Strider vs Sebenza

[Ankerson]

Don't know why Strider and CRK get compared so much as they are completely different animals...........
I like the knives from both manufacturers but have no time or respect for one of the companies / operators.

I have 11 or 12 Sebenza's (maybe more - not sure as I am at work). All are perfect.
I have 6 Strider knives and one of them (RC) has a pretty bad sticking lock.

I reckon my stats are about right for what you can expect from both companies.

Mostly has to do with price I would guess, people put them in the same category.

But yeah they are completely different kinds of knives, not even close in feel ect.

I have owned 4 SmF's, down to 2 SmF's and 2 UMNUMZAANS.

 

[JNewell]

Ten-ring. :thumbup:

Mostly has to do with price I would guess, people put them in the same category.

But yeah they are completely different kinds of knives, not even close in feel ect.

I have owned 4 SmF's, down to 2 SmF's and 2 UMNUMZAANS.

 

[JNewell]

Guess that should give people an idea of what to expect when ordering a Strider folder yeah?

You may or may not get a knife that is ideal when buying new.

I've got four Strider folders, all perfect right out of the box, err, bag.

 

[neuron]

Not really? Owners of Strider knives have mentioned the following.

So far we have 11-12 Sebenza's without problems vs 6 Striders where 1 has an issue.

Owner of 5 Striders where 2 of them are off getting fixed. Justified blade play to himself which I find odd.

I think the TC should just go with the knife he thinks looks best.

If you want to play the numbers game, don't forget to add in the dozen or so Striders I own or have owned that have been perfect out of the baggie.

 

[hardheart]

edit: i could honestly not care about what lies certain individuals at strider may or may not have used to sell their products.

The "may or may not" has not been applicable for years, the only ones who continue to question are the ones who don't want the answer.

As for the knives and the lockbar cutouts, it should not matter too much. If you are worried about lock strength, get a knife with a different lock, as framelocks are not among the strongest available. A stout lockback, an axis lock, a Demko with triad lock, and a few other options would allay your lock concerns while still providing premium materials.

 

[arjung]

Right I'll try to get this in before this thread becomes a shit slinging fest.

I guess because Strider and Chris Reeve are the de facto standards for mid techs they will inevitably get compared. It honestly comes down to what appeals to you. Look at both designs and ask yourself 'what looks like it will fit my hand better'? Both are strong with a different take on the framelock. Go for that one. Quite frankly I wouldn't take BF as an indicator on Striders or Emersons. As mentioned both brands are so polarizing you're going to get very skewed views of the product. Look on Youtube or other avenues to get a better idea if Strider is a good fit for you.

As for my own preferences it comes down to the size of the knife. 3 inch size I prefer the small sebenza (which is in my pocket right now). For 3.5 inches I like the way the SnG feels in my hand, so I bought that.

 

[Bluesummers]

If you want to play the numbers game, don't forget to add in the dozen or so Striders I own or have owned that have been perfect out of the baggie.

I didn't mention my Sebenza's that don't have issues because they are not expected to have any of those types of issues. Has there even been a post in this topic where they said get a Strider because my Sebenza had issues and my Strider was perfect? No. The only reason they say get a Strider over a Sebenza is because it is a different kind of knife. Which I agree with.

That is the difference. Strider gives you a hard use folder knife where some blade play is tolerable by Strider's standards if there happens to be some. I know I'm not the only one that has heard this. Why? The Strider folder is meant for hard use and a little thing like that isn't going to stop the knife from cutting.

If a Sebenza has any blade play then they themselves want you to send the knife back... because their knife isn't supposed to have blade play.

It's the little things. I'll buy a Strider folder eventually but I'll have to gamble.

Not calling you a liar but if you own a dozen or so then 3 are not up to snuff. It's the ratio you are getting. Maybe by your standards they are fine. I mean one Strider owner said blade play is expected. If this is the type of owners mentality then I don't think I can agree with that.

 

[neuron]

I didn't mention my Sebenza's that don't have issues because they are not expected to have any of those types of issues. Has there even been a post in this topic where they said get a Strider because my Sebenza had issues and my Strider was perfect? No. The only reason they say get a Strider over a Sebenza is because it is a different kind of knife. Which I agree with.

That is the difference. Strider gives you a hard use folder knife where some blade play is tolerable by Strider's standards if there happens to be some. I know I'm not the only one that has heard this. Why? The Strider folder is meant for hard use and a little thing like that isn't going to stop the knife from cutting.

If a Sebenza has any blade play then they themselves want you to send the knife back... because their knife isn't supposed to have blade play.

It's the little things. I'll buy a Strider folder eventually but I'll have to gamble.

Not calling you a liar but if you own a dozen or so then 3 are not up to snuff. It's the ratio you are getting. Maybe by your standards they are fine. I mean one Strider owner said blade play is expected. If this is the type of owners mentality then I don't think I can agree with that.

I agree completely with your characterization of the differences between the brands.

As for the knives I have, all have been free of blade play, had centered blades, rock-solid lockups, etc., so I don't think it's a result of me having different standards. All of those knives, however, have been part of small runs with nonstandard steels (S110V, M4, 3V, etc.) rather than the regular S30V ones, so if you're really set on looking for a way in which the Striders I own are atypical, that would be it.

 

[cziv]

Owning a whopping one Strider, you aren't exactly an expert on the subject. If your strider wasn't up to snuff, then they would have fixed it for you. You think every CRK that leaves the factory is perfect? Please.

With the exception of an occasional tight detent - open/close on the lockbar that is exactly true of the Sebenza at least. Perfect. Chris Reeve told me so. I'm not fooling around either. His words not mine.

I agree with whoever mentioned or kind of indicated that buying one NIB 2nd hand from a respected member here would be the best way of screening for a superb fit & finish on a new Strider. :thumbup:

 

[unit]

Wow. This is going about like I thought it might.

I will toss out the suggestion that the preference between these knives has a LOT to do with philosophy of use.

One is geared toward the person who wants to use their knife for many sorts of duties OTHER than cutting. In fact, the Strider compromises slicing a bit in order to offer a more robust blade that will withstand more abuse.

OTOH, if you appreciate tight tolerances, and generally use your knife for cutting things, and NEVER EVER "flick" the knife, then the CRK might be a better choice.

I would suggest that many people can decide which they will like better for a particular use after about 10 seconds of handling (assuming they know a little bit about knives).

For the record, I do not particularly care for either choice, but I do not think my opinions should matter to the OP. For this sort of investment, I think you really would be well advised to find a way to handle both before buying either. Baring that, I would look at what people who ACTUALLY use these knives do with them and honestly think about how your use may compare with them. Are you REALLY a hard user? Do you like flicking your knives? Will either of these really bring you more happiness than a lesser priced knife of similar materials? Only you can answer these questions, and unfortunately the last one can only be answered after you own them.

 

[neuron]

Wow. This is going about like I thought it might.

I will toss out the suggestion that the preference between these knives has a LOT to do with philosophy of use.

One is geared toward the person who wants to use their knife for many sorts of duties OTHER than cutting. In fact, the Strider compromises slicing a bit in order to offer a more robust blade that will withstand more abuse.

OTOH, if you appreciate tight tolerances, and generally use your knife for cutting things, and NEVER EVER "flick" the knife, then the CRK might be a better choice.

I would suggest that many people can decide which they will like better for a particular use after about 10 seconds of handling (assuming they know a little bit about knives).

Well said. :thumbup:

 

[Cynic2701]

Wow. This is going about like I thought it might.

I will toss out the suggestion that the preference between these knives has a LOT to do with philosophy of use.

One is geared toward the person who wants to use their knife for many sorts of duties OTHER than cutting. In fact, the Strider compromises slicing a bit in order to offer a more robust blade that will withstand more abuse.

OTOH, if you appreciate tight tolerances, and generally use your knife for cutting things, and NEVER EVER "flick" the knife, then the CRK might be a better choice.

I would suggest that many people can decide which they will like better for a particular use after about 10 seconds of handling (assuming they know a little bit about knives).

For the record, I do not particularly care for either choice, but I do not think my opinions should matter to the OP. For this sort of investment, I think you really would be well advised to find a way to handle both before buying either. Baring that, I would look at what people who ACTUALLY use these knives do with them and honestly think about how your use may compare with them. Are you REALLY a hard user? Do you like flicking your knives? Will either of these really bring you more happiness than a lesser priced knife of similar materials? Only you can answer these questions, and unfortunately the last one can only be answered after you own them.

Uh oh. The inevitable flicking issue with CRK's arises!

It's a myth. There are posts by Chris Reeve himself here on Bladeforums encouraging Sebenza owners to wrist flick their knives a couple of times after reassembly. What he doesn't endorse, and which he even calls abuse for any knife, is the continual and obsessive wrist flicking for hours at a time that some people seem to like to do. There's an interview with him (40+ minutes long on Woodsmonkey) where he talks about the whole flicking myth, and even mentions that he recently warrantied a customer (for free) that obsessively wrist flicked his knife.

I can thumb flick my Sebenza, and do pretty frequently. I also disassemble my knife once a month, and inspect the stop pin sleeve. No peening of the surfaces, nor has my lock-up changed in over a year of ownership.

Oh, and I'm not knocking Strider. I just wish that left-handed versions were much easier to find.

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

With the exception of an occasional tight detent - open/close on the lockbar that is exactly true of the Sebenza at least. Perfect. Chris Reeve told me so. I'm not fooling around either. His words not mine.

I agree with whoever mentioned or kind of indicated that buying one NIB 2nd hand from a respected member here would be the best way of screening for a superb fit & finish on a new Strider. :thumbup:

Well, I talked with Chris Reeve on the phone for about an hour the other week, about what you say? My brand new sebenza that had an extremely sticky lock. So, no, not all of the sebenzas that leave the factory are perfect.

 

[neuron]

Well, I talked with Chris Reeve on the phone for about an hour the other week, about what you say? My brand new sebenza that had an extremely sticky lock. So, no, not all of the sebenzas that leave the factory are perfect.

Impossible!!!

 

[unit]

Uh oh. The inevitable flicking issue with CRK's arises!

It's a myth. There are posts by Chris Reeve himself here on Bladeforums encouraging Sebenza owners to wrist flick their knives a couple of times after reassembly. What he doesn't endorse, and which he even calls abuse for any knife, is the continual and obsessive wrist flicking for hours at a time that some people seem to like to do. There's an interview with him (40+ minutes long on Woodsmonkey) where he talks about the whole flicking myth, and even mentions that he recently warrantied a customer (for free) that obsessively wrist flicked his knife.

I can thumb flick my Sebenza, and do pretty frequently. I also disassemble my knife once a month, and inspect the stop pin sleeve. No peening of the surfaces, nor has my lock-up changed in over a year of ownership.

Oh, and I'm not knocking Strider. I just wish that left-handed versions were much easier to find.

Please post links to those quotes from Chris Reeve himself here on Bladeforums encouraging Sebenza owners to wrist flick their knives. I think there are some people in this thread that might enjoy seeing such a quote

 

[Cynic2701]

Here's one by Anne Reeve that I was able to find in 45 seconds of searching. I don't really feel like sifting through more posts to find more:

The whole issue of flicking knives has gotten a little away from reality! No, it is not a sin to flick a Sebenza but it is not something we recommend.

Flicking a knife is an activity that has the potential to damage the whole lock mechanism. It causes the parts to slam together, creating unnecessary wear. Flicking the blade open once in a while it is not a problem – in fact, we recommend it as part of the assembly process. It is the compulsive, continuous snapping open of the blade that is a problem; the spending an afternoon in front of the television and flicking-your-knife-open-breaking-the-lock-closing-it-flicking-it-open-again for the duration of a football game, or movie or whatever, and doing it every week.

This is as true for Sebenzas as it is for any other knife – or any hinged mechanism with a stop and a lock. Of all the knives on the market, the Sebenza is best able to withstand flicking because the size of the stop pin/sleeve, and the configuration of the pivot bearing and bearing surface, cause the energy to disperse over a large area.

Here is an analogy that illustrates what we are trying to say:
A man owns a Porsche – it is a well-built car and the whole vehicle has a “bank vault” feel to it. He particularly likes the sound of the doors closing – thunk. To work off his obsessive frustrations about life at large, this man spends hours and hours just opening and closing the door. Eventually the hinges wobble and the doors whistle when he is driving because they don’t close securely any longer. Do you suppose Porsche will replace the doors happily and at no charge?

So in summary, we do not advocate flicking knives at all – it is not in the best interest of the knife – any knife.

Anne

And here's the link to the Chris Reeve interview over at Woodsmonkey for those too lazy to google it themselves:

http://www.woodsmonkey.com/index.ph...nterview&catid=73:inteviewsprofiles&Itemid=85

Edit:

And with another minute or so of searching, here are two more quotes:

I gave this one to Chris and here is his reply:

The handle must be assembled first and both screws tightend. Just comfortably tight (this applied to all the screws!). The blade assembly (blade, pivot and 2 bronze washers) is then inserted between the handle slabs. If it will not go in, you do not have it assembled correctly. Do not loosen the handle screws off. Once the blade assembly is in the handles, line up the pivot hole and insert the pin. The allen wrench can help you line this up. Tighten the screw into the pin. Flick the knife open once and you are ready to go. This is the only time flicking is advised!

Anne

One of the pariticipants in the thread had emailed to ask a question about this - sorry it has taken a while to respond - here are Chris' comments:

Sebenza means “to work” – our quest is the ultimate in all round function, combined with aesthetic appeal. We are not into the flashy fast opening flick of the wrist type of folder.
The words “smooth and easy opening” can be interpreted in different ways. Easy opening could mean a loose hinge with side play and very little lock pressure. This is not what I want in a folding knife – sloppy hinges do not last and only get sloppier. I want a positive lockup and no side play. It is interesting to note that we are talking about older Sebenzas and newer Sebenzas, there is no talk of older XYZ knives and new ones. This has to be because Sebenzas last! When you buy a Sebenza, you buy a knife for the rest of your life. That is our goal and that is why we offer the lifetime warranty and unrivaled back up on our knives.

There have been some small changes over the years in the quest of improved performance. The front thrust washer was increased in size some years ago to give a little more side support for the blade. This increases metal to metal contact and thus a little more friction. The detent was changed to a ceramic ball but this has absolutely nothing to do with the slight increase in drag. Some years ago we increased the spring tension of the locking bar, resulting in a little more pressure on the detent ball and slightly increased drag. The benefit is that there is a more positive lockup. The increased drag is a small price to pay for the longevity gained.

The higher drag is a part of the Integral Lock© design. On a liner lock, the locking bar is no more than .040” - .060” thick and the bend is in an arc, similar to that of a fishing pole. The Integral Lock bends at the two radii at the back of the handle and is a much more positive lock up and requires more side pressure.

Hand/thumb/index finger technique. If your index finger is placing pressure on the back of the lock, then you are increasing the friction required to open the knife. If your thumb is pushing down on the thumb stud instead of sideways in a motion around the pivot, there is also increased friction. Sebenzas do have a little more opening drag but I believe it is a superior locking mechanism. Please don’t polish washers or other parts of your Sebenzas and, even more critical, don’t use any polishing compound in the mechanism. This will open up the tight tolerances that we strive so hard to achieve and it will void your warranty.

I hope this sheds some more light into what makes Sebenzas the knives that they are!

Chris Reeve

 

[unit]

Here's one by Anne Reeve that I was able to find in 45 seconds of searching. I don't really feel like sifting through more posts to find more:



And here's the link to the Chris Reeve interview over at Woodsmonkey for those too lazy to google it themselves:

http://www.woodsmonkey.com/index.ph...nterview&catid=73:inteviewsprofiles&Itemid=85

Hey, no offense, but the last line of your quote is:

So in summary, we do not advocate flicking knives at all – it is not in the best interest of the knife – any knife.


Anne

I am inclined to conclude that it is not a myth. CRK indeed does not advocate flicking knives.

 

[Cynic2701]

Read through the edited post. I'd also suggest taking the time to listen to the interview.

Here's a few points I'd like to highlight:

"This is as true for Sebenzas as it is for any other knife – or any hinged mechanism with a stop and a lock. Of all the knives on the market, the Sebenza is best able to withstand flicking because the size of the stop pin/sleeve, and the configuration of the pivot bearing and bearing surface, cause the energy to disperse over a large area. "

"Flick the knife open once and you are ready to go. This is the only time flicking is advised!"

"We are not into the flashy fast opening flick of the wrist type of folder.
The words “smooth and easy opening” can be interpreted in different ways. Easy opening could mean a loose hinge with side play and very little lock pressure. This is not what I want in a folding knife – sloppy hinges do not last and only get sloppier. I want a positive lockup and no side play."

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

Just so you know (and knowledge is power), Chris jumped all over my ass and pretty much told me that I had been flicking "his knife" and that's why I had lockup issues. (phone conversation)

I read the quotes you posted, but the man himself seems to hate the "flick" with a passion.

Read through the edited post. I'd also suggest taking the time to listen to the interview.

Here's a few points I'd like to highlight:

"This is as true for Sebenzas as it is for any other knife – or any hinged mechanism with a stop and a lock. Of all the knives on the market, the Sebenza is best able to withstand flicking because the size of the stop pin/sleeve, and the configuration of the pivot bearing and bearing surface, cause the energy to disperse over a large area. "

"Flick the knife open once and you are ready to go. This is the only time flicking is advised!"

"We are not into the flashy fast opening flick of the wrist type of folder.
The words “smooth and easy opening” can be interpreted in different ways. Easy opening could mean a loose hinge with side play and very little lock pressure. This is not what I want in a folding knife – sloppy hinges do not last and only get sloppier. I want a positive lockup and no side play."

 

[unit]

.....I don't care.....

believe and buy whatever you like.

I will suggest that you will get a very different response from Strider and Reeve if you send knifes in for service that have been flicked (and you openly share that information with them).

As I said, I just don't care....I am not buying either knife and I do not care who does. In fact I think everyone ought to own at least one of each so that they can answer a lot of questions for themselves.

Edit to add. The post from CTS above really gets to the heart of what I am talking about. I have heard this (same sort of thing) from several people I know and trust.