Spyderco Southard: Excessive Praise and Hype? (Or: Purchase One Now!)

Wether or not the Southard fades (which I doubt it will), it'll be permanently in the rotation along with my Stretches and mini grip which never get taken off.
 
What has that go to do with anything? Based on that logic ball, axis, compression, spine, frame, and liner locks wouldn't exist either.

Most of the people who are going to buy this knife are going to spend more time flipping it than cutting anything with it. It would seem that a lock designed to take this type of abuse and allow for an ambidextrous, one handed, release would be more desirable.
 
harleyguy02 said:
Brass03-- I am wondering... can you please list for me the ball or compression lock flipper folders that are curently produced??

I am not trying to be a smart A**. I am interested in how many other manufactuers/ custom makers make flippers that are not framelocks? I am guessing you are not smarter than the majority of knife makers, so there MUST be a technical design reason that a high majority of flippers are framelocks. I will look forward to your response..
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There aren't any that I can think of besides the benchmade 300sn which uses the axis lock, and my most accounts, the results are less than impressive.

There is a very simple reason flippers tend to be frame and liner locks, and that reason is the ball detent. A strong detent is necessary to ensure good flipping action, a ball detent allows that, and frame and liner locks are the lock types that feature a ball detent. A compression lock may be possible, but it would be tricky since the location of the stop pin is integral to the lock design and would force the flipper to be too low on the handle to build up enough tension for a good flipping action. Look at all of the knives that flip well, all of them have a flipper that is nearly perfectly in line with the pivot, lowering the flipper to compensate for the stop pin on the compression lock would make the flipping action sluggish and unreliable. As for the caged ball lock, it would be impossible to have a flipper with the cbbl. The ball bearing sits on a steel spring and rod that is held between the liners and a solid steel back spacer. If you've even handled any knife with the ball lock you know there isn't anywhere for a flipper to go. So really, frame and liner locks are the only reasonable choice for flipper knives.
 
harleyguy02 said:
Educate me...who makes flippers, that are not frame locks?
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Kershaw and ZT. ZT0350 is a liner lock. I have a Kershaw Leek G10 s30v model with a liner lock. Kershaw Speedbump has a stud lock. The majority of flippers are frame or liner locks, but there are a couple examples out there of other lock types.
 
Fanglekai said:
Kershaw and ZT. ZT0350 is a liner lock. I have a Kershaw Leek G10 s30v model with a liner lock. Kershaw Speedbump has a stud lock. The majority of flippers are frame or liner locks, but there are a couple examples out there of other lock types.
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Speedbump's flipper and stud lock is an awesome combination. Hate the clip, and sharpening it, but love the knife.
 
Brasso3 said:
Well pardon me your highness for having a different opinion on what type of lock would be better.

A ball or copression lock would be ambidextrous. But let's all bow to the Spydie fan boy and kiss his flipper.
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No, thinking a different lock would be cool, or better is all good, it is your snide comment, "I understand that there are some folks who have developed the bad habit of having to flip open their knives all day long in order to survive" I actually like the idea of flippers and different lock styles, if a compression lock with a flipper was physically possible that would be awesome. It just seems anytime I see your comments they have some extra jab that adds nothing productive to the conversation, and are meant to get under someone's skin or get a flame war going, hence asking you to troll somewhere else (meaning not BF).
 
I was not totally sold on this knife because of all the hype. Then last week I got to handle one. Very few knives have every given me this kinda thrill. Sorta like Chris Mathews talking about BHO - I get a thrill up my leg.
 
bobnery said:
You know I think I'm a freak when it comes to stuff like this. I can operate all my "right" handed knives better with my left, and I am a right handed guy. Seb, Um, SnG, Millie, PM2 are all easier for me in left hand
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I couldn't go quite as far as you did, especially on the PM2, but in general I totally agree with you - and it makes for easier sharing of knives with people I trust (< half a dozen people out of the planet's population) and easier resale if I decide to move the knife on.
 
"I understand that there are some folks who have developed the bad habit of having to flip open their knives all day long in order to survive"
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It was a jibe. But it wasn't meant to be taken negatively. I guess my dry humor doesn't come thru over a keyboard.
 
Brasso3 said:
It was a jibe. But it wasn't meant to be taken negatively. I guess my dry humor doesn't come thru over a keyboard.
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I got it as humor, and have been guilty of that survival technique, but I think it may strike a nerve with some people on the forums, because it has an element of truth
 
mkjellgren said:
So really, frame and liner locks are the only reasonable choice for flipper knives.
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Really? I better jot a note off to Brian Tighe right away and tell him stop making Tighe Coons. Button lock flippers got no reason to live!

[video=youtube;WSXbn-uRgw0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSXbn-uRgw0[/video]
 
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Good knife or not, I think its ugly. I also have a list of spyderco's and other knives I wish to aquire before getting any new models or even spending over $200 on a knife at all.
 
Brasso3 said:
It was a jibe. But it wasn't meant to be taken negatively. I guess my dry humor doesn't come thru over a keyboard.
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Taken as dry humor then. Communication online can be frustrating for sure. I apologize for over-reacting.
 
Brasso3 said:
I'm still trying to figure out why they would make a flipper and then use a framelock? I understand that there are some folks who have developed the bad habit of having to flip open their knives all day long in order to survive, but that seems contradictory to the use of a framelock that gets worn out more so than other lock types by just that type of action.
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I think the only knives you're not supposed to flick open are CR knives. HEH.
 
Swoop03 said:
Good knife or not, I think its ugly.
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You are not alone. It seems that most of the forum swoons at the mention of this knife, but every time I look at it I think it's somehow gotten even less attractive than the last time I saw it. I'm a bit of Benchmade guy, but I feel the same way about their new flipper as well. I'm all for utility, but something doesn't have to be ugly to be useful.
 
bld522 said:
Really? I better jot a note off to Brian Tighe right away and tell him stop making Tighe Coons. Button lock flippers got no reason to live!
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Part of the reason that particular knife flips so well it the location of its flipper in relation to the pivot. Notice how the flipper is even with or actually even above the pivot, that allows for a lot of force to be built up when pushing the flipper. Add to that the fact that its a custom with a bearing system and zero sideways tension on the blade from a frame or liner and of course you're going to end up with a very smooth flipper. I would like to know how the detent works on that brian tighe though, a knife that smooth must have some means of keeping the blade closed, otherwise it would be opening up on you all the time. My point was that regardless of the couple of noted exceptions there is a reason most flipper knives are frame or liner locks, and that is that the detent is a way to build up pressure when flipping thus aiding in the flipping action.
 
evilgreg said:
You are not alone. It seems that most of the forum swoons at the mention of this knife, but every time I look at it I think it's somehow gotten even less attractive than the last time I saw it. I'm a bit of Benchmade guy, but I feel the same way about their new flipper as well. I'm all for utility, but something doesn't have to be ugly to be useful.
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I'm not particularly fond of the lumpy lines of the spine or the pointless Sypdie hole but it's not butt ugly, it's interesting. Handle one and you'd probably like it but I agree, it ain't going to win a beauty contest. After watching that YT bld552 posted I want Tighe....now that's a pretty knife.
 
mkjellgren said:
Part of the reason that particular knife flips so well it the location of its flipper in relation to the pivot. Notice how the flipper is even with or actually even above the pivot, that allows for a lot of force to be built up when pushing the flipper. Add to that the fact that its a custom with a bearing system and zero sideways tension on the blade from a frame or liner and of course you're going to end up with a very smooth flipper. I would like to know how the detent works on that brian tighe though, a knife that smooth must have some means of keeping the blade closed, otherwise it would be opening up on you all the time. My point was that regardless of the couple of noted exceptions there is a reason most flipper knives are frame or liner locks, and that is that the detent is a way to build up pressure when flipping thus aiding in the flipping action.
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I understand. Clearly, however, frame and liner locks are NOT the only reasonable choices for flipper knives. To say otherwise flies in the face of reality.

You bring up an interesting point. In order to properly engineer a framelock/linerlock flipper, the detent has to allow sufficient resistance to build up to overcome the lateral tension both framelocks and linerlocks put on the blade during deployment. From a purely mechanical perspective, having to use one design element to overcome another is not the best way to engineer a system. You'd be far better off incorporating a lock that doesn't put ANY lateral tension on the blade during deployment. Can a non-AO flipper be designed that doesn't have to overcome it's own locking mechanism to deploy properly? Check out the video I posted and then you tell me.
 
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Man I really want one of these but I think Ill just buy another USA made PM2 and XL manix and still have enough left over for a case of Beer.
 
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