Spyderco Endura 4 or Benchmade 710

[Thomas Linton]

And those rulings have holes so big that even a 1st year law student can walk through them.

I think some of you guys are just paranoid.

Obviously, you are upset with someone.

As for me, I merely point out the law as stated by the federal courts and as it presently exists in one state, Ohio. As I point out, one problem in Ohio is the LACK of "rulings." by Ohio courts to explain -- and limit the interpretations of -- the language of the statute that I quoted.

I take no position on the issues raised in your disagreement with others regarding "waved" knives simply because I have no legal opinion on that topic.

And sir, with due respect, no attorney (although perhaps a first-year law student) would ever promise a favorable outcome in court when there is no reported decisional law on the issue.

 

[allenC]

Obviously, you are upset with someone.

No, you're wrong...I'm not upset with anyone.

But I do think that if a person is afraid to carry a waved Endura 4 because he thinks that the cops are going to stop and frisk him for no other reason than simple walking down the street, then that person is a bit paranoid.

 

[brownshoe]

Paranoid is "exhibiting or characterized by extreme fear or distrust of others." Depending upon your skin color, socioeconmic status, identifiable subculture, the neighborhood you happen to be in plus the cop you happen to be dealing with, being paranoid can be considered prudent. If you don't believe that, I assume you live in a low crime area, where you fit the description of the sterotypical decent citizen. Just don't pull over in my neighborhood or they will probably stop you because you fit the description of somebody looking for drugs or sex. Our local statute allows for folding knives concealed in the pocket up to 4" blade length but disallows any knife construed as being carried as a weapon...this includes kitchen knives and could include a waved endura. Do you want to be the test case? Is that paranoid? Not IMHO.

 

[allenC]

Paranoid is "exhibiting or characterized by extreme fear or distrust of others." Depending upon your skin color, socioeconmic status, identifiable subculture, the neighborhood you happen to be in plus the cop you happen to be dealing with, being paranoid can be considered prudent. If you don't believe that, I assume you live in a low crime area, where you fit the description of the sterotypical decent citizen. Just don't pull over in my neighborhood or they will probably stop you because you fit the description of somebody looking for drugs or sex. Our local statute allows for folding knives concealed in the pocket up to 4" blade length but disallows any knife construed as being carried as a weapon...this includes kitchen knives and could include a waved endura. Do you want to be the test case? Is that paranoid? Not IMHO.

Maybe you should just stick to pepperspray and a whistle...

 

[brownshoe]

Whistles are great. I've given every woman I care about who rides the bus a nice small Acme Thunderer. They've been successfully used more than once.

 

[rifon2]

Reasonable suspicion is all it takes for a pat down. However, what is reasonable to me may not be to you.

True statement, as far as it goes.

But, for legal purposes, it doesn't matter what is reaonable to
you or me.

What matters is what the statutes and court decisions define as
"reasonable suspicion" sufficient to do a pat-down.

 

[rifon2]

deleted - double post

 

[Sal Glesser]

You are correct Mr. Glesser about the different ways knives can fall into prohbited classes. That's my point with the wave. Many places prohibit knives based upon intent. What is the intent of the wave when there is a version that can be opened with a hole? If you are not police, rescue, fire, etc. the police can assume the intent was weapon. You are arrested and you get to explain the situation to a judge/jury. Some people forget that the mere fact of carrying a knife for self defense is sufficient cause to prove intent to use it as a weapon. I've read self defense columns where the spyderco rescue was recommended because it's purpose designed for rescue, not self defense, but the heavy serrations and ease of opening make it a wicked slasher. One of the first self defense knives that i ever got was a hawk billed linoleum cutter or pruner my uncle, a cop, took from a street fighter. That was my first lesson in carrying a knife that had could not be assumed to be a weapon.

Mr. Brownshoe,

Unfortunately, what you say is probably true in most places.

I imagine in time, most of the knives will some have some ordinance against them somewhere. The prohibitive laws regarding knives only seem to get more restrictive.

The argument for a wave is "faster, more efficient retrieval with one hand". the same argument used for autos, semi-autos, one hand openers, gravity and inertia knives and even fixed blades. Where the lines are drawn as to legal or not depends on where you are. In some areas, even knives that lock open are prohibitive.

Since any "sharp pointy thing" can be used for defense, prudence would dictate a more benign model, unless purpose demands more muscle.

Spyderco primarily promotes our "hole openers" with strong detents for that very reason, especially for civilian use, but we also readily accept the fact that the market has more diversified demands.

sal