Spyderco, no longer the value it once was...

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RamZar said:
ZT uses a mix of foreign and U.S. steel although it's trending more towards Elmax & M390 as evidenced by the upcoming new models: 0562, 0526CF, 0620 and 0620CF.

U.S.: 154CM, S30V, S35VN, 3V
Foreign: Elmax, M390
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Not only trending but if you look at the ratio as a whole, they (ZT Kershaw) heavily use foreign steel from 8cr to Sandviks and on to BU steels that most LE and reg production ZT's use.

Nothing wrong with that of course, just used it to support my argument that ZT which is KAI deals with the foreign market like Spyderco does. Spyderco doesnt have a separate line, they are all branded Spyderco. ZT being a USA only line makes people think of it as this all American company. If thats the case then Spyderco should be credited with having an All Ameican line too on this thread.
 
hardheart said:
Inextricably tied. Low capacity is why customs cost more, with one knife taking weeks, months, or even years to be completed. High capacity is why Victorinox blades are sold cheap, spitting out 1,000 Classics a day (I believe that is the correct number, at least from a few years ago). Also the reason different Spydercos have different prices. Yes, materials & design matter, but they matter specifically because it affects how many can be made for a given amount of input.
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Cant disagree with that as it is true but every situation is still unique and neither of us know how Spyderco is really run. Coming from Sal himself, he said that the Golden facility is swamped. So kuch so that new models are queued two to three years back. We were talking about the S110v Manix, until Golden finishes expansion, popular models will run dry from time to time, a victim of its own success. Judging from past threads about the knife, it is widely known as a high value model. Save for those who hate FRN.
 
vwb563 said:
I have to agree with BradT. I had a Manix in S110V. I hated that cheap feeling thing. Wish they would put the 110V blade in G-10 Manix handle. I also agree that Kershaw / ZT is the best bang for your buck of all the knife manufacturers. Plus the ZT's are American made. Not Taiwan or China made like some that cost just as much. That's my opinion.
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The point of the Manix 2 lightweight in S110v was weight and value

FRN was used for price and weight. G10 slabs would require full liners, thus missing the whole point.


They could have made it with Ti and CF but then people would have a cow about that.


The S110v manix is a great working knife, not a safe queen.

I have a Dice too, it's all pretty in Ti and CF but I paid more for looks. The CTS XHP blade is legit though but I'm not taking it to go cut up bait and clean fish like I did the Manix
 
My friend just bought a new Native 5 FRN, for about $65. You can get plenty of new "working class" Spyderco blades for under 100$. I understand the sentiment, yes they are moving away from "value" knives and more towards higher end materials (CF handles, more exotic steels). I think that's why they came out with the Byrd line... so they could offer value there, while exploring more interesting things with the core brand. I love BM and ZT stuff too, but they don't match the variety (blade shapes, grinds, steel types, handle materials etc.) that Spyderco has been putting out for a while now.
 
M0NK said:
My friend just bought a new Native 5 FRN, for about $65. You can get plenty of new "working class" Spyderco blades for under 100$. I understand the sentiment, yes they are moving away from "value" knives and more towards higher end materials (CF handles, more exotic steels). I think that's why they came out with the Byrd line... so they could offer value there, while exploring more interesting things with the core brand. I love BM and ZT stuff too, but they don't match the variety (blade shapes, grinds, steel types, handle materials etc.) that Spyderco has been putting out for a while now.
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Damn.


I may have to pick that one up too.


CTS XHP is a sweet steel
 
Sunyata said:
The point of the Manix 2 lightweight in S110v was weight and value

FRN was used for price and weight.
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The weight issue I can see but the value thing I'm not to sure about. Around $120 for a blade, a ball bearing, and spring seems a little much to me even if the blade is 110V because you sure ain't getting much else for the price. That's my opinion.
 
Just wait till inflation starts creeping into raw material prices like it has food prices already. Americans aren't ready for the inflation that's coming.
 
vwb563 said:
The weight issue I can see but the value thing I'm not to sure about. Around $120 for a blade, a ball bearing, and spring seems a little much to me even if the blade is 110V because you sure ain't getting much else for the price. That's my opinion.
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The value aspect for me is a user knife in top notch steel (it really is, I've gotten bored of trying to wear it out) that you usually don't see in this price range in a light (for a knife this size it's crazy), thin, platform with a solid lock, and scales that will withstand being used and luckily for me easily washable to get fish gunk off completely.
 
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vwb563 said:
The weight issue I can see but the value thing I'm not to sure about. Around $120 for a blade, a ball bearing, and spring seems a little much to me even if the blade is 110V because you sure ain't getting much else for the price. That's my opinion.
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Average price is $106. The original BD1 steel version is $70. You do the math, the price has a lot to do with the S110v upgrade. No one offers the steel at $200, heck even $300. Only other s110v used was the LE 560CF which was $320 and up. Midtrchs and custom makers rarely use it either. Its difficulty to grind and heat treat adds significantly to the cost.

I see their use of the steel at such a price point as a positive thing.
 
I'm incredibly satisfied with the value of all the Spyderco knives I own. Here's what I paid from left to right:

$125, $99, $65, $59, $55, $38

 
Kershaw offered it, 110V, in the Shallot series a few years back for around $60-$70. For that price you got the 110V blade, full stainless steel handles, the Kershaw "Speedsafe" assisted opening mechanism, a blade flipper, and a true pocket clip instead of a bent piece of wire. This was true value in a knife. Don't take me wrong, I love most Spydercos myself, just not crazy about their FRN knives.
 
vwb563 said:
Kershaw offered it, 110V, in the Shallot series a few years back for around $60-$70. For that price you got the 110V blade, full stainless steel handles, the Kershaw "Speedsafe" assisted opening mechanism, a blade flipper, and a true pocket clip instead of a bent piece of wire. This was true value in a knife. Don't take me wrong, I love most Spydercos myself, just not crazy about their FRN knives.
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They need to bring it back then. At that price.
 
While I'm not at all a fan of the FRN handles, you can't argue about the extreme value of the Manix2 S110V for about $100 in today's dollars!
 
Since Kershaw has opted to produce mostly China-made knives, and put "ZT" on their US made knives and doubled the prices, the incentive to keep Spyderco knives' prices down has vanished.
 
vwb563 said:
Kershaw offered it, 110V, in the Shallot series a few years back for around $60-$70. For that price you got the 110V blade, full stainless steel handles, the Kershaw "Speedsafe" assisted opening mechanism, a blade flipper, and a true pocket clip instead of a bent piece of wire. This was true value in a knife. Don't take me wrong, I love most Spydercos myself, just not crazy about their FRN knives.
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I was looking at that. It was a nice buy. I doubt it would be that price now though, that was during the recession when everything was cheaper.

I bet it would be close to the Manix now.


Odd sidenote, it looks like they ran those blades softer too.
 
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