san mai copyright ????????????

I also mention smiths hammering on "cold steel" on the show... maybe that'll be the next letter. LMAO

That would be a hell of a thing. Honestly I think Lynn was just praying we would all just be shaking in our boots at the idea of getting sued, and figured none of us had

A. Talked to or know any lawyers

B. Look at his own trademark and realize he only owns the capitalized version of san mai with 3 lines next to it

C. Talk to eachother and realize this is B.S

D. Respect him so little that I for one plan on going out of my way to piss him off.

Hell, you know what? Anyone with a cease and desist letter from Cold Steel about San Mai gets 5 dollars off any order from me. Just email me a photo or screenshot of the letter when you place and order, please include that it was addressed to you.
 
Makes me want to make San Mai out of Cold Steel blades.

And sell them.

For a profit.

...but I'd only want to do it if I could keep the "Cold Steel San Mai III" logo emblazoned across the ENTIRE outer jacket. Both sides.
 
All I'm taking away from this is that I need to do more San Mai billets... I didn't receive a letter. I honestly feel left out.

J.... I will buy you a beer at Blade if you find a chance to look directly into the camera and somehow work in the 5 word phrase... "cold steel San Mai sucks".

.... two beer.

Yes, "Beer" is the plural of "beer" for true Canadians. We don't say "cords" of firewood either. "I burned 3 cord of wood last Winter."
 
So has anyone emailed Lynn back and demand a proof of his claim to the use of "San Mai"?
 
Three pages so far.

I'd say Lynn is getting exactly what he wants out of bullshit like this. That's the toughest thing to remember about incendiary garbage like his stock and trade -it's not any value for him unless it's creating fires.
 
Before this I was excited to send the 2 blades I have profiled of Aldo's 52100 San Mai off to heat treatment. Now I'm ecstatic.
 
Here is a federal court's description of the standard to awarding attorney fees to a party subjected to a false claim of trademark rights which prevails in litigation over that claim:

“frivolousness, motivation, objective unreasonableness (both in the factual and legal components of the case) and the need in particular circumstances to advance considerations of compensation and deterrence."

The district court did not require the applicant for attorney fees to shpow "fraud, bad faith, or maliciousness."

So if you make a false claim of trademark protection and there is litigation, even by the accused party seeking a declaratory judgment that it was not infringing, you may end up paying the attorney fees for the party falsely accused of infringing.

$40,000 was awarded as attorney fees.

Renna v. County of Union N.J., 2015 WL 93800, (D.N.J. 2015), applying the more liberal standard for awarding attorney fees to the prevailing party in a trademark infringement case set forth by the U.S. Supreme Court in Octane Fitness, LLC v. Icon Health and Fitness, Inc., 134 S.Ct. 1749 (2014).

So Ol' Lynn has some skin in the game.
 
Trademarks can be revoked...

e most practical reason to file a cancellation action is to remove the registration as an impediment to the petitioner’s own application. A cancellation action often is also used to create leverage when an applicant seeks a coexistence agreement with the registrant: faced with the threat of cancellation, the registrant may be more amenable to entering into an agreement that defines the scope of use of the respective marks. In most jurisdictions, the legal result of a successful cancellation is the loss of legal title or ownership of the cancelled trademark registration. A successful cancellation action based on grounds such as likelihood of confusion, descriptiveness or genericness can influence a civil court in further proceedings, as the local trademark office usually is considered to have expertise on those issues.




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All I'm taking away from this is that I need to do more San Mai billets... I didn't receive a letter. I honestly feel left out.

J.... I will buy you a beer at Blade if you find a chance to look directly into the camera and somehow work in the 5 word phrase... "cold steel San Mai sucks".

.... two beer.

Yes, "Beer" is the plural of "beer" for true Canadians. We don't say "cords" of firewood either. "I burned 3 cord of wood last Winter."

How did this thread turn into a Canadian grammar lesson? :)
 
All I'm taking away from this is that I need to do more San Mai billets... I didn't receive a letter. I honestly feel left out.

J.... I will buy you a beer at Blade if you find a chance to look directly into the camera and somehow work in the 5 word phrase... "cold steel San Mai sucks".

.... two beer.

Yes, "Beer" is the plural of "beer" for true Canadians. We don't say "cords" of firewood either. "I burned 3 cord of wood last Winter."

That's interesting.

I've only ever "gone for some beers" I didn't think there was a singular noun.
 
OK, I have to say, I think even giving this whole issue one more word of print is a waste. You cannot trademark a "process" which is what San Mai is, not a product. I'm a big proponent of NO BS and it's obvious that Lynn has slipped a gear. I'm also a big proponent of not hiding behind the internet so I'd also be happy to have this 3 second conversation at Blade Show if he's there. This just has to be a media stunt, heck I would have enjoyed the idea of maybe working with Cold Steel at some point (although I'm sure I'm not worthy) but, WOW... The reason I work alone and for myself is because I can't handle... well, you know.
 
Are there any makers who can make me a virtually fixed San Mai folder?

Seriously. I think it's the whole there's no bad publicity thing.
Anybody remember the virtually fixed folder issue? Also no chance of winning a case. Maybe CS thinks just getting attention even negative will translate into coin every single time.
They might be right.
 
Just spoke to the US patent and trademark office. Trademarks can be cancelled after they have been registered. CS registered the trademark in 2008 and recertified it in 2014. They claimed that they were using it and were the only knifemakers using it since 1986 (its on their direct filing) and are therefore entitled to trademark protection. The grounds to cancel their trademark is as follows (link to the USPTO will follow):

"A cancellation proceeding is a proceeding in which the plaintiff seeks to cancel an existing registration of a trademark on the Principal or the Supplemental Register. "Any person who believes that he would be damaged by the registration of a mark" may, upon payment of the prescribed fee, file a petition to cancel thereto, but the petition to cancel may only be filed after the issuance of the registration. [ Note 2.]"
note 2. See Trademark Act § 14 and Trademark Act § 24, 15 U.S.C. § 1064 and 15 U.S.C. § 1092.

Section 300
https://mpep.uspto.gov/RDMS/TBMP/current#/current/TBMP-300d1e1.html

37 CFR § 2.111(a) A cancellation proceeding is commenced by filing in the Office a timely petition for cancellation with the required fee. The petition must include proof of service on the owner of record for the registration, or the owner’s domestic representative of record, at the correspondence address of record in the Office, as detailed in §§ 2.111(b) and 2.119.

37 CFR § 2.116(b) The opposer in an opposition proceeding or the petitioner in a cancellation proceeding shall be in the position of plaintiff, and the applicant in an opposition proceeding or the respondent in a cancellation proceeding shall be in the position of defendant. A party that is a junior party in an interference proceeding or in a concurrent use registration proceeding shall be in the position of plaintiff against every party that is senior, and the party that is a senior party in an interference proceeding or in a concurrent use registration proceeding shall be a defendant against every party that is junior.

37 CFR § 2.116(c) The opposition or the petition for cancellation and the answer correspond to the complaint and answer in a court proceeding.

An opposition proceeding is commenced by the timely filing of a notice of opposition, together with the required fee, in the USPTO. [ Note 1.] The notice of opposition must include proof of service on the owner of the application, or its attorney or domestic representative of record, at the correspondence address of record in the Office. [ Note 2.] See TBMP § 309.02(c). If any service copy of the opposition is returned to the opposer as undeliverable, the opposer must notify the Board within ten days of receipt of the returned copy. [ Note 3.] See TBMP § 309.02(c)(1).

Similarly, a cancellation proceeding is commenced by the timely filing of a petition for cancellation, together with the required fee, in the USPTO. [ Note 4.] The petition to cancel must include proof of service on the record owner of the registration, or its domestic representative. See TBMP § 309.02(c)(2). If any service copy of the petition to cancel is returned to the petitioner as undeliverable, the petitioner must notify the Board within ten days of receipt of the returned copy. [ Note 5.] See TBMP § 309.02(c)(2).
The notice of opposition, or the petition for cancellation, and the answer thereto correspond to the complaint and answer in a court proceeding. [ Note 6.] The opposer in an opposition proceeding, or the petitioner in a cancellation proceeding, is in the position of plaintiff, and the applicant in an opposition proceeding, or the respondent in a cancellation proceeding, is in the position of defendant. [ Note 7.]

An interference proceeding commences when the Board mails a notice of interference to each of the parties to the proceeding, as described in 37 CFR § 2.93. For further information concerning interference proceedings, see TBMP Chapter 1000.

A concurrent use proceeding commences when the Board mails a notice of the proceeding to each of the parties thereto, as described in 37 CFR § 2.99(c) and 37 CFR § 2.99(d)(1). For further information concerning concurrent use proceedings, see TBMP Chapter 1100.

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What all this means is that anyone who wants to petition for cancellation of he trademark because "he feels he may be damaged by the trademark" must pay $300 and file a written opposition to the trademark and send proof that you sent a copy to the attorney of record for CS. Multiple people can join the motion for cancellation and each must pay the $300, but only one letter of explanation needs to be submitted. Or everyone can submit their own letter.
 
Also:

307 Time for Filing Petition to Cancel

15 U.S.C. § 1064 [Trademark Act § 14] A petition to cancel a registration of a mark, stating the grounds relied upon, may, upon payment of the prescribed fee, be filed as follows by any person who believes that he is or will be damaged, including as a result of a likelihood of confusion of dilution by blurring or dilution by tarnishment under section 43(c), by the registration of a mark on the principal register established by this Act, or under the Act of March 3, 1881, or the Act of February 20, 1905: (1) Within five years from the date of the registration of the mark under this Act.
(2) Within five years from the date of publication under section 12(c) hereof of a mark registered under the Act of March 3, 1881, or the Act of February 20, 1905.
(3) At any time if the registered mark becomes the generic name for the goods or services, or a portion thereof, for which it is registered, or is functional or has been abandoned, or its registration was obtained fraudulently or contrary to the provisions of section 4 or of subsection (a), (b), or (c) of section 2 for a registration under this Act, or contrary to similar prohibitory provisions of such prior Acts for a registration under such Acts, or if the registered mark is being used by, or with the permission of, the registrant so as to misrepresent the source of the goods or services on or in connection with which the mark is used. If the registered mark becomes the generic name for less than all of the goods or services for which it is registered, a petition to cancel the registration for only those goods or services may be filed. A registered mark shall not be deemed to be the generic name of goods or services solely because such mark is also used as a name of or to identify a unique product or service. The primary significance of the registered mark to the relevant public rather than purchaser motivation shall be the test for determining whether the registered mark has become the generic name of goods or services on or in connection with which it has been used.
(4) At any time if the mark is registered under the Act of March 3, 1881, or the Act of February 20, 1905, and has not been published under the provisions of subsection (c) of section 12 of this Act.
(5) At any time in the case of a certification mark on the ground that the registrant (A) does not control, or is not able legitimately to exercise control over, the use of such mark, or (B) engages in the production or marketing of any goods or services to which the certification mark is applied, or (C) permits the use of the certification mark for purposes other than to certify, or (D) discriminately refuses to certify or to continue to certify the goods or services of any person who maintains the standards or conditions which such mark certifies:
 
Just spoke to the US patent and trademark office. Trademarks can be cancelled after they have been registered.
...
What all this means is that anyone who wants to petition for cancellation of he trademark because "he feels he may be damaged by the trademark" must pay $300 and file a written opposition to the trademark and send proof that you sent a copy to the attorney of record for CS. Multiple people can join the motion for cancellation and each must pay the $300, but only one letter of explanation needs to be submitted. Or everyone can submit their own letter.
"San Mai III" is protected and nobody else uses it thus nobody is harmed by that trademark and filing such a thing wouldn't do anything than maybe teasing CS.

The issue is that CS pretends San Mai ( not just San Mai |||) is trademarked which it isn't.
 
OK, I have to say, I think even giving this whole issue one more word of print is a waste. You cannot trademark a "process" which is what San Mai is, not a product. I'm a big proponent of NO BS and it's obvious that Lynn has slipped a gear. I'm also a big proponent of not hiding behind the internet so I'd also be happy to have this 3 second conversation at Blade Show if he's there. This just has to be a media stunt, heck I would have enjoyed the idea of maybe working with Cold Steel at some point (although I'm sure I'm not worthy) but, WOW... The reason I work alone and for myself is because I can't handle... well, you know.

I agree J.
 
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