Standard Council Tool Axes versus Velvicut... worth the $$$?

In wrestling and jiu-jitsu there is some of those double movements. I'd recommend doing some of the exercises they do, and it doesn't hurt to warm up either. Some of the stretches in MMA or muay thai are about the best you'll find (basically 5 minutes of skipping to warm up, or something equivalent and then swinging and rotating each part of the body one part at a time, head to toe.). Turkish get ups and one-handed barbell punch press (that's what I call it anyway) are about the best exercises you'll find for strengthening your core in a similar movement (deadlifts and squats are the absolute best, but they don't repeat the twisting movement. Anyone reading this should keep in mind that proper form is paramount in these exercises (see Starting Strength).

Of course, you'll slowly strengthen your core and back muscles by using the lighter axe, and then maybe you'll be able to move up to a bigger one. Just thought I'd give you my advice since many people today do not use their back muscles in the type of work they do. So even if you know this stuff someone else may get something from it.

Have fun with the axe.
 
Chignecto Woodsman said:
In wrestling and jiu-jitsu there is some of those double movements. I'd recommend doing some of the exercises they do, and it doesn't hurt to warm up either. Some of the stretches in MMA or muay thai are about the best you'll find (basically 5 minutes of skipping to warm up, or something equivalent and then swinging and rotating each part of the body one part at a time, head to toe.). Turkish get ups and one-handed barbell punch press (that's what I call it anyway) are about the best exercises you'll find for strengthening your core in a similar movement (deadlifts and squats are the absolute best, but they don't repeat the twisting movement. Anyone reading this should keep in mind that proper form is paramount in these exercises (see Starting Strength).

Of course, you'll slowly strengthen your core and back muscles by using the lighter axe, and then maybe you'll be able to move up to a bigger one. Just thought I'd give you my advice since many people today do not use their back muscles in the type of work they do. So even if you know this stuff someone else may get something from it.

Have fun with the axe.
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Hey, those are good tips. But... the problem for me is that I don't get much exercise... that's why I'm chopping my own wood instead of buying it - this IS what I'm doing for exercise! LOL
But I think I will take your advice about doing a little warm up. I always warm up for any kind of sports, so why not for cutting wood?
 
bluesmandan said:
The Cons: At the end of the job, the tip of the beard on the heel had broken off, about 1/4" or so. The toe was blunted flat for about 1/2" to 3/4" from the edge. The short handle means you have to bend over quite a bit for cutting at the base of a tree.
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That's pretty bad. Unless the damaged was caused by ground strikes I'd talk to Council about this. A cracked heel with a blunted toe smells like a bad heat treat to me.

Was the White Oak you felled green? That sounds like a stupid question - it was white not green - but you know what I mean. Dead dry white oak would be much harder on an axe than green white oak.
 
Square_peg said:
That's pretty bad. Unless the damaged was caused by ground strikes I'd talk to Council about this. A cracked heel with a blunted toe smells like a bad heat treat to me.

Was the White Oak you felled green? That sounds like a stupid question - it was white not green - but you know what I mean. Dead dry white oak would be much harder on an axe than green white oak.
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Yes, the tree was green. I sharpened the HB back up and went at it some more today... another green white oak, 6-7" diameter, plus a bunch of other small things. The edge looks pretty good. So the blunted toe must have been something in a ground strike... though I was very careful about ground strikes that first day, and only had one that I recall... today I had a lot of them, and the toe seems fine. I"m not worried a bit about the heel/beard and the tiny little corner that broke off - to me it now looks like it should have been designed, since a pointy little beard like that is destined to be broken off at some point.

On a side note: The Lexol seems to be doing a good job on the handle. I wasn't sure how it would do, since it is made for leather... but I figured, oil is oil (to some degree) and wax is wax, so Lexol as a mixture of oil and wax ought to do well, even though treating hickory handles is not its intended purpose. Seems to be doing the trick. It also darkened the handle and brought out the natural beauty of the grain - an added plus to the preservation and improved grip.
 
Bluesmandan,

That bit about the short handle causing you to have to bend over to cut the base of the tree concerns me, as it may be the source of some of the blade problems! I had given up on this thread as I thought you were taking us for a ride, but I'm starting to think you really may have never used an axe, at least properly, before. Either way, chop the tree at a comfortable height. Not only does that make it easier on you and the axe, it leaves a stump you can see while mowing. I normally leave the stumps until there is a bunch of them and then cut them all with the chainsaw right before I intend to change the chain...
 
BG_Farmer said:
Bluesmandan,

That bit about the short handle causing you to have to bend over to cut the base of the tree concerns me, as it may be the source of some of the blade problems! I had given up on this thread as I thought you were taking us for a ride, but I'm starting to think you really may have never used an axe, at least properly, before. Either way, chop the tree at a comfortable height. Not only does that make it easier on you and the axe, it leaves a stump you can see while mowing. I normally leave the stumps until there is a bunch of them and then cut them all with the chainsaw right before I intend to change the chain...
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Yes, I agree with this. You'd be surprised how little grit it can take to chip an axe. The only time you can really chop on the ground is when there's a really good base of snow (and that's the best time to learn!). Could be hitting into the ground, knots, or just a poor heat treat as square peg said. As a comparison I've limbed a tonne of trees with my Gransfors and it has only chipped very slightly from an error I made.

I think the rule of below a foot for a stump is silly. It's basically just an old forestry rule to try to get as much yardage as possible, but the base of the tree often has poor wood anyway. You can easily find pictures today of people getting on their knees to take as much of the tree as possible (for their belief of saving the environment, kind of ironic), just seems like a very dangerous practise considering the extra movement required to get away from the tree, the extra effort involved, and the potential damage to back muscles. I would say 1.5 to 2.5 feet is acceptable for a stump depending on the terrain, or close to whatever is safest should be what to aim for and lower as your skill improves. Of course, if you're trying to clear for farmland/aesthetics stump size is a different story (but not a practise I'm familiar with).

When you think about it, some amount of dead material in the woods is just as important as the living material.
 
Chignecto,
I've seen the same. My ignorant opinion is most of it is based on use of a saw, ie you can go lower if you are notching to a kerf or using a chainsaw, although even there, the tree is a lot cleaner above the level of spatter which is about 18". It is also arguably a little safer as well.

If you are going to pull the stump, eg for a lawn or a field, a little extra length helps a lot!
 
BG_Farmer said:
Bluesmandan,

That bit about the short handle causing you to have to bend over to cut the base of the tree concerns me, as it may be the source of some of the blade problems! I had given up on this thread as I thought you were taking us for a ride, but I'm starting to think you really may have never used an axe, at least properly, before. Either way, chop the tree at a comfortable height. Not only does that make it easier on you and the axe, it leaves a stump you can see while mowing. I normally leave the stumps until there is a bunch of them and then cut them all with the chainsaw right before I intend to change the chain...
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Ha-ha. No, I wasn't taking you for a ride. And yes I've used an axe before (just not much recently). Hence the back pain and the search for a long light axe. The Council Tool HB is light, but not very long. Trying to chop down a tree with something that is closer to a hatchet than a full size felling axe... is kind of a pain. So, like I said before, I may look into buying a 2.25 or 2.5# axe and put a full length handle on it (36") -- they call that a "cruiser" I think.

I'm cutting the trees around one foot up from the ground. It's not in a yard, just in some woods back behind the house, so there's no need to get them right down next to the ground. I don't hit the ground a lot when cutting a TREE by the way!!! ... i was clearing out a lot of other bush and briers and vines that are in the way, and that's when I let it get into the ground more. I USUALLY use a MACHETE for that kind of stuff, but I figured I'd show the axe just a little abuse and see how it held up. But I have several machetes and that's what I usually use them for, clearing out the bush/briers/vines/scrub-junk.
 
Chignecto Woodsman said:
Of course, if you're trying to clear for farmland/aesthetics stump size is a different story (but not a practise I'm familiar with).
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If you're planning to pull the stumps to clear farmland then it can be advantageous to leave a higher stump as it gives you some leverage for pulling the roots from the ground.
 
Square_peg said:
If you're planning to pull the stumps to clear farmland then it can be advantageous to leave a higher stump as it gives you some leverage for pulling the roots from the ground.
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Yes, that would make sense. I was thinking more of the outlying regions of a property where you don't necessarily have to pull the stumps (maybe they still did though). And in clearcutting it seems that lower stumps don't look so bad.

Would they sever the roots and use oxen or what?
 
Chignecto Woodsman said:
Would they sever the roots and use oxen or what?
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Stump puller.

00000105.jpg


And....

ch7-21.jpg



I've seen other sketches of these devices but I'd have to dig through my hard drive to find them.
 
Interesting, thanks. It says 'To Team' so it must have been horses or oxen (well, that's what the teams were here). I was just reading how some peaveys had an attachment to hook to a team of oxen as well.
 
Chignecto Woodsman said:
Interesting, thanks. It says 'To Team' so it must have been horses or oxen (well, that's what the teams were here). I was just reading how some peaveys had an attachment to hook to a team of oxen as well.
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Maybe it was refering to this type of team, :D

Irish_600kg_euro_chap_2009.JPG
 
Square_peg said:
Stump puller.

00000105.jpg


And....

ch7-21.jpg



I've seen other sketches of these devices but I'd have to dig through my hard drive to find them.
Click to expand...

Very cool! Last winter I skidded quite a few logs with horses on the farm I worked at. We were building a road through the woods to access a new hay field beyond them. We just cut the stumps down flush with a chainsaw but it would have been very cool to pull a few stumps!
 
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