Self Defense With a knife - for adults only

DannyinJapan

DannyinJapan

Joined
Oct 9, 2003
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This is an entirely new thread and I have no particular purpose in starting it except to perhaps dicuss size and shape and movement.
I think Azis had something he wanted to discuss in particular, so Ill let him post some stuff and then we'll really get going, I guess.
 
Small to medium sized khuks are perhaps the world's best quiet anti car jacking devices available. That being said, don't forget the first rule, "Never bring a knife to gun fight.... :rolleyes: :D :D
 
true enough. From a ninpo perspective, one almsot looks at it from a physics-like paradigm. If it has the potential to do work, then it has the potential to do damage, even if it's at a psychological level.
So, you'll hear us say " all weapons are the same."
Obviously this isnt true from a scientific viewpoint, but in the way that we move, it is.
We have a concept called "kakushi buki."
That means "hidden weapons." It is very important. A weapon that is not seen cannot be defended against. If you have a small weapon, like a pencil, this give the pencil magnified capabilities. IF you have a 22 inch Ganga Ram, that gives the Ganga Ram magnified capabilities.
Imagine that.
Hiding weapons magnifies their power.
Thus, we dont really have a preference in the size of the wepon, its really just how you use it. Having said that, some sizes and shapes do lend themselves well to being hidden, and that expresses itself from time to time.
 
I carried a variety of weapons for over thirty years, and the best and last ditch weapon is the one between your ears.....
 
Excuse me if I get philisophical for a moment. The weapon you carry is no
where near as important as your intention to use it.

The thing is what you have is what you have at the time of conflict.
However if you carry whatever with intention of using it that changes
how you'd react.
 
DIJ... no real point but there are a few martial artist on the forum and they come from different styles and some different concepts...always good to share it opens up new paths.

I have studied the use of a variety of weapons spears, swords, knives, sticks etc..
As for myself and blades I have had an interest in them most of my life and trained several methods most FMA.

The Khukuri though is an exception to most blade arts or even most hand weapons because when you really get into the physics of the blade you can find an entire martial art. Few hand weapons do that.

One thing I would like to hear about is how artist that use the Khukuri in their style have developed and some of the methods they employ.
 
Azis, I think that is right. I know little of this- having only taken a little fencing in college. But that shape should provide some unique opportunity. I think the curve should be able to 'dish' the opponent's blade, perhaps sending it in a useless direction, tying it up momentarily, or out and out breaking it. The cho comes to mind.
A friend of mine who has a blackbelt grabbed one of my khuks as you would a knife, not the way to chop wood. What a defensive shield it became.

munk
 
Guys...not really sure where this thread is going...marked adult only is sure to draw the attention of every kid in cyberspace...

That being said...Here's what I know about knife fighting...everybody gets hurt. Everybody bleeds. That is it. There is no glory...no romance.

If you have ever been seriously cut.. you will not want the experience again.

IMHO...this thread should be moved to the training forum. Talk with the escrima guys...having witnessed the Philipino forms personally I can tell you
I want no part of it.

If it comes down to root hog or die...ok fine...but I won't talk about it in a casual manner here or anywhere else...anymore than I will speak lightly of killing Brother Bear.

Shane
 
My interpretation of the thread is that it was written to avoid just such as you mentioned, and I've seen no sign of negative input. That is why there was a warning- no silliness, no SOF, but a somber discussion of techique and mechanics. There are many many people in HI forum aware of the myth of glamor.



munk
 
When I had the false alarm at my house a while back, I remember thinking "I need a dagger, one long enough to go through a man's chest and pin him to the wall." An 18" khuk just felt like too much to use effectively in a small space.

If not a dagger, then something with good thrusting AND chopping capabilities, like a bowie.
 
I like khukuris, obviously ;) but in terms of real martial arts, we find it unwise to focus on any one weapon. Like Fixer said, what you have is what you have. Thus, training with one particular weapon in mind is a dangerous habit.
It is, in fact a sport. When you make rules and limitations about what can happen or what you could have in your hand, it becomes a sport, not a martial art.
Combat has no rules.

Do we employ the special curves and shapes of the khukuri? Of course, yes, a lot. AFTER we move our bodies to a safe place. AFTER we have tied up the opponent's weapons or limbs or whatnot.
The khukuri is STUFFED with useful combat attributes.
 
A good carpenter with a poor hammer is a good carpenter. A poor carpenter with a good hammer is still a poor carpenter. You may wish to expound on this further than you already have for our benefit, DIJ.
 
You said it right, Satori. Find the best teacher you can and train, train train.
Enjoy your life.

I know this can sometimes sound like an insult to those people who dedicate themselves to mastering a particular weapon. No doubt, they could hurt you bad and fast if you are not careful. That is not martial arts, though, it is a martial sport. This takes a maturity to understand and accept.

I like and train with khukuris, especially the hanshee. I also like the ninja-to. (ninja sword) It is short (19" blade) and light and perfect for so many applications. I cant allow myself to have a favorite weapon , though, a real martial artist cant allow himself to think that way.

You have to keep yourself unattached to any one way of moving or thinking.
That will get you killed.
 
...
Shane Justice says ;
"That being said...Here's what I know about knife fighting...everybody gets hurt. Everybody bleeds. That is it. There is no glory...no romance.

If you have ever been seriously cut.. you will not want the experience again."

This precisely my point of view. To go in harm's way, and survive over the long haul, at least 80% of your planning should go toward how to avoid those few seconds or (God forbid) minutes of actual engagement (perhaps by getting the drop on the other guy), then train like hell in the worst possible circumstances for those times when your tactical planning didn't suceed. Two thoughts: The best operational plan in the world goes out the window when the first round is fired; after that it's every poor B@$t@rd for himself. What's happening in the next room or upstairs won't save you from the guy three feet away. Second, all thoughts of personal invincibility are gone when you attend the funeral of a fallen brother officer, and have to comfort his wife and kids......

Mac
 
I have to agree with shane justice on this one. When I was quite a bit younger I was stabbed. The person that did it was a "friend": I had no reason to suspect him and I never saw it coming.

We were walking down the street and I caught his sudden movement in my peripheral vision. He had stabbed me in the abdomen with a 4" steak knife. As I turned to look at him the knife cut a long slit in my stomach. I pushed him to get him away from me, and did the only thing I could think of: RAN LIKE HELL! He slashed at my neck and cut me again,fortunately toward the back of my neck where there was nothing terribly vital.

I was living with my parents then,and we were only about a block from their house. My dad had the rare pleasure of waking up to find me calling the police from the kitchen while trying to hold the wounds closed.

The ER doctor told me that the neck wound,although ugly and ragged,was fairly superficial. The abdominal stab came within 1/4" of penetrating my stomach. My turn apparently saved me by causing the knife to rock sideways instead of going any deeper. Neither wound was actually painful until later,when I started moving around with the stitches in.

Lessons learned? For one,the $2 steak knife worked just fine as a weapon. If he had stabbed for my chest or my throat I doubt I would be talking about this. If he had chased me down,I really don't think that I could have done anything to defend myself. I guess most importantly a knifing is an ugly bloody mess. As much as I love knives, I think that saying that I have respect for them is an understatement! I don't EVER want to face someone with a knife again,PERIOD!
 
It turned out that he had an amphetamine problem and had been becoming increasingly paranoid. He concocted some fantasy about me screwing around with his girlfriend and decided to do something about it.

I found out from her later that he had confronted her and she had denied it several times,since it wasn't true.

It was really thoughtful of her to tell me AFTER I got stabbed!
 
I would agree a martial artist should learn multiple weapons and how to make anything a weapon...not really the point.. In each style there are weapons of that culture and its part of the system.

Though there are a few styles that focus or center on a weapon i.e. kendo

With the shape of the Khukuri blade though there is something more, as not many weapons can also show you what to do with empty hands this one does

As for the training forum I have read many threads there. I do enjoy the FMA threads (kali Arnis etc) I have owned two schools in those arts for many years and respect the arts fully.
But I have only found a few that know that much about this weapon though some people have brought into their style I often see the attempt to use it based on the style not on the blade and so much is missed.

The one system that has really developed with the blade is American Bando from what I have seen and the couple of people I know in it the blend has been remarkable as well as the blend with yawara jitsu I think it demonstrates the natural progress of martial arts.
 
Jebadiah_Smith said:
When I had the false alarm at my house a while back, I remember thinking "I need a dagger, one long enough to go through a man's chest and pin him to the wall." An 18" khuk just felt like too much to use effectively in a small space.

If not a dagger, then something with good thrusting AND chopping capabilities, like a bowie.
Click to expand...


An 18" khuk is by no means too big (I think I said this before) or in any way unfit.
You should practice in a doorway, with your upper arms tied down or with something like matchbooks tucked in your armpits. Edge and/or point should always be pointed at your target. Avoid wide/wild swings. It's not a stick or punch, so you don't need to (over)commit yourself to a full-strength effort. Stay compact and within yourself.

If, as above, you've pinned him to the wall in a confined space, have you just disarmed yourself and left yourself in range? Hopefully not...
 
Eh. I know it's not too commonplace, but I expressed my thoughts in the Feb Concealed Carry Magazine.

Basically, if you have any other options, going blade vs. blade is about the last thing you want to do. Any force option that will enable the defender to transfer force to the attacker while keeping out of contact distance is preferred.

While this is certainly within contact distance, it's an example of using an improvised weapon- which is absolutely anything you have that can be used when you need it- in preference to using a knife.

John
 
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