers) not a biggie. Bone is a natural material and can crack. Case, Boker, GEC, or any other "premium" brand can have a cracked bone cover. A drop of super glue worked in permanently fixed it.
The "Twisted Bone" canoe I had arrived with the laying in the bottom of the box when I took the knife out. Again, not a biggie. A drop of super glue fixed it. There are plenty of threads here about losing the shield on a Case or other "premium" brand knife. A glued shield from anyone can fall off. Big deal. It does not affect the functionality. (and if you cannot find the shield it gives you an excuse to make a custom shield put of a contrasting wood, different metal, synthetic material, or even something like Abalone or Coral.)

I've found the Rough Riders to have a consistent "5" pull on all the blades, regardless of pattern, even grinds, minimal blade rub and minor gaps that cannot be seen without a bright light and you are specifically looking for gaps. I've yet to get one with a case of blade Wiggly-Wobblies or any defect that affects the functionality. Rough Rider has also been consistently among the sharpest knives out of the box I've gotten.

Like I said, I've never owned or handled one of their liner locks. I've read here on the forums that their locking version of the "Sodbuster Jr." has issues with the liner lock or pivot, but the full size version does not. Personally, I avoid liner locks, no matter who makes the knife. If I get a locking blade, it is a backlock.
I have not seen anything here on their lockbacks - good or bad - which leaves me to think they don't have problem. I'm pretty sure if they did have problems, someone here would have mentioned it by now.

Contact the manufacturer. (SMKW) Rough Ryder/Rough Rider has a lifetime guarantee. They will send you another, no problem.
I don't know if they still have the "satisfaction guarantee" of years past.
They sent me a replacement Marbles MR278 that arrived with a busted backspring because the idiot in marketing thought it would be a "good idea" to display the knife in the hang pack with all four blades half open. (FYI: That is a "very bad idea" on any 2 spring 4 blade knife, or for any two blades that share a spring, for that matter, no matter who made it.) The knife in question came with a Marbles SPORK, it was not the knife by itself. Those come in a regular box, all blades closed.
Marbles/Marbles Outdoors is another SMKW brand with a lifetime guarantee.
In the case of the Marbles MR278, they did not want the defective one sent back to them.

Yes, don't forget that Marbles is another SMKW brand. I would assume that the Marbles slip joints are the same quality as the Rough Ryder's. Have to look them over my next store visit. The "have to look at" list keeps getting longer, so I may just make the visit in the next month. I usually walk out of there with a SAK, a few cheap Vic kitchen knives, and often a RR or two IF I find one that appeals to me (at least). My wife likes the Vic kitchen knives and we use the heck out of those.

I also have never purchased or even particularly checked out any RR that was not a normal slip joint.

The GEC stuff seems to mostly sell out or nearly sell out from a manufacturer point of view here in the US. I suspect that is one of the big reasons you don't see them in Europe. The forum knife is a good starting point for a GEC. As far as I know there will be no forum knife this year. They are generally GEC knives but the two year ago knife was a modified Buck 301 (very nice knife) and there was a Canal Street made one a few years back. Canal Street pretty much went out of business right after delivering the traditional forum knife. But they are back making knives again in very limited numbers. My impression of Canal Street is that they catered to the collector market almost entirely.

 

[afishhunter]

I would assume that the Marbles slip joints are the same quality as the Rough Ryder's.

Actually they are a little higher/better, like the Colt were when SMKW made those.

I think the Marbles/Marbles Outdoors has taken over as their "premium" brand since they stopped making the Colt knives.

 

[mobilerd]

I have a couple of RR Barlows. Its one of those things where I wonder "How the hell can you manufacture this, ship it to the customer and make a profit?" Kinda like some of the Ozark Trail (Walmart) folders for less than 5 dollars??????????? I've bought a few such knives in the past few years, if anyone admires them I just give it to them, mostly truck drivers at my work.

 

[Ruukuu]

I haven't had any serious issues with any of the Rough Rider/Ryder slip joints I own. Can't really speak for their other kinds of knives. But the slip joints (regular type) are a bargain and well made overall (especially for the price). I will be honest with you.... I don't use them much but have inspected all of them carefully. I mostly use other knives and Rough Ryders are generally impulse buys when I visit the knife store in Sevierville TN.

I would certainly be interested in your impressions R Ruukuu

Just received a new RR 'backwoods bushcrafter' barlow. Not really got much to do with woods and bushcraft i think. Just a name.
First impressions......nice opening and closing, blades centered perfectly well with no play. All copper metalwork with some kind of black stonewashed blades. dyed bone scales and a fairly decent polish all round.

How it will last only time will tell. Its just for everyday light chores so hopefully ok.

I understand that wanting to buy American made if possible for a lot of you guys is an important thing....and thats quite admirable. But being an 'outsider' i have to say im pleasantly surprised with how good it seems.....especially for the price and i will happily buy more.

Would love to get one of the GEC [or their branches] knives though....i have this feeling i would like it.

 

[brownshoe]

Case is a 125 yo knife company selling great designs and good quality. They support their workers and their community. You know who they are. Their designs are classic. The greatest custom slipjoint maker of our age, Tony Bose works with them.

Rough Ryder is a marketing firm, nobody knows anything else about the manufacturers other than country of origin. The US owners are notorious for their marketing hijinks and for conning many collectors and knifemakers for support to start a museum and then closing it. Rough Ryders are diposable knives that are not repaired, like a Case, but replaced by SMKW.

 

[afishhunter]

Case is a 125 yo knife company selling great designs and good quality. They support their workers and their community. You know who they are. Their designs are classic. The greatest custom slipjoint maker of our age, Tony Bose works with them.

Rough Ryder is a marketing firm, nobody knows anything else about the manufacturers other than country of origin. The US owners are notorious for their marketing hijinks and for conning many collectors and knifemakers for support to start a museum and then closing it. Rough Ryders are diposable knives that are not repaired, like a Case, but replaced by SMKW.

Rough Rider is an SMKW owned Brand. Rough Rider is not a "Marketing Firm".
And yet Rough Rider, whether repaired or replaced, comes with a lifetime guarantee, while some high end "MADE IN USA" "Modern" knives (I think Hinderer is one) only have a 5 or 10 year guarantee.

That tells me how long each manufacturer expects their product to last ... or possibly how long they expect to remain in business ... and which is most likely to get my money.

EDIT: For what it's worth (less than a stale donut and a moldy cup of cold coffee, no doubt) I don't have a clue about the "marketing hijinks" or anything about a museum to which you refer.

 

[Tigerfan]

Case is a 125 yo knife company selling great designs and good quality. They support their workers and their community. You know who they are. Their designs are classic. The greatest custom slipjoint maker of our age, Tony Bose works with them.

Rough Ryder is a marketing firm, nobody knows anything else about the manufacturers other than country of origin. The US owners are notorious for their marketing hijinks and for conning many collectors and knifemakers for support to start a museum and then closing it. Rough Ryders are diposable knives that are not repaired, like a Case, but replaced by SMKW.

Off topic: The smkw museum is closed?