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"Squatchers"
- Thread starter coaldigger
- Start date
Erasmus, Now you're just being silly.
I'm not saying they don't exist. I'm just saying that it's not likely that they are a normal mammal. You know like all the other ones, leaving scat and carcasses. You asked why the discussion tends toward supernatural, well that's why. In all seriousness though, I'd love to hear some sound reasoning on why this species doesn't leave physical evidence. I can accept that they're smart enough to not leave much evidence, but I have a hard time believing that they leave none. So explain it to me, why don't we have a body?
I'm not saying they don't exist. I'm just saying that it's not likely that they are a normal mammal. You know like all the other ones, leaving scat and carcasses. You asked why the discussion tends toward supernatural, well that's why. In all seriousness though, I'd love to hear some sound reasoning on why this species doesn't leave physical evidence. I can accept that they're smart enough to not leave much evidence, but I have a hard time believing that they leave none. So explain it to me, why don't we have a body?
Not to make a arguement for or against Sasquatch, let's look at other aspect's of finding evidence. My thought's are centered around Deer and Hog hunting when I form these opinion's.
Scat/ without knowing the diet specifically, would be hard to determine the shelf life of such scat. If they eat a varied diet, at some point, there should be hair in the fecal matter. I would be under the impression that scat with hair mixed in, would endure the longest. Human fecal matter does not fair well out in nature, or that has been my observation's. So, in my mind scat, fecal matter or whatever you choose to call it, would be difficult to find. I have never been able to determine the number's of Deer or Hog's based on fecal matter, as it can be difficult to find and sometimes, can be downright rediculous to find. Since I know the diet of Deer and Hog's and what the feces look like, I would expect Big Foot to share some of the similar food's so............. I would pretty much think, scat is difficult to use to identify a Big Foot due to decomposition, not impossible, but difficult not knowing what to look for, what it look's like, or more specific, where to look? I am not going to pick up and examine every turd I find in the wood's much less bring it home to send it to be analyzed. If Big Foot likes to take his business up in tree's for example, you just made it much more difficult to find. If BF had a tendency to bury it, eat it, smear it, ect, it could indeed become extremely difficult to find it. Since we don't know it's habit's, we are left to guess. Is this reasonable thinking in regard's to BF scat?
Land Mass/
Let's say around my house only, with my Hunting Club and a couple other's that join it, let's say that is 8 to 10,000 acre's. Now, let's dump a Gorilla at a random spot in that 10,000 acre's and turn me loose to go and find some evidence. When I picture in my head the size of that land mass, it would be a crap shoot at best on finding anything. Let's say like a Deer or Hog, this Gorilla actively tries to avoid me like Deer and Hog's do except, he has the ability to climb in tree's, you just made it much harder to find. It is thought that BF is a mostly nocturnal creature, this add's even more difficulty. I can see where finding it on even small parcel's of land like 10,000 acre's, could be very difficult, to down right impossible, and that's assuming, I had unlimited time, resources, no responsibilities to other people like, Wife, Children, Parent's, Grandparent's, Friend's. At the same time, I would need someone to spend a lot of time making sure all my need's are met, so that I can dedicate my life to finding this creature. This would require a lot of money, not to mention, a complete and utter dedication and motivation, to continue this for month's or year's at a time and that is keeping it in 10,000 acre's, a rule this animal is not going to follow. While the Human population increases, it may seem that there are no hiding places left however, this simply is not accurate and there remain many large tract's of wood's, mountain's, swamp's, ect. Just yesterday I watched a program that stated in CO, there are huge area's in the caves and canyon's that are unexplored something along the lines of 98%. The state's with huge National Park's and rugged mountainous area's where people rarely leave the trail's, as it's just too risky.Ever watch, I should not be alive, TV show? It's a good example of what happen's when the unprepared stray off the trail's or have unexpected accident's. It is known that YellowStone National Park has area's that have never had a foot on them as they are to rugged and remote. Ditto for Alaska, Canada, Maine, the Yukon and Boreal forest ect, ect, it would be a huge list to name all of them.
Technology/ I have read many comment's on how technology would make it easy to find this creature. Night Vision, Thermal Imaging, Camera trap's ect. I think too much emphasis is placed on technology. I think we are lead to believe technology is more than it really is, as a control over us. They want us to believe there is nothing, we can do, and get away with it, because of technology. That may become true one day, but don't think we are there yet although, they work day and night to make all this technology a reality.
Why am I of this opinion? The TV show Border War's! Simply, they.... Border Patrol & ICE cannot stop massive load's of drug's entering this country, even at manned checkpoint's. The drug's that are found.... a lot are due to nothing more than the suspect acting nervous, a occasional dog alerting, or downright stupidity of the carrier. It is admitted, the percentage they seize is tiny, compared with what actually comes over. They cannot stop Illegal Alien's from crossing the border's with impunity. I was most amazed when they acknowledged, a foggy night, practically render's there technology useless and watched as the Illegal's jumped the fence on a foggy night and this is at manned checkpoint's with Camera's, both Night and Thermal, and a big fence.... not in the middle of nowhere where they cross at will. How many Murder's and Abduction's happen daily and are never solved? It is known..... most cases that are solved are due to friend's and family committing the crime. When it is done randomly by stranger's, they are most likely, never solved. The number of people that go missing every year is huge. So, technology has it's limitation's.
Government search/ This was also brought up. Okay, with this economy, who is going to spend million's or billion's of dollar's to see if BF is real? Talk about political suicide, not to mention the media circus that would follow. While a government funded search would most likely be the most successful chance at finding BF, I don't look for that to happen. Even if it did, it would take a enormous effort and some highly motivated and dedicated people to pull it off. Now, let's say they did find one, would they release that information to the public or would they keep it a secret? In that regard, it is similar to the Alien question? IMO, they would not release any information that could/would challenge the power and religious structure we have in place. NO WAY!
A Body/ is subjected to the same rule's of scat from decomposition along with the body. Ever go looking for Deer shed's? You know they are there, however, are hard to find, get eat by rodent's and squirrel's. I have Deer hunted many year's yet have found only a couple in my lifetime and only a few skull's or a bone or two. Human remain's are dumped all the time, yet few are ever found even when the criminal admit's to where they are and can take a large task force of investigator's to find's the remain's.
I write this only to stimulate your thought process and not to argue for or against BF. Go on Google Earth and look at the huge area's we still have. Is BF real? I don't know, but think some answer's are given without enough thought and only wish to stimulate the thought process. I still believe they should pressure Bob Gimlin into a lie detector test for the claim's he has made of course, this does nothing for the long held belief's of the Native American's which go back way before their time. At any rate, I have enjoyed reading this BF thread and the opinion's for and against BF, as both sides are equally valid. I have difficulty believing myself, but do consider some of the variables listed above. It would be fantastic for this creature to exsist, I will say That
Scat/ without knowing the diet specifically, would be hard to determine the shelf life of such scat. If they eat a varied diet, at some point, there should be hair in the fecal matter. I would be under the impression that scat with hair mixed in, would endure the longest. Human fecal matter does not fair well out in nature, or that has been my observation's. So, in my mind scat, fecal matter or whatever you choose to call it, would be difficult to find. I have never been able to determine the number's of Deer or Hog's based on fecal matter, as it can be difficult to find and sometimes, can be downright rediculous to find. Since I know the diet of Deer and Hog's and what the feces look like, I would expect Big Foot to share some of the similar food's so............. I would pretty much think, scat is difficult to use to identify a Big Foot due to decomposition, not impossible, but difficult not knowing what to look for, what it look's like, or more specific, where to look? I am not going to pick up and examine every turd I find in the wood's much less bring it home to send it to be analyzed. If Big Foot likes to take his business up in tree's for example, you just made it much more difficult to find. If BF had a tendency to bury it, eat it, smear it, ect, it could indeed become extremely difficult to find it. Since we don't know it's habit's, we are left to guess. Is this reasonable thinking in regard's to BF scat?
Land Mass/
Let's say around my house only, with my Hunting Club and a couple other's that join it, let's say that is 8 to 10,000 acre's. Now, let's dump a Gorilla at a random spot in that 10,000 acre's and turn me loose to go and find some evidence. When I picture in my head the size of that land mass, it would be a crap shoot at best on finding anything. Let's say like a Deer or Hog, this Gorilla actively tries to avoid me like Deer and Hog's do except, he has the ability to climb in tree's, you just made it much harder to find. It is thought that BF is a mostly nocturnal creature, this add's even more difficulty. I can see where finding it on even small parcel's of land like 10,000 acre's, could be very difficult, to down right impossible, and that's assuming, I had unlimited time, resources, no responsibilities to other people like, Wife, Children, Parent's, Grandparent's, Friend's. At the same time, I would need someone to spend a lot of time making sure all my need's are met, so that I can dedicate my life to finding this creature. This would require a lot of money, not to mention, a complete and utter dedication and motivation, to continue this for month's or year's at a time and that is keeping it in 10,000 acre's, a rule this animal is not going to follow. While the Human population increases, it may seem that there are no hiding places left however, this simply is not accurate and there remain many large tract's of wood's, mountain's, swamp's, ect. Just yesterday I watched a program that stated in CO, there are huge area's in the caves and canyon's that are unexplored something along the lines of 98%. The state's with huge National Park's and rugged mountainous area's where people rarely leave the trail's, as it's just too risky.Ever watch, I should not be alive, TV show? It's a good example of what happen's when the unprepared stray off the trail's or have unexpected accident's. It is known that YellowStone National Park has area's that have never had a foot on them as they are to rugged and remote. Ditto for Alaska, Canada, Maine, the Yukon and Boreal forest ect, ect, it would be a huge list to name all of them.
Technology/ I have read many comment's on how technology would make it easy to find this creature. Night Vision, Thermal Imaging, Camera trap's ect. I think too much emphasis is placed on technology. I think we are lead to believe technology is more than it really is, as a control over us. They want us to believe there is nothing, we can do, and get away with it, because of technology. That may become true one day, but don't think we are there yet although, they work day and night to make all this technology a reality.
Why am I of this opinion? The TV show Border War's! Simply, they.... Border Patrol & ICE cannot stop massive load's of drug's entering this country, even at manned checkpoint's. The drug's that are found.... a lot are due to nothing more than the suspect acting nervous, a occasional dog alerting, or downright stupidity of the carrier. It is admitted, the percentage they seize is tiny, compared with what actually comes over. They cannot stop Illegal Alien's from crossing the border's with impunity. I was most amazed when they acknowledged, a foggy night, practically render's there technology useless and watched as the Illegal's jumped the fence on a foggy night and this is at manned checkpoint's with Camera's, both Night and Thermal, and a big fence.... not in the middle of nowhere where they cross at will. How many Murder's and Abduction's happen daily and are never solved? It is known..... most cases that are solved are due to friend's and family committing the crime. When it is done randomly by stranger's, they are most likely, never solved. The number of people that go missing every year is huge. So, technology has it's limitation's.
Government search/ This was also brought up. Okay, with this economy, who is going to spend million's or billion's of dollar's to see if BF is real? Talk about political suicide, not to mention the media circus that would follow. While a government funded search would most likely be the most successful chance at finding BF, I don't look for that to happen. Even if it did, it would take a enormous effort and some highly motivated and dedicated people to pull it off. Now, let's say they did find one, would they release that information to the public or would they keep it a secret? In that regard, it is similar to the Alien question? IMO, they would not release any information that could/would challenge the power and religious structure we have in place. NO WAY!
A Body/ is subjected to the same rule's of scat from decomposition along with the body. Ever go looking for Deer shed's? You know they are there, however, are hard to find, get eat by rodent's and squirrel's. I have Deer hunted many year's yet have found only a couple in my lifetime and only a few skull's or a bone or two. Human remain's are dumped all the time, yet few are ever found even when the criminal admit's to where they are and can take a large task force of investigator's to find's the remain's.
I write this only to stimulate your thought process and not to argue for or against BF. Go on Google Earth and look at the huge area's we still have. Is BF real? I don't know, but think some answer's are given without enough thought and only wish to stimulate the thought process. I still believe they should pressure Bob Gimlin into a lie detector test for the claim's he has made of course, this does nothing for the long held belief's of the Native American's which go back way before their time. At any rate, I have enjoyed reading this BF thread and the opinion's for and against BF, as both sides are equally valid. I have difficulty believing myself, but do consider some of the variables listed above. It would be fantastic for this creature to exsist, I will say That
Last edited:
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2007
- Messages
- 3,504
Not to make a arguement for or against Sasquatch, let's look at other aspect's of finding evidence. My thought's are centered around Deer and Hog hunting when I form these opinion's.
Scat/ without knowing the diet specifically, would be hard to determine the shelf life of such scat. If they eat a varied diet, at some point, there should be hair in the fecal matter. I would be under the impression that scat with hair mixed in, would endure the longest. Human fecal matter does not fair well out in nature, or that has been my observation's. So, in my mind scat, fecal matter or whatever you choose to call it, would be difficult to find. I have never been able to determine the number's of Deer or Hog's based on fecal matter, as it can be difficult to find and sometimes, can be downright rediculous to find. Since I know the diet of Deer and Hog's and what the feces look like, I would expect Big Foot to share some of the similar food's so............. I would pretty much think, scat is difficult to use to identify a Big Foot due to decomposition, not impossible, but difficult not knowing what to look for, what it look's like, or more specific, where to look? I am not going to pick up and examine every turd I find in the wood's much less bring it home to send it to be analyzed. If Big Foot likes to take his business up in tree's for example, you just made it much more difficult to find. If BF had a tendency to bury it, eat it, smear it, ect, it could indeed become extremely difficult to find it. Since we don't know it's habit's, we are left to guess. Is this reasonable thinking in regard's to BF scat?
Land Mass/
Let's say around my house only, with my Hunting Club and a couple other's that join it, let's say that is 8 to 10,000 acre's. Now, let's dump a Gorilla at a random spot in that 10,000 acre's and turn me loose to go and find some evidence. When I picture in my head the size of that land mass, it would be a crap shoot at best on finding anything. Let's say like a Deer or Hog, this Gorilla actively tries to avoid me like Deer and Hog's do except, he has the ability to climb in tree's, you just made it much harder to find. It is thought that BF is a mostly nocturnal creature, this add's even more difficulty. I can see where finding it on even small parcel's of land like 10,000 acre's, could be very difficult, to down right impossible, and that's assuming, I had unlimited time, resources, no responsibilities to other people like, Wife, Children, Parent's, Grandparent's, Friend's. At the same time, I would need someone to spend a lot of time making sure all my need's are met, so that I can dedicate my life to finding this creature. This would require a lot of money, not to mention, a complete and utter dedication and motivation, to continue this for month's or year's at a time and that is keeping it in 10,000 acre's, a rule this animal is not going to follow. While the Human population increases, it may seem that there are no hiding places left however, this simply is not accurate and there remain many large tract's of wood's, mountain's, swamp's, ect. Just yesterday I watched a program that stated in CO, there are huge area's in the caves and canyon's that are unexplored something along the lines of 98%. The state's with huge National Park's and rugged mountainous area's where people rarely leave the trail's, as it's just too risky.Ever watch, I should not be alive, TV show? It's a good example of what happen's when the unprepared stray off the trail's or have unexpected accident's. It is known that YellowStone National Park has area's that have never had a foot on them as they are to rugged and remote. Ditto for Alaska, Canada, Maine, the Yukon and Boreal forest ect, ect, it would be a huge list to name all of them.
Technology/ I have read many comment's on how technology would make it easy to find this creature. Night Vision, Thermal Imaging, Camera trap's ect. I think too much emphasis is placed on technology. I think we are lead to believe technology is more than it really is, as a control over us. They want us to believe there is nothing, we can do, and get away with it, because of technology. That may become true one day, but don't think we are there yet although, they work day and night to make all this technology a reality.
Why am I of this opinion? The TV show Border War's! Simply, they.... Border Patrol & ICE cannot stop massive load's of drug's entering this country, even at manned checkpoint's. The drug's that are found.... a lot are due to nothing more than the suspect acting nervous, a occasional dog alerting, or downright stupidity of the carrier. It is admitted, the percentage they seize is tiny, compared with what actually comes over. They cannot stop Illegal Alien's from crossing the border's with impunity. I was most amazed when they acknowledged, a foggy night, practically render's there technology useless and watched as the Illegal's jumped the fence on a foggy night and this is at manned checkpoint's with Camera's, both Night and Thermal, and a big fence.... not in the middle of nowhere where they cross at will. How many Murder's and Abduction's happen daily and are never solved? It is known..... most cases that are solved are due to friend's and family committing the crime. When it is done randomly by stranger's, they are most likely, never solved. The number of people that go missing every year is huge. So, technology has it's limitation's.
Government search/ This was also brought up. Okay, with this economy, who is going to spend million's or billion's of dollar's to see if BF is real? Talk about political suicide, not to mention the media circus that would follow. While a government funded search would most likely be the most successful chance at finding BF, I don't look for that to happen. Even if it did, it would take a enormous effort and some highly motivated and dedicated people to pull it off. Now, let's say they did find one, would they release that information to the public or would they keep it a secret? In that regard, it is similar to the Alien question? IMO, they would not release any information that could/would challenge the power and religious structure we have in place. NO WAY!
A Body/ is subjected to the same rule's of scat from decomposition along with the body. Ever go looking for Deer shed's? You know they are there, however, are hard to find, get eat by rodent's and squirrel's. I have Deer hunted many year's yet have found only a couple in my lifetime and only a few skull's or a bone or two. Human remain's are dumped all the time, yet few are ever found even when the criminal admit's to where they are and can take a large task force of investigator's to find's the remain's.
I write this only to stimulate your thought process and not to argue for or against BF. Go on Google Earth and look at the huge area's we still have. Is BF real? I don't know, but think some answer's are given without enough thought and only wish to stimulate the thought process. I still believe they should pressure Bob Gimlin into a lie detector test for the claim's he has made of course, this does nothing for the long held belief's of the Native American's which go back way before their time. At any rate, I have enjoyed reading this BF thread and the opinion's for and against BF, as both sides are equally valid. I have difficulty believing myself, but do consider some of the variables listed above. It would be fantastic for this creature to exsist, I will say That
Thanks for your input ! This was a good read....
Thank's Coal Digger,
One thing I forgot to discuss was
The Evidence/
The Patterson, Gimlin, film remain's the strongest peice of evidence, as far as a clear shot of the alleged creature goes. One would think the " Expert's " could overwhelmingly say without a doubt, if this film is real or faked however, they have not done so in fact, it goes the other direction with many credible scientist saying it could not be faked, the suit is too complicated for the era, especially for the amount of money Patterson had. The gait and muscle movement's under the skin. The fact they cannot duplicate it and it has been tried with large budget's. The forensic study of the feet with Dermal ridges from a man who put's people in prison all the time based on his testimony. I saw a show just the other day and while they got close to duplicating the gait, the suit they were using was crap compared to the original, being much smaller and did not come close to the original and this was a expensive suit. The thing I alway's found bizaare, was that they chose to make it a female. Being a Man, human nature would dictate in my mind, a Big, Scary, Male BigFoot. I would have never thought to make it a female, especially with the breast. The thing that erk's me the most, is that the expert's cannot rule it a flat out fraud, with everyone being able to agree on it. While a couple of these men are alive, they should go to any extreme to get the truth out of them, even if they have to put them in prison to get it. Without the Patterson/Gimlin film, I think BF would have been put to rest along time ago. To commit fraud for the purpose of making money is illegal, no matter if it's BF, Ghost, or Alien's and should be treated that way. If some of these thing's we see on TV are indeed real, as some of it is claimed, there are some question's that deserve alot of real scientific research.
One thing I forgot to discuss was
The Evidence/
The Patterson, Gimlin, film remain's the strongest peice of evidence, as far as a clear shot of the alleged creature goes. One would think the " Expert's " could overwhelmingly say without a doubt, if this film is real or faked however, they have not done so in fact, it goes the other direction with many credible scientist saying it could not be faked, the suit is too complicated for the era, especially for the amount of money Patterson had. The gait and muscle movement's under the skin. The fact they cannot duplicate it and it has been tried with large budget's. The forensic study of the feet with Dermal ridges from a man who put's people in prison all the time based on his testimony. I saw a show just the other day and while they got close to duplicating the gait, the suit they were using was crap compared to the original, being much smaller and did not come close to the original and this was a expensive suit. The thing I alway's found bizaare, was that they chose to make it a female. Being a Man, human nature would dictate in my mind, a Big, Scary, Male BigFoot. I would have never thought to make it a female, especially with the breast. The thing that erk's me the most, is that the expert's cannot rule it a flat out fraud, with everyone being able to agree on it. While a couple of these men are alive, they should go to any extreme to get the truth out of them, even if they have to put them in prison to get it. Without the Patterson/Gimlin film, I think BF would have been put to rest along time ago. To commit fraud for the purpose of making money is illegal, no matter if it's BF, Ghost, or Alien's and should be treated that way. If some of these thing's we see on TV are indeed real, as some of it is claimed, there are some question's that deserve alot of real scientific research.
I wonder, what's the use? Its as if there was some vested interest in debunking(?!) The question was asked, "has anybody seen something?" The answer comes back from one guy, "yes", and its like an affirmative reply was neither wanted, desired, nor welcome. I'm no cop, trained in evidence collection. I was just a scared hunter.
Its one thing to have never seen even a hint of one, and then call "belief" in Bigfoot "a matter of faith." It's quite another, to accidentally turn around, and to your dread and astonishment, see one.
I only bring up the "belief in mountain lions" thing, because that's the argument people use about bigfoot-- "I've camped and hunted for X number of years, and I've never seen one, so therefore-abracadabra-voila you can't have either, because they don't exist." Well, that doesn't mean anything to a guy who says he's seen one; it comes off as an irrational kind of denial.
Heck, I never saw anything freaky like that, in a couple of decades of hunting and camping in the Eastern Sierra. Until I did, one morning. A brownish-black one.
Eye witnesses get so much resistance when they relate their story, I suppose it supresses others from being rash enough to admit any sightings. Who's to pass judgement on people, who choose to shaddup about anything wierd they've seen? I don't think that almost anything good comes from admitting you've seen an exceedingly rare creature.
It seems like there's a huge downside, and no upside to it.
All that said, and to quote Homeland Security "if you see something, say something."
Its one thing to have never seen even a hint of one, and then call "belief" in Bigfoot "a matter of faith." It's quite another, to accidentally turn around, and to your dread and astonishment, see one.
I only bring up the "belief in mountain lions" thing, because that's the argument people use about bigfoot-- "I've camped and hunted for X number of years, and I've never seen one, so therefore-abracadabra-voila you can't have either, because they don't exist." Well, that doesn't mean anything to a guy who says he's seen one; it comes off as an irrational kind of denial.
Heck, I never saw anything freaky like that, in a couple of decades of hunting and camping in the Eastern Sierra. Until I did, one morning. A brownish-black one.
Eye witnesses get so much resistance when they relate their story, I suppose it supresses others from being rash enough to admit any sightings. Who's to pass judgement on people, who choose to shaddup about anything wierd they've seen? I don't think that almost anything good comes from admitting you've seen an exceedingly rare creature.
It seems like there's a huge downside, and no upside to it.
All that said, and to quote Homeland Security "if you see something, say something."
Erasmus, Look, I don't mean to disrespect you. I think it's cool that you're on here relating your story. I don't doubt what you saw. I want bigfoot to be real.
I'm just trying to relate some population level biology. There are alot of misconceptions and anthropomorphizing about wildlife. I'm just trying to inject some wildlife science into the conversation and see what everyone thinks. I don't mean to offend, just want to hear how people explain some things.
SuperX, that was a good read. On skulls, though, I've run across quite a few deer skulls and bones, a couple lions and no bears (odd that one?), anyway, not that odd to find bones. So, yeah the scat would be tough, because you wouldn't even know what you were looking for or at, the body would decompose, but the bones would still be there.
I'm just trying to relate some population level biology. There are alot of misconceptions and anthropomorphizing about wildlife. I'm just trying to inject some wildlife science into the conversation and see what everyone thinks. I don't mean to offend, just want to hear how people explain some things.
SuperX, that was a good read. On skulls, though, I've run across quite a few deer skulls and bones, a couple lions and no bears (odd that one?), anyway, not that odd to find bones. So, yeah the scat would be tough, because you wouldn't even know what you were looking for or at, the body would decompose, but the bones would still be there.
Erasmus,
Please don't feel that way. I appreciated what you reported and only you, can know what you saw and if there was a alternate explanation you will have to come up with it. Other's can only offer thoeries of what you actually saw however, No one else can see through your eye's and that point, we cannot negotiate!
Xylum,
I have as well however, I cannot say I know the identity of every bone I have come across and bring's another thought to mind. Bones and scat may have indeed been found by hunter's, hiker's ect, but unless you have some advanced knowledge of what your looking at, most would dismiss it I would think.....I know I would. So if we look at how many person's there are with the knowledge of what they are looking for out in the wood's, that is probably a small number compared with the average Outdoorsman. I can't honestly tell you what I would have to find, for me to go to the trouble to contact someone. It would have to be a Ape like skull or something bizarre to catch my attention. I guess now that there is more awareness, people may start taking a second look at what they find out there in the field. I have never given BF much thought until the recent TV show's. Even if I did find something unusual, I may be hesitant to report it, for fear of ridicule or embarrassment if I were incorrect. I am sure, I am not the only one who would feel that way.
Please don't feel that way. I appreciated what you reported and only you, can know what you saw and if there was a alternate explanation you will have to come up with it. Other's can only offer thoeries of what you actually saw however, No one else can see through your eye's and that point, we cannot negotiate!
Xylum,
I have as well however, I cannot say I know the identity of every bone I have come across and bring's another thought to mind. Bones and scat may have indeed been found by hunter's, hiker's ect, but unless you have some advanced knowledge of what your looking at, most would dismiss it I would think.....I know I would. So if we look at how many person's there are with the knowledge of what they are looking for out in the wood's, that is probably a small number compared with the average Outdoorsman. I can't honestly tell you what I would have to find, for me to go to the trouble to contact someone. It would have to be a Ape like skull or something bizarre to catch my attention. I guess now that there is more awareness, people may start taking a second look at what they find out there in the field. I have never given BF much thought until the recent TV show's. Even if I did find something unusual, I may be hesitant to report it, for fear of ridicule or embarrassment if I were incorrect. I am sure, I am not the only one who would feel that way.
Yeah, you're swaying me a bit. I wouldn't look to closely at a random rib, vertebrae or long bone on the ground. A skull would catch my eye, but I've never found a bear skull, and they're out there. As for scat, I'd probably just assume a large pile was from a bear, or lion, depending, but I can't say I'd dig around in it to figure it out.
Xylum,
I have never hunted the North wood's, so I would not know what a Bear, Mtn Lion, Elk, Moose ect, ect, bone would even look like, much less fecal identification. I would make a poor BF investigator, I am afraid. My experiences are from the Southern Swamp's and Hardwood bottom's.
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When the forestry group I worked for a the time went into the blast zone a couple of weeks after the the Mt. St. Helens eruption we found the bodies of virtually every creature that lived there. Deer, elk, bear, mt. lions among the big stuff. No big feet but I assume they are rare under any condition. For a couple years after that people kept bring in rib bones and the like thinking they had found one of the missing humans. Always turned out to be deer.
Classic "encounter" there with Mr. Stroud. 25 cameras, and not one thing on tape! Every hunter has been there-- the minute you sling arms in order to dig through your pack or maybe urinate, you get game birds flushing. It's almost like fate doesn't want us to have any evidence-- dee dee dee.
I can tell you right now, I'm in the planning phase for a behind Mt. Whitney/Kern Canyon solo trout fishing trip, and I didn't need to hear Les Stroud repeat that anecdote. If I'd heard that, first I'd have said "sh1+", and then I'd of done it.
I got the trip idea from an article Tom Steinstra wrote, where he mentioned "world class trout fishing" in the U-shaped portion of the Kern River Canyon behind Whitney.
As an M.E., I am automatically inclined to favor run of the mill "rational" scientific explanations for anything that goes down. I find it odd and slightly disconcerting (freaky even!?) that supernatural explanations keep cropping up for our shaggy "friend's" existence. As things stand, I'm not personally prepared to invoke ghosts, space aliens, psychic powers and mothmen in order to explain bigfoot. But that's just me. Why doesn't Larry King interview the MothMan over coffee and doughnuts? I'd watch.
When people make odd and disturbing sounding claims, it's always psychologically easier to discount/debunk the claims, than to deal with the possibility that they're true. I'm no different. Here I sit, irrationally hoping Les Stroud is lying, but deep down, knowing he isn't. That's just the way humans are made.
For our would-be bigfoot shooters in the other thread: If you are honestly considering shooting one, it only means that you've never seen one. People who idly insist they'd light him up have No Idea how hugely scarey and intimidating he is, in the flesh. And he wasn't even trying very hard. The implied menace is there. People think that since they're the one with the gun, that they're running the show. Well, people holding guns die all the time, so that's not true. There's youtube lion and tiger hunts that come to mind.
I can tell you right now, I'm in the planning phase for a behind Mt. Whitney/Kern Canyon solo trout fishing trip, and I didn't need to hear Les Stroud repeat that anecdote. If I'd heard that, first I'd have said "sh1+", and then I'd of done it.
I got the trip idea from an article Tom Steinstra wrote, where he mentioned "world class trout fishing" in the U-shaped portion of the Kern River Canyon behind Whitney.As an M.E., I am automatically inclined to favor run of the mill "rational" scientific explanations for anything that goes down. I find it odd and slightly disconcerting (freaky even!?) that supernatural explanations keep cropping up for our shaggy "friend's" existence. As things stand, I'm not personally prepared to invoke ghosts, space aliens, psychic powers and mothmen in order to explain bigfoot. But that's just me. Why doesn't Larry King interview the MothMan over coffee and doughnuts? I'd watch.
When people make odd and disturbing sounding claims, it's always psychologically easier to discount/debunk the claims, than to deal with the possibility that they're true. I'm no different. Here I sit, irrationally hoping Les Stroud is lying, but deep down, knowing he isn't. That's just the way humans are made.
For our would-be bigfoot shooters in the other thread: If you are honestly considering shooting one, it only means that you've never seen one. People who idly insist they'd light him up have No Idea how hugely scarey and intimidating he is, in the flesh. And he wasn't even trying very hard. The implied menace is there. People think that since they're the one with the gun, that they're running the show. Well, people holding guns die all the time, so that's not true. There's youtube lion and tiger hunts that come to mind.
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Yeah, you're great at telling everyone else what they've seen or heard aren't you?
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"Speculating" being the keyword... let's not get confrontational.
"Finding Bigfoot" series is the funniest show on TV since Chappelle Show. I just want to know how you get a gig like that. I could have been cast as BoBo! Classic case of laughing all the way to the bank. I'm waiting for the Central Park episode when they all get off the subway and amble into the park and all agree this place looks SQUATCHY.
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Les Stroud said he heard it in a tree and he's heard all those animals dipbait brings up. (I'm sure Les has spent more time out in remote wilderness areas than most people here)
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My own dog has made noises that I have never heard a dog make. Infact, my daughter and I were witness to her speaking a perfectly pronounced "Hello". Not like those "I-ruv-woo" videos you see on youtube but a seriously pronounced english word. It was shocking enough for the hairs on the back of my neck to stand up as I replied "he..h..hello?" back to her. My daughter still thinks our dog can talk when she chooses to. Strange things happen all the time... without solid concrete proof, they remain strange. Which is why Les only tells it like he heard it.... nothing more. Les and I share the same skills mentor, who is half native and believes in Sasquatch(in the spiritual, unEarthly sense), among other things.