Small Sebenza or Strider PT

[darkestthicket]

i agree with DaveH. at the lead point of production folders, either of these knives are pretty much the king of the hill for just about any purpose, and simply put, if you are exerting enough strength to snap a folder at the lock, either strider or sebenza, you need to be using a fixed blade. are you going to break either knife prying out staples? no, i seriously doubt it.

could you break either knifes blade before the lock? probably, and im pretty sure it would include some miraculous circumstances that start with the statement
"well i was digging my way out of my own coffin and..."
or
"i found myself trapped in my bullet proof car and..."
or
"i woke up trapped in a train car and..."

or something similar.

 

[allenC]

I'm in the market for a small folder, I know these two manufacturers each have their dedicated followers, but I have narrowed my choice down to these 2 models and would appreciate some (unbiased) advice.

Thanks in advance

Subzilla

I don't have any UNBIASED advice, my advise is totally biased.
Buy the Sebenza.

I have never heard anything bad about Mr. Chris Reeve, and everything I have heard indicates that he is an honorable and upstanding guy.

On the other hand, Strider is not someone you would want to give your money to.
Do a search and you'll find some threads where Strider has shown his true colors.

Good luck,
Allen.

 

[darkestthicket]

I don't have any UNBIASED advice, my advise is totally biased.
...
On the other hand, Strider is not someone you would want to give your money to.
Do a search and you'll find some threads where Strider has shown his true colors.

Good luck,
Allen.

And you can also go to strider's website for the other side of the story. there is a sticky about this particular farce or series of farces on the badlands forum on Mick's site.

Before someone starts bashing me, notice i did not bash the sebenza or chris reeve. just stated that basicly the only difference to a practical user is aesthetics.


Want my biased opinion? wait for the busse folder to come out

 

[talonturbo]

And you can also go to strider's website for the other side of the story.

Want my biased opinion? wait for the busse folder to come out

There's alwasy another side to the story. You wouldn't believe the stunts some people have pulled in a Strider-bashing attempt. I'll leave it at that.

On the Busse topic, I haven't been following Busse lately, but last I heard, the future existance of a folder is somewhat of an ongoing joke. Please inform me otherwise, as I've been out of the loop, but would be interested in such a blade.

 

[darkestthicket]

There's alwasy another side to the story. You wouldn't believe the stunts some people have pulled in a Strider-bashing attempt. I'll leave it at that.

On the Busse topic, I haven't been following Busse lately, but last I heard, the future existance of a folder is somewhat of an ongoing joke. Please inform me otherwise, as I've been out of the loop, but would be interested in such a blade.

I sent an email to the site and confirmed that it would be coming, at least i think i did, i send about 1 email a day to the site. i believe last i heard was sometime this weekend it should show up. im a Busse newb though so it is possible they are having some fun with the F'n new guy. lol.

 

[talonturbo]

i agree with DaveH. at the lead point of production folders, either of these knives are pretty much the king of the hill for just about any purpose, and simply put, if you are exerting enough strength to snap a folder at the lock, either strider or sebenza, you need to be using a fixed blade.

Good point, as they are both excellent.

are you going to break either knife prying out staples? no, i seriously doubt it.

You won't, but I haven't seen many Sebbies that got pushed past the limit of the average folder. And staples are not past that limit. OK, weaker tips such as the Millie suggested earlier couldn't do it though. Believe me, I broke a Para (even stronger tip than a millie because of dimensions) doing a very very minor pry. Easier than a staple in my opinion. But wait, I should use the right tool, right? Well the Para was all I had with me. When I came back to finish what the Para failed, did I bring a screwdriver? Nope. Prybar? Nope. I brought the SnG. I knew it could have done it and I was right.

Back on topic, Striders have something about them (ugliness?) that encourages you to use them past this point. Just because your Micarta Sebbie CAN take out staples, or much much worse, doesn't mean people use it when needed to "do more".

 

[darkestthicket]

Back on topic, Striders have something about them (ugliness?) that encourages you to use them past this point. Just because your Micarta Sebbie CAN take out staples, or much much worse, doesn't mean people use it when needed to "do more".

Boy, that is the truth. i like the uglieness. lol.

 

[talonturbo]

...sometime this weekend it should show up. im a Busse newb though so it is possible they are having some fun with the F'n new guy. lol.

I haven't been following, but yes, yes they are.

 

[Lemon328i]

Both are great knives, but neither should be used for prying, even something as small as staples. Can they do it? Sure, but hit a bad angle one time or meet up with the monster "staples" used to hold big packages together (often hidden under thick packaging tape and you could chip an edge.

I have a large Sebenza and an SnG that I EDC, but for prying tasks, get yourself one of those nifty Atwood Prybabies. Very inexpensive, but extremely useful.

 

[talonturbo]

I replied to Ginshun Talonturbo not your post. I didn't see your post yet by the time I replied.

Realized that after, my bad. You did seem to have sort of responded to my post though.

...its harder to bend and/or fold a thicker shorter piece of steel than it is a longer thinner one. Grab you a piece of .034 titanium or a .040 titanium pocket clip and see just how easy it is to bend and fold to get an idea of what I'm saying after you compare it to a piece of .060 thick titanium.
STR

Not going to argue that. However, you're leaving out some important info.

First, length, as you mentioned, is important in how easily a metrial will bend when force is applied at the ends. However, lockbar cutouts will usually only have one point of "bend". Unless the cutout is flat instead of semi-circular concave, then who knows. But I don't see how length is relevant, short of the whole thing being thin (like liner locks :jerkit: ).

Second, you left out width. More area to bend. The Sriders, thanks to the handle design, are massively wide at this crucial area.

The last point might be irrelevant, depending on how exactly the lock cutout "bends" during failure. If it CRUMPLES, then disregard the following:

Resistance to bending back to the unlocked position has many factors. One of which is the amount of memory instilled on that portion of the lock. Many people actually complain that Striders are difficult to unlock because of the force they exert aginst being unlocked (memory). Another reason for this is the smaller tang/lock contact area. It will "dig in" more, resulting in shorter life but more pressure. Same as how a racing clutch (3, 4, or 6 puck) can hold more power using no more total force than clutches where the force is divided by the entire circular shape.

And by the way, I'm not a Strider fan sticking up for a company. I'm a knife and mechanical design fan posting my opinion.

 

[talonturbo]

...you could chip an edge..

That would be terrible, given that I have a sharpener and all. And don't get me started on people (not implying you) who don't want to scratch a blade. Oh wait, it gets worse. there are actually people that won't use a knife for a tough cut, or stab, or whatever they need it for, BECAUSE IT WILL DULL THE BLADE. Now that's bad, and off topic a little.

...get yourself one of those nifty Atwood Prybabies. Very inexpensive, but extremely useful.

Just bought one primarily because I'm too lazy to make myself a spanner, but figure it might actually surprise me as a low-leverage prybar. But isn't that what the DB on my back is for?

These prying topics always come down to exactly what tools you have nearby or on you when you need something done. Use the right tool is a nonsense reply. Using an emergency jack and mickey mouse lugnut wrench is NECESSARY sometimes, when your hydraulic 3 ton jack and air tools aren't with you at the side of the road.

Same thing with knives. If I'm on a friend's cottage boat and a repair is necessary, the single folder clipped to my shorts will be called on to do much more than cut sometimes. No "bag in the truck" full of the right tools. If you carry a multitool AT ALL TIMES, then good for you, buy a flimsy knife (this is not intended to imply either knives in this thread). But for alot of us, a folder is all we have on us sometimes. And "sometimes" is when things always seem to go wrong. My keychain has a Micra and KL4 on it (soon to also include a spannerbaby), but not having them nearby when I need something other than a knife is not alwasy the case. I ALWAYS have a HAK and a folder on me. I need them to be able to do it all, should the need arise.

EDIT: love your nic BTW, can't make German lemonade? jk

 

[darkestthicket]

Nice posts Talon, both informative and funny. lol.

 

[STR]

I finally looked up the specs I made on the ones I had in hand comparing stats in both folders. Since it would be redundant to list all here for this crowd I'll stick with the comments I made already.

Strider PT

Lock thickness .117 front .119 back
G10 side was .120 thickness front and .118 back

Lock relief was .033 throughout the length of it which was about the length of my pinky finger nail in length and flat.

Small Sebenza

lock thickness (and liner also) .124

lock relief was semi circular and about the same length as the PT but at the very thinnest point in the middle in two places it was .055 in thickness with the rest being thicker tapering to the full thickness of the slab in steps.

After having both apart to examine closely I would say the Sebenza was the better made of the two but both have their strong points. The PT looks tougher and I did like it a lot in the hand. Both have good grips though.

For you guys talking about prying with them. You must have deeper pockets than I do to take a knife that expensive and pry up staples or anything else with the blades on them. I would never do that with even a knife a 1/3rd that cost. There are tools made for that.

Also, S30V does not have the most stellar reputation for holding up to significant prying or lateral stresses based on what I've read from Cliff Stamp's reviews and others.


STR

 

[darkestthicket]

For you guys talking about prying with them. You must have deeper pockets than I do to take a knife that expensive and pry up staples or anything else with the blades on them. I would never do that with even a knife a 1/3rd that cost. There are tools made for that. STR

No, both knives have a lifetime guarantee, do they not? of course i pry with a strider, or whatever i have on hand if i need to. a knife is a tool to use as you see fit, especially if it has a lifetime guarantee.

 

[STR]

Yeah, but you will still not have the knife everytime you have to mail it back to get its blade replaced so to me its just not feesible to risk it even if it does have a warranty to replace or repair it. I can hear my wife now if I snapped the blade on a $300 knife and to me that isn't worth it either.

STR

 

[ginshun]

Yeah, but you will still not have the knife everytime you have to mail it back to get its blade replaced so to me its just not feesible to risk it even if it does have a warranty to replace or repair it.

As if we don't all have 50 other knives to use in the meantime.

LOL!

I still see your point though. I pretty much never pry with my knives, even Striders. Thats what the Prybaby on my keychain is for.


Again, my take on it is that you can't go wrong with either of these two knives. Pick whichever one is more asthetically pleasing to you and enjoy.

 

[darkestthicket]

Yeah, but you will still not have the knife everytime you have to mail it back to get its blade replaced so to me its just not feesible to risk it even if it does have a warranty to replace or repair it. I can hear my wife now if I snapped the blade on a $300 knife and to me that isn't worth it either.

STR

At least you have a warranty in case you do. ive had strider's for several years and have yet to break ONE of them.
You mention Cliff Stamp stating that s30v isn't notorious for its prying ability, this is true, however, on Cliff's website, the only mention I could find of S30v breaking was after being wedged in wood and snapping off the tip. (note this was not a strider and was not heat treated by Paul Bos) this is a bit of an unusual task for a folder (i belive the task was batoning for firewood) and Cliff himself states something more like a Ratwieller should be used, which i agree with. If you absolutely had to i believe it could be done.


Edit : Ginshun, Amen, i have like 4 or 5 i could use in the meantime. though admittedly, STR, it would suck to have to send it back, especially if it was your favorite.

Edit again :
Have you seen the videos (lame airsofters though they may be) where striders are used destroy airsoft rifles and poke holes in steel car hoods, doors, and a-arms? (yes again admitedly lame kids destroying stuff) but the knives in question DO the job and do not have tip breaks and are s30v.

 

[talonturbo]

No, both knives have a lifetime guarantee, do they not? of course i pry with a strider, or whatever i have on hand if i need to. a knife is a tool to use as you see fit, especially if it has a lifetime guarantee.

My mechanics tools (the actual ratchets and what not) have lifetime warranties. If I'm holding something and need a hammer, guess what I'm grabbing if it's within reach? The closest tool that will do the job.

If a tool has a warranty and I think it'll get-er-done, I'll use it. If it will likely break, warranty or not, I won't, short of an emergency situation.

Some people buy tough knives for these emergency situations, but mostly end up using them for simple cutting chores. Others have discovered that some knives can just do more, and be more useful when part of a limited set of tools, such as EDC on a summer day when not expecting the need to arise.

 

[Lemon328i]

Talonturbo your posts do make sense in that people will use the tools at hand. I think people should be better at planning for versatility, but that takes experience.

So here is an example of the wrong tool for the job. I got the new profile large Sebenza (#126!) in ATS-34 way back when they first came out. I needed a tough folding knife for work and back then the Sebbie was as tough as they come. I was using it to open a cargo box that was held with nylon bands, cut those with no problem. The inner boxes had those large metal staples holding them in place. Started prying those out with the knife as I had no other tools with me. Wouldn't you know it, on the last staple, one part of the blade had the edge chip right out. It almost looked like someone put a 1mm choil in the middle of the cutting edge. In retrospect, I should have just cut the heavy cardboard out from around the staples, but I was new to knife use then

I continued to use the knife for the next 6 years with the divot in the blade. I polished and sharpened the edge, but nothing short of regrinding was going to get that out. I eventually sent it back to CRK to replace it with an S30V blade. That blade has been great for all cutting tasks, but I learned my lesson and now use a Prybaby for prying tasks. If I can't carry such a tiny piece of metal with me, I'm probably not carrying a knife either!

 

[razorsdescent]

I personally prefer the look of the PT (military stryling) but have read a number of negative reviews concerning the quality of Strider knives, finish etc!!! I normally go with the sensible purchases (safe bets) in life and sometimes end up regreting it, there are exceptions of course.

This knife is going to be a bitof a an edc at work at at home.

My heart says PT,brain says seb !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for theinfo so far, I thought I might spark a good few (unbiased ) opinions with this one.

Subzilla

SUbzilla this is a forum where the reeve junkies hang out. If you want a place where they like pt's go to www.usualsuspect.net they are good bunch there.

The pt is tougher, and im sure lighter but it's not quite as well finished which shouldnt bother you if you use it and not look at it.

The sebenza is a great knife with good fit and finish but not quite as tough.

To be honest i think that people exagerate about how many problems there are with strider.