Some knive reviewsand thoughts of mine over the years (Busse and others)

Wired, already sold off all my Busses except, as previous mentioned the Natural Outlaw Zero Tolerance that I really do like and am quite fond of. Used it many times. Will never sell that one.

Uncle, that is a very nice collection you have. I wished I would have bought one of those AK47 swords when they were for sale, especially if could have gotten it with a little longer handle and blade.

Were you mostly cutting vegetation? That might explain your preference for the ZTs. The thinner blade profile lends itself more to that kind of work. Nice blade for sure. I can tell you that I usually reprofile my medium to smaller Busses to slice better. But that is just my preference. From reading your first post it sounds like you had an Ergo handled ZTBM. I had the CG BM-E and I have foud the newer Busse FBMs and FFBMs chop much better for me.

But, like many other Busee fans, I love other brands. I plan on trying a Fehrman Thru Hiker simply because the smaller busses just do not fit me.
 
Maybe if you'd stop saying things like "the Busse lifestyle" (WTF is THAT?) people would read your posts more seriously.
 
I don't mind being called a Busse cultist; what I do take issue with is the use of the term "actress" to describe Miss Jolie.
 
Oh come on, you can not deny there is not a Busse lifestyle?! LOL LOL LOL


Trycon, Yes I found the thinner bladed NO ZT, without the coating, to be a much better cutter. But I don't really use it for chopping unless in a real pinch. Whether for thinner or thicker materials, I found the Khuks to be better, due mainly to the blade design and found the handles more comfortable.

Now, if Busse was to make a 10-12 inch Khukuri style blade out of 3/16 or even .25 (but thinning off more towards the edge) with INFI steel and also made a more rounded handle I would definately buy.

I am seriously considering a Ryan Wilson Khukri now, with Rosewood grips! (yeah micarata is more durable, but I love the look and feel of custom wood grips). Emailed Ryan awhile ago and asked if he could make the Khukuri he offers with more of a angle like a traditional Khuk and also a little longer. Said he could.

Also saw some really nice solid Khuks for sale in Cambodia by Citadel knives. Heading over to Malaysia and Cambodia next week, so may buy a couple of Citadels.
 
And just because it was brought up... I do not drink or smoke. I am a straight edge cult member. Great, now I will be excommunicated. ;)
 
About the skinning thing. Our ancestors did it with sharp stones. If a person can't take a Busse knife and skin an animal with it with no problems, I would question his method.
 
Oh come on, you can not deny there is not a Busse lifestyle?! LOL LOL LOL


Trycon, Yes I found the thinner bladed NO ZT, without the coating, to be a much better cutter. But I don't really use it for chopping unless in a real pinch. Whether for thinner or thicker materials, I found the Khuks to be better, due mainly to the blade design and found the handles more comfortable.

Now, if Busse was to make a 10-12 inch Khukuri style blade out of 3/16 or even .25 (but thinning off more towards the edge) with INFI steel and also made a more rounded handle I would definately buy.

I am seriously considering a Ryan Wilson Khukri now, with Rosewood grips! (yeah micarata is more durable, but I love the look and feel of custom wood grips). Emailed Ryan awhile ago and asked if he could make the Khukuri he offers with more of a angle like a traditional Khuk and also a little longer. Said he could.

Also saw some really nice solid Khuks for sale in Cambodia by Citadel knives. Heading over to Malaysia and Cambodia next week, so may buy a couple of Citadels.

If I recall correctly someone started a poll/thread on this. There are a lot of us that would really like to see a Busse Khuk for sure. :D


And the Busse AK is just sweet. Great for SD if you are out of bullets but seems like it would be a good, all around survival sword. Whatever that is. I just like it. :)
 
thombgrogan, could not agree with you more!!!! LOL LOL Her and I had a big falling out, long long story. I will have to honestly say that I can not stand Hollywood liberals. But, I do have to give her a lot of credit and thanks for really jump starting my career and I would not be where I am at today without her faith in me and her and her people offering me the adventures and jobs that they did. And I will say this, though I had a lot of disagreements with her and her people, and I also do not agree with many other things about her, but she had donated a lot of money to help the needy and conservation and humanitarian causes, more so than most acters/actresses. (still can not stand Hollywood though!) Anyway this is getting way off topic. LOL LOL
 
Great for SD if you are out of bullets but seems like it would be a good, all around survival sword. Whatever that is. I just like it.

Yeah, I can see a soldier whipping out a AK sword! LOL LOL LOL Reminds me of the time in Iraq we had a young support soldier show up with a pair of numbchucks attached to his body armor. We razzed him and laughed at him so hard, I think he ended up running off and going AWOL. !!!!!!! LOL LOL
 
About the skinning thing. Our ancestors did it with sharp stones. If a person can't take a Busse knife and skin an animal with it with no problems, I would question his method.

So you are saying that a Busse knife is about the same as a sharpned stone? Finally, another person who agrees with me! LOL LOL LOL

(BTW, never said could not skin, said they performed poor in my opinion compared to other knives. Just like my Chris Reeve Skinner cuts through flesh and fur like butter, much much better that a Sharpend stone, I mean sharpened crow bar, oops I mean .... LOL LOL)
 
So you are saying that a Busse knife is about the same as a sharpned stone? Finally, another person who agrees with me! LOL LOL LOL

Hard for any one to take your post seriously with comments like this. And on a second note: please take it easy with all the "LOL"
 
Well, it is kind of hard to show when I am laughing, or joking without "LOL". Come on lighten up, it is just knives we are talking about, when we get right down to it. Sharpned peices of steel that are used as tools (and many though do happen to be works of art, but still tools). I think many, myself included, get too attached to our material objects we own. A good example of this is when I state my opinion that some other brands knives besides Busse are better for me than a Busse I get responses such as "who are you to state that one brand is better than another" "or your spec ops background must have messed up you head" "you must have an agenda" "You are lying, cause Busse are the best knives for me and always work best for me etc.." But if I was to come out and state that in my experiences that a Busse knife was better for me than some other brand, would the Busse faithful state the same things? "who are you to state a Busse is better than a Cold Steel knife!?" No agenda, just my opinons and experiences and preferences. Maybe sometimes people buy a really expensive material object and then hate to find out a less expensive object works better, or does not bring the same joy, passion, and performance to others. Or become so attached to a forum or group of people that they do not even want to weigh other's opinions outside of that group. Or worse is one who was in their group and then decided to go another way or buy a different product (whether we are talking cars, watches, guns, knives, etc..)

Well, anyway, the Triple shot of Green Bean is starting to wear off, so must be getting to bed. Goodnight and God Speed!!
 
I don't mind being called a Busse cultist; what I do take issue with is the use of the term "actress" to describe Miss Jolie.

I think that might be the funniest thing I have read all day. :D

And just because it was brought up... I do not drink or smoke. I am a straight edge cult member. Great, now I will be excommunicated. ;)

There's nothing wrong with straight edging it Tyrkon. Truth be told I am nearly there myself most of the time.

Hey Thom,

I didn't know you collect Busse knives too. Show us your collection.

He's been trying to stay under the radar, but his cover is blown now. Make with the pics Thom!
 
Now, I will mention a knife brand that I think is pretty tough and fits the bill, that Busse tries to fill as well, but cost a small fraction, no waiting periods and even comes with a decent Sheath. They chopped with them, pryed with them, opened ammo cases with them, beat on them and cut with them. The knives took a lot of abuse and none of them failed. I do not know if a knife could be put through anymore than a knife given to a Cambodian field unit. So the Beckers, especially at the price (I think they were around $70) can not be beat. Plus they are good looking knives. .

I actually owned many of these. They are solid little knives. In fact, I would go so far as to say they are the toughest of all the beckers. However, they are no where near as tough as a busse, swamp rat or scrapyard or ferhman for that matter. In fact a Ranger RD in S7 would smoke it as well.

Plain and simple, I have owned all the beckers, and multiples of each. I have given many away here to forum members and they were used. I sold a few mint ones and I broke a bunch. One thing you do not want to do with a becker is pry laterally. They are much more brittle and will fracture. With little pressure I broke both a BK9 and a BK7 in my stump, I also broke many other knives some of which you mentioned in your list. I have never owned an LTC khukuri nor do I plan to..

In fact I broke them doing stuff like this:



Personally if I had to choose only one knife company to go with, it would be Chris Reeve. Love their one peice designs, very strong and hollow handle. Some of their newer micarta handled Fixed blades and of course all their folding knifes with options of wood inlays or graphics.

Well, just some of my knife thoughts! Cheers.

Here is an interesting note for you. You indicated that busses were to thick. Yet, Reeves are just fine. Do you realize that the blade geometry of a flat ground 2 inch wide 1/4 inch thick knife is actually better than a 1.2 inch wide 1/4 inch thick sabre ground knife like the Reeves? And this is proven when you do actually have to chop something for real and notice that the flat ground blade cuts deeper for a reason. I had a Reeves P1 and P2 and liked them both. They were solid and tough, however, I much prefered the cutting ability of the SHBM and the weight was close even though the busse had more blade. However, I will agree that when just analyzing them it is hard to see how they can be better, but if you chop you will see what I mean. Maybe that is the reason why the cutting/chopping competition blades are flat ground like the Busse BM.

Edge toughness on the Busse is also much higher than on the knives you mentioned, here is an example of that:

This blade belongs to Luke Freeouf, who post here as Lurkers. One of the things he was interested in was my impression of its edge durability.

To have a look at the edge durability I first just chopped up a fair amount of wood, (about 1000 chops total, not all on the same day). This was fresh wood, fir, pine and spruce as well as seasoned drift wood, and various scrap lumber. Knots were cut through frequently. The edge was fully sharpened, using waterstones and a CrO loaded strop, several times to enable the detection of even minor rolling. No damage was induced on the edge during any of the chopping.

The blade was then chopped into nails while they rested on a 4x4 pressure treated block. The nails would be driven into the wood from the force of the impacts, and cuts made up to about one quarter of the way through a three and a half inch common nail. The edge was not visibly damaged, just blunted. A 510 g ball pein hammer was then used to pound the knife into the various nails . Because the wood kept collapsing under the nail, the best that could be achieved was a cut about half way through the three and a half inch common nail. These various poundings (a half dozen) put small dents in the edge, from one to two mm wide, and the damaged region was up to 0.015" thick.

Some harder chopping into more nails was performed later. This time on harder wood which was higher up off the floor so I could get more power behind the knife. The cuts into the nails were deeper, the damage induced was more bending, but less extensive than the hammer assisted cuts. I then did some nail chopping on concrete. Since this didn't give like the wood, the blade cut far deeper into the nails. I could get penetration up to half way through the three and a half inch common nail. I then used a four and a half pound beach rock to pound the knife through the nails. The larger nails took one to two hits to be cut completely through. The damage from this was less than the hammer pounding, and the concrete tended to just mash the edge down a little in the impact areas, just blunting.

I then chopped into the head of the hammer. The knife made large cuts into the head, about one mm deep, and up to one cm long. This did no visible damage to the knife, just blunted it. I then found a piece of a concrete block that I had chopped up earlier and whacked that into little bits. These were hits heavy enough to break the concrete apart and send sparks flying. The rock contacts tended to mash the edge down, and you could see abrasion lines in the edge were the rocks had cut into the steel. A lot of impaction had taken place, but no direct fracturing. I then stabbed the tip into the pieces a half a dozen times breaking them up into smaller bits, some tip impaction, but nothing significant.

The attached picture was taken at this time.

Since the concrete didn't do any major damage I chopped into the beach rock a half a dozen times. This induced more impaction than the concrete, no surprise, it is a lot harder. I was hitting the rock hard enough to send it flying feet across the floor and producing visible sparks. The edge was impacted up to 0.035" across, the blade thickness was a little less than this behind the impacted region, about 0.025"-0.030". Again no fracture, you could clearly see the squashed steel. I then stabbed the tip into the rock, sending sparks flying and the rock shooting across the floor again. I did this a half a dozen times and it impacted the tip about one mm.

I then held the knife out at arms length and examined it for damage. You could tell that the regions that had been whacked into the beach rock were a little impacted, but overall it didn't look that heavily used. I took a few shots, and could not tell from the pictures that it had changed significantly from before. Cheap camera though, no ability to do close ups. So I take the blade and put it at a forty five degree angle and then give the edge a whack with the hammer. Success. This bends a piece of the edge enough that the ductility is exceeded and it tears off. This removed a piece of the edge about three mm long and the blade was 0.030" thick behind the damaged region. This damage was visible at arms length.

How was the cutting ability effected? After the concrete chopping the blade still had the ability to slice cardboard, chop wood, and slice various cords in the regions of heaviest damage. Though you could tell of course it was seriously blunted. After I whacked it into the beach rock there was no fine cutting ability left in those impact areas. You could still chop wood, but you were crushing it a lot, and the performance was seriously degraded. Of course there were lots of sharp areas left on the blade. Time to sharpen the blade on a small belt sander (1x30"), would be a couple of minutes, just a few passes per side would eliminate 90% of the damage, sharpening by hand, it would take less than half an hour.

The edge on the BM-E was the standard Busse asymettric edge, wider on one edge than on the other (0.038 x 0.058 -> 18.1, 0.048 x 0.089 -> 15.1).

-Cliff
 
Hmmm lots of generalizations and opinions dressed up to appear as fact....what was your point again? LOL


I don't think you necessarily have an agenda....I do question your skill when it comes to using a blade. I own one Busse....yup, just one. I use it often. I have owned many high end blades( and still do) and have been most impressed with the Busse performance and would readily compare it to a Chris Reeve or any other high end blade I own. To suggest Busse owners are for the most part ....collectors...is simply untrue.



If you do have an agenda...its against those who actually buy Busse.

A picture I posted in that other thread.....
126_2642.jpg
 
Great for SD if you are out of bullets but seems like it would be a good, all around survival sword. Whatever that is. I just like it.

Yeah, I can see a soldier whipping out a AK sword! LOL LOL LOL Reminds me of the time in Iraq we had a young support soldier show up with a pair of numbchucks attached to his body armor. We razzed him and laughed at him so hard, I think he ended up running off and going AWOL. !!!!!!! LOL LOL

Poor guy. Live and learn I guess. But the AK is still fun. :D
 
Bronco
Moderator Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Los Angeles, Peoples Republik of Kalifornia
Posts: 5,390

Isstaipei,
I reported last year on a situation I experienced with an INFI blade that very well addresses your particular curiosity. While hacking through some dense springy vegetation clearing a trail in the Sierras, I accidently made what was very close to a full power chop into the vertical face of an adjacent granite boulder. The full force of impact was focused directly onto a 2 to 3 mm area of the cutting edge near the choil.

Though the indentation in the edge was readily visible, even under these extreme circumstances the INFI steel tended to deform rather than chip out. The relative strength of INFI was apparent as well, as I was pleasantly surprised that the damage was limited to such a small area. A few passes with a diamond rod hone back at camp realigned most of the displaced steel, and all but erased the damage. No doubt this tiny area is now weaker than the remainder of the edge, but I feel this kind of inherent steel performance is pretty much optimal for an outdoors/survival/hard-use type blade.

I think Cliff pretty much hit the nail on the head when he described INFI as a steel which is unique in its ability to score so highly in so many of the different categories we use to rate steel performance. It is unusual to find a steel that can exhibit such high levels of wear resistance and toughness and strength and corrosion resistance, etc., etc., all at the same time.

You may notice when sharpening an INFI blade that it's somewhat more difficult than normal to remove the final wire edge. The INFI burr seems to have more of a tendency to flop back and forth from side to side when compared to the burrs I have raised with other steels. CPM-3V is a notable exception here; a steel which appears to share some of INFI's other strengths as well.

------------------
Semper Fi

-Bill

06-08-2001, 09:13 AM
Cliff Stamp
Banned Join Date: Oct 1998
Location: Where ever I go, there I am.
Posts: 17,562

Problems with sharpening are usually caused by a poor choice of bevel/geometry and/or steel. I have a blade made out of CPM-10V which probably has one of the worst machinabilities of all the cutlery metals. However it resharpens easily.

The metal it well suited to what I use it for (low stress cutting), so it stays crisp with no deformation nor fracture. As well there is just a hint of an edge bevel at a very acute angle, so only a bare minimum of steel has to be removed for a complete sharpening.

As well, proper hones must be used, a high quality diamond abrasive (DMT) will chew through the hardest, most wear resistance steel like its butter. SiC hones will handle all but the upper range of such steels (the very high Vanadium ones), easily.


Anyway, in regards to INFI, my Battle Mistress has a light dual convex edge and I usually maintain it on strop, first canvas and then a couple of passes on the leather side which is loaded with CrO if necessary. This assumes there isn't visible edge deformation that needs to be removed.

The last time I fully sharpened it was a week or so ago as I was starting a comparison and wanted it at optimal performance. I reground the bevel fully on an 8" x-coarse DMT hone, 100 strokes per side, then 50 on a fine, then 30 passes on 1000 grit SiC sandpaper to lightly convex the bevel and finally, 25 on canvas loaded with a white wax/chauk paste.

The blade would push shave with the lighest of effort and cut free standing coarse hair easily (free shave my beard for example). It would push cut photocopy paper as well as slice into freehanging papertowel. The polish could have been improved further with a CrO buff, but I would rather not lose the slicing ability.

I have been working with it this last while. So far it has seen 359 full powered slices into various woods and 508 hard chops in various scrap and felled wood, the latter a mixture of wrist snaps, elbow swings and shoulder drives. Mostly clear wood, only about a couple of dozen knots cut through (they add too much variation to the results I save them for durability comparisions). As well a dozen or so straight cuts through dirty 1/2" poly, and a few test slices.

The edge is still aggressive enough to slice through the 1/2" poly with no slips and only about an inch of travel on a loop-through pull. No edge flattening or deformation is visible. It would be brought back to very near 100% with just some work on a strop. More definate edge retention work later after I finish the cutting.

-Cliff


and someone said they can't cut LOL, LOL, LOL:D
 
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