- Joined
- Jul 26, 2005
- Messages
- 2,027
Thanks ghostrider. I ended up figuring it out myself after having the knife with me for about 6 hours now. By the way. I am a newbie but have read many of your posts. I find you very informative.ghostrider said:
SUBCOM Folder...on going review(s)...
- Thread starter Daywalker
- Start date
Mahalo much deathshead,
As ghostrider pointed out, yes...the SF can be "waved" open via the studs...however, take care and make sure the knife has locked open! Also, be advised that this will eat up your pocket seam!
Thanks a lot for picking one up, and may I ask where you got yours?
Keep us posted here on the SF when time permits you to. God bless and take care!:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
As ghostrider pointed out, yes...the SF can be "waved" open via the studs...however, take care and make sure the knife has locked open! Also, be advised that this will eat up your pocket seam!
Thanks a lot for picking one up, and may I ask where you got yours?
Keep us posted here on the SF when time permits you to. God bless and take care!:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2005
- Messages
- 475
Oh well thank you.deathshead said:
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2005
- Messages
- 2,027
Mahalo to you too Chad. You also have been quite a valuable resource here at this forum. I have read many of your posts and threads. I am not to surprised to see you have created such a great knife!
Anyway, got the knife from acmeknifecompany.com for $22.98. It was a steal! It will be my knife I carry at the hospitals I work at. My coworkers don't like knives for some reason.
I love that the profile of the knife is so thin yet it does not bend at the frame and there is no blade play. I just received a A.G. Russell Featherlite One hand. It is also thin, but not as thin as the biscuit but its handle doesn't seem as sturdy because it is entirely made of what I believe is zytel.
The knife fit like a glove and you have the grooves on all of the right places. For something so small, you definitely designed it ergonomically friendly. How long have you had this design floating in your head?
I have been practicing opening it with my pocket. I am starting to get the hang of it. Just give me time and I will nail it!!!
I also put a lanyard to help with drawing it out. I use lanyards on most of my knives for this purpose, but I believe it also aids in holding knife by gripping it with my pinky finger as well.
Again, thank you for the oppurtunity to own such a knife. I am looking forward to more of your designs!
Anyway, got the knife from acmeknifecompany.com for $22.98. It was a steal! It will be my knife I carry at the hospitals I work at. My coworkers don't like knives for some reason.
I love that the profile of the knife is so thin yet it does not bend at the frame and there is no blade play. I just received a A.G. Russell Featherlite One hand. It is also thin, but not as thin as the biscuit but its handle doesn't seem as sturdy because it is entirely made of what I believe is zytel.
The knife fit like a glove and you have the grooves on all of the right places. For something so small, you definitely designed it ergonomically friendly. How long have you had this design floating in your head?
I have been practicing opening it with my pocket. I am starting to get the hang of it. Just give me time and I will nail it!!!
I also put a lanyard to help with drawing it out. I use lanyards on most of my knives for this purpose, but I believe it also aids in holding knife by gripping it with my pinky finger as well.
Again, thank you for the oppurtunity to own such a knife. I am looking forward to more of your designs!
deathshead said:
Aloha deathshead,
My goodness, acmeknifecompany? I think I may have heard of them...either that, or I am having flashbacks from them Roadrunner cartoons!
Just kidding!Hey, don't worry about them co-workers. I bet that they won't even know it's a knife...I'd tell you something I did with it one day...but not here.
Feel free to email me or something.I had this design in mind for awhile...and there will also be a fixed blade version coming out soon, too. It is bigger than the SF, but it performs the same: Smaller than a compact knife, but performs like a big knife. When worn on the waist, it won't poke you via the handle...you can bend, kick, knee...whatever!
Tying a lanyard or fob to it aids a great deal in the manner you described. OBTW, ghostrider not only writes some great threads and posts, he does some absolutely beautiful fobs! Initially, when I got the pre-production proto of the SF, I changed the clip to tip-down and added a simple hangman's noose fob. That made the SF feel like a full size folder...however, I am more of a tip down kinda guy.
If you haven't already, bend your clip for an easier time replacing it into pocket...Anyway, I am rambling.
I thank you again, for your kind words, and the honor is mine in that you have chosen to carry an SF. Now, beat the daylights outta it! It'll take it, trust me on this...you shoulda seen what I put the pre-pro version through! God bless and take care:thumbup:
swissbianco
Moderator
- Joined
- May 28, 2005
- Messages
- 820
will get one for test soon.
any plans to make an all black version? that would prevent most rust too...
any plans to make an all black version? that would prevent most rust too...
Subcom F (B0-589) Review by Sifu Dr. Jan Miller
I would like to thank the people at Boker USA Inc. for the opportunity to test, evaluate and review one of their new knife offerings in their Magnum Line called the Subcom F (BO-589) designed by Chad Los Banos. I was asked to test this knife because of my many years of experience as a martial arts teacher, defensive tactics instructor to law enforcement agents and my expertise with many different types of bladed weapons. Therefore in addition to a general review, this review will also focus on the martial uses and self-defense aspects of the Subcom F.
When I removed the Subcom F from its box, opened the blade and laid it upon the table, my first thoughts were what an attractive knife it is. I gave it a good looking over and was amazed at its unique design and compact size. The knife handle is very thin and sleek, measuring only 2 5/8 in the closed position. The bead blasted stainless steel blade made from 420J2 is only 1 7/8 long, but dont let its length fool you for one minute, this small knife has plenty of cutting surface and as I shaved a large patch of hair off of my forearm in one stroke I realized the Subcom F was extremely sharp. The blade features a high flat saber grind, made from 2mm stock and is very wide for a small knife. The action was smooth and the lock up was solid. I have never been a big fan of liner locks or any other lock that sets itself in the index finger choil, but Boker and Banos made this frame lock work flawlessly. I can honestly say I trust the lock to keep the knife in the open position while in use. The Subcom F had no blade play whatsoever, and its fit and function are as close to perfection as one could hope. The G-10 textured handles and extremely deep finger choil makes this knife something you can hold on to comfortably in many grip positions. The knife has jimping around the handle in strategic places as well as jimping and thumb serrations on the top of the handle and spine of the blade that provide for an extra secure grip. The Subcom F features plastic ridged, half moon shaped thumb studs on both sides of the knife that make it user friendly for both right and left handed users. The small clothing clip can be positioned for both tip up or tip down blade carry. Some people might say that the clip is too small for this knife but I couldnt disagree with them more. The clip is a perfect size for many concealable carry methods that I will discuss later in this review. I did however have a problem with the clothing clip being too tight, which I was able to quickly rectify just by removing it and bending it slightly.
There are six things that I look for in a folding knife when considering it for carry as a defensive weapon. 1) Does it have good retention ability? 2) Does it have a strong lock? 3) Does the blade and handle design allow for effective cutting, slashing and thrusting techniques in a variety of grip positions? 4) How easy is it to carry and conceal? 5) While under stress can the knife be opened and brought into action quickly? 6) Can the knife be used defensively when in the closed position? Lets take a look at the Subcom F and see how it measures up. Does the Subcom have good retention ability? It sure does! There is an extra deep index finger choil that will protect and prevent the hand from slipping forward onto the blade during strong thrusts. The jimping around the handle grabs at the hand for a secure grip, and the handle when placed in the palm will virtually disappear regardless of the hand size. The thumb serrations on the spine of the blade provide stability for blade control. Nobody is ever going to be able to take this knife from your hand without hurting themselves! Does the Subcom F have a strong Lock? You bet it does! When you open this knife you can hear the strength as the blade snaps into place with a clunk. It is both strong and solid, even though the frame lock release sets itself in the finger choil. I have used the knife in a variety of grip positions, while cutting, slashing and thrusting into both hard and soft objects and the knife remained open. I feel confident that the lock will not fail while executing any of these type techniques nor do I feel that the index finger will accidentally release the blade from the locked position while in use. Does the blade and handle design allow for effective cutting, slashing and thrusting techniques? Once again for the Subcom F thats an affirmative! I have used the knife in a variety of grip positions such as hammer grip, sabre grip, foil grip, ice pick, (blade facing out) also known as the pikal grip in the filipino martial arts and reverse ice pick or pikal grip, (blade facing inwards) scalpel grip, (index finger extending along the top side of the blade spine) underhand grip, (blade facing upwards when held in a hammer grip position) and in a push dagger grip. The blades unique shape and design allows for effective cutting, slashing and thrusting while held in all of these grip positions. While cutting and slashing I noticed that most of the blade edge came in contact with the materials being cut, which allowed for deeper penetration than the knifes length while cutting and slashing. Also the 2mm blade girth makes this knife a real slicer reminiscent of the type of cuts and wounds that can be made with a Wharncliffe style blade or Razor blade. How easy is the Subcom F to carry and conceal? The Subcom F is probably the easiest knife to carry in all kinds of places concealed. It will clip to any pants pocket without dragging it down. If you have a shirt with a pocket flap the Subcom F will hide away nicely as the flap will cover the small clip completely. I agree with Boker when they advertise that it will work well as a money clip slipped inside a pocket. Try clipping the Subcom F to the side of a baseball cap just behind the brim. I clipped the Subcom F to my sock for a day and it is so light it wont even pull your sock down while running. It will find a nice home clipped to any waistband and your belt will hide the clip. The Subcom F disappears inside a standard pack of cigarettes for deep concealment. I have found that the Subcom F will clip away under the collar of a denim jacket for easy access. It also disappears without a trace into a vest pocket or the watch pocket of a pair of jeans. The Subcom F fits on a one inch dress belt perfectly, either with the metal side facing outwards, which looks like an innocent high tech multi-tool of some sort or the black G-10 side facing outwards for a classy dressy look. Finally my favorite way to carry and access the Subcom F quickly is a very unique method that law enforcement agents or anyone who must wear a dress suit and tie daily should take note of. Take the Subcom F and clip it sideways through an open button hole from the underside of your shirt so the knife is concealed behind the shirt and the clip is exposed on top of the shirt. Next use the clip to secure the thinner under part of your dress tie, and let the wide part of the tie just hang over, concealing the clip. Not only is this method a very fast way to deploy the Subcom F, the knife is very secure in this position and no one will know that youre wearing a knife up close and in front, just where you might need it. Furthermore a slight adjustment by holding the knot of the tie in one hand and grasping the under part of the tie (meaning grasping the Subcom F) may go unnoticed as a threatening or aggressive gesture when face to face with an attacker.
While under stress can the Subcom F be opened and brought into action quickly? The answer to this question is yes, if youre willing to practice. If you are not willing to practice openings with a folding knife you choose to carry for self defense, then you are best served by a fixed blade sheath knife simply because you dont have to take the time to open it. With practice a folding knife can be opened as quickly as any switchblade, and brought into action just as fast as any fixed blade sheath knife. The Subcom F really shines out in this category. Because of its diminutive size it can be manipulated open through a variety of opening techniques depending on the grip position one chooses to hold the knife in. I had students of mine aggressively attack me while wearing the Subcom F in various locations and I was able to fend off the attack with a free hand while rapidly deploying the Subcom F with the other hand in a variety of openings and grip positions from which I was able to mount a counter-attack defense. I must admit that opening and closing the Subcom F was so much fun it was almost addicting. I havent had this kind of fun with a knife since I manipulated my first Filipino Balisong, (butterfly knife).
continued
I would like to thank the people at Boker USA Inc. for the opportunity to test, evaluate and review one of their new knife offerings in their Magnum Line called the Subcom F (BO-589) designed by Chad Los Banos. I was asked to test this knife because of my many years of experience as a martial arts teacher, defensive tactics instructor to law enforcement agents and my expertise with many different types of bladed weapons. Therefore in addition to a general review, this review will also focus on the martial uses and self-defense aspects of the Subcom F.
When I removed the Subcom F from its box, opened the blade and laid it upon the table, my first thoughts were what an attractive knife it is. I gave it a good looking over and was amazed at its unique design and compact size. The knife handle is very thin and sleek, measuring only 2 5/8 in the closed position. The bead blasted stainless steel blade made from 420J2 is only 1 7/8 long, but dont let its length fool you for one minute, this small knife has plenty of cutting surface and as I shaved a large patch of hair off of my forearm in one stroke I realized the Subcom F was extremely sharp. The blade features a high flat saber grind, made from 2mm stock and is very wide for a small knife. The action was smooth and the lock up was solid. I have never been a big fan of liner locks or any other lock that sets itself in the index finger choil, but Boker and Banos made this frame lock work flawlessly. I can honestly say I trust the lock to keep the knife in the open position while in use. The Subcom F had no blade play whatsoever, and its fit and function are as close to perfection as one could hope. The G-10 textured handles and extremely deep finger choil makes this knife something you can hold on to comfortably in many grip positions. The knife has jimping around the handle in strategic places as well as jimping and thumb serrations on the top of the handle and spine of the blade that provide for an extra secure grip. The Subcom F features plastic ridged, half moon shaped thumb studs on both sides of the knife that make it user friendly for both right and left handed users. The small clothing clip can be positioned for both tip up or tip down blade carry. Some people might say that the clip is too small for this knife but I couldnt disagree with them more. The clip is a perfect size for many concealable carry methods that I will discuss later in this review. I did however have a problem with the clothing clip being too tight, which I was able to quickly rectify just by removing it and bending it slightly.
There are six things that I look for in a folding knife when considering it for carry as a defensive weapon. 1) Does it have good retention ability? 2) Does it have a strong lock? 3) Does the blade and handle design allow for effective cutting, slashing and thrusting techniques in a variety of grip positions? 4) How easy is it to carry and conceal? 5) While under stress can the knife be opened and brought into action quickly? 6) Can the knife be used defensively when in the closed position? Lets take a look at the Subcom F and see how it measures up. Does the Subcom have good retention ability? It sure does! There is an extra deep index finger choil that will protect and prevent the hand from slipping forward onto the blade during strong thrusts. The jimping around the handle grabs at the hand for a secure grip, and the handle when placed in the palm will virtually disappear regardless of the hand size. The thumb serrations on the spine of the blade provide stability for blade control. Nobody is ever going to be able to take this knife from your hand without hurting themselves! Does the Subcom F have a strong Lock? You bet it does! When you open this knife you can hear the strength as the blade snaps into place with a clunk. It is both strong and solid, even though the frame lock release sets itself in the finger choil. I have used the knife in a variety of grip positions, while cutting, slashing and thrusting into both hard and soft objects and the knife remained open. I feel confident that the lock will not fail while executing any of these type techniques nor do I feel that the index finger will accidentally release the blade from the locked position while in use. Does the blade and handle design allow for effective cutting, slashing and thrusting techniques? Once again for the Subcom F thats an affirmative! I have used the knife in a variety of grip positions such as hammer grip, sabre grip, foil grip, ice pick, (blade facing out) also known as the pikal grip in the filipino martial arts and reverse ice pick or pikal grip, (blade facing inwards) scalpel grip, (index finger extending along the top side of the blade spine) underhand grip, (blade facing upwards when held in a hammer grip position) and in a push dagger grip. The blades unique shape and design allows for effective cutting, slashing and thrusting while held in all of these grip positions. While cutting and slashing I noticed that most of the blade edge came in contact with the materials being cut, which allowed for deeper penetration than the knifes length while cutting and slashing. Also the 2mm blade girth makes this knife a real slicer reminiscent of the type of cuts and wounds that can be made with a Wharncliffe style blade or Razor blade. How easy is the Subcom F to carry and conceal? The Subcom F is probably the easiest knife to carry in all kinds of places concealed. It will clip to any pants pocket without dragging it down. If you have a shirt with a pocket flap the Subcom F will hide away nicely as the flap will cover the small clip completely. I agree with Boker when they advertise that it will work well as a money clip slipped inside a pocket. Try clipping the Subcom F to the side of a baseball cap just behind the brim. I clipped the Subcom F to my sock for a day and it is so light it wont even pull your sock down while running. It will find a nice home clipped to any waistband and your belt will hide the clip. The Subcom F disappears inside a standard pack of cigarettes for deep concealment. I have found that the Subcom F will clip away under the collar of a denim jacket for easy access. It also disappears without a trace into a vest pocket or the watch pocket of a pair of jeans. The Subcom F fits on a one inch dress belt perfectly, either with the metal side facing outwards, which looks like an innocent high tech multi-tool of some sort or the black G-10 side facing outwards for a classy dressy look. Finally my favorite way to carry and access the Subcom F quickly is a very unique method that law enforcement agents or anyone who must wear a dress suit and tie daily should take note of. Take the Subcom F and clip it sideways through an open button hole from the underside of your shirt so the knife is concealed behind the shirt and the clip is exposed on top of the shirt. Next use the clip to secure the thinner under part of your dress tie, and let the wide part of the tie just hang over, concealing the clip. Not only is this method a very fast way to deploy the Subcom F, the knife is very secure in this position and no one will know that youre wearing a knife up close and in front, just where you might need it. Furthermore a slight adjustment by holding the knot of the tie in one hand and grasping the under part of the tie (meaning grasping the Subcom F) may go unnoticed as a threatening or aggressive gesture when face to face with an attacker.
While under stress can the Subcom F be opened and brought into action quickly? The answer to this question is yes, if youre willing to practice. If you are not willing to practice openings with a folding knife you choose to carry for self defense, then you are best served by a fixed blade sheath knife simply because you dont have to take the time to open it. With practice a folding knife can be opened as quickly as any switchblade, and brought into action just as fast as any fixed blade sheath knife. The Subcom F really shines out in this category. Because of its diminutive size it can be manipulated open through a variety of opening techniques depending on the grip position one chooses to hold the knife in. I had students of mine aggressively attack me while wearing the Subcom F in various locations and I was able to fend off the attack with a free hand while rapidly deploying the Subcom F with the other hand in a variety of openings and grip positions from which I was able to mount a counter-attack defense. I must admit that opening and closing the Subcom F was so much fun it was almost addicting. I havent had this kind of fun with a knife since I manipulated my first Filipino Balisong, (butterfly knife).
continued
I have found 13 different methods for opening the Subcom F into various knife grip positions. If you try to use the thumb stud by pressing it lightly with your thumb towards the middle of the stud you might find it difficult to open this knife, however there are many fast ways to open this knife which I will now discuss in detail. As a side note people often make the mistake of trying to rotate a thumb stud in an arcing motion to open the blade, this is the wrong way to open such a knife. It should always be done with a straight line type push instead. Think linear not circular when using a thumb stud to open a knife. The described openings below are for right handed persons with the clothing clip attached for a blade tip up carry position. Left handed persons can also apply most of these same techniques by flipping the knife over so the visible frame lock faces towards them.
1) The blade opens very well with a Kelly McCann-style "marble shooting" opening. This is accomplished with a quick, snappy flick of the thumb forward against the tip of the thumb stud, near the designers (Chad Los Banos) logo. The technique resembles shooting a marble that sits on top of the forefinger and is flicked with the thumb, which some of you will remember from playing marbles is called fulking. The knife then may be griped in the hammer, sabre or the underhand grip after the opening.
2) Chad Los Banos made me aware of what he refers to as a sweet spot on the thumb stud which can be found on the tip edge of the thumb stud near his logo. Applying pressure with your thumb at this point allows for an easier opening of the blade.
3) A fast and easy way to open the Subcom F is to force your thumb nail down to the blade at the sweet spot between the thumb stud and handle and push the stud in a straight line forward to open. This is one of my favorite opening techniques for this knife and it is very quick.
4) With the black G-10 handle side facing upwards try pinching both the top and bottom studs at the same time between the index finger and thumb and then push on the clothing clip backwards with your middle finger towards your palm as you push the top thumb stud forward to open.
5) Spyderco knife fans will love this one. Grasp the two studs between the index finger pad and thumb pad in the tip up blade position with the butt end of the knife facing upwards. A quick snap of the wrist downwards will open the blade as the weight of the handle swings downward. Spyderco lovers will recognize the technique commonly called the spyder- drop. Readjust the handle in the hand for a hammer or sabre grip.
6) Inertia openings are possible with a lot of practice. Most people will have trouble overcoming the spring tension to accomplish this type of opening with any small knife. However if you like opening a knife this way you can cheat a little by pushing both the under stud and top stud just a little, enough to overcome the tension of the spring and then flip your wrist and knife upwards or flip the wrist and knife over (palm facing upwards) for the inertia opening. With practice an inertia opening can done without cheating. This can be accomplished by grasping the G-10 handle in the middle with your thumb and placing the index finger on the back of the clothing clip. Hold it firmly between the fingers, with the blade spine facing downwards, and your palm also facing down. Snap the wrist downwards hard and fast to overcome the spring tension. Once the blade swings partially open you can either flip the knife upwards to open or flip the wrist over into a palm up position to snap the blade into place. You can also do the inertia opening in ice pick grip. Hold the Subcom F tip up, place your thumb high up on the clothing clip and grasp the black G-10 handle side by pressing it against the side of your index finger. Snap your wrist and hand downwards sharply and stop abruptly. The blade should swing open and lock in place.
7) Try this for a quick opening into the scalpel grip (the index finger pressed alongside the top spine of the blade). Hold the Subcom F sideways with the butt end facing to the left. Have the black G-10 handle side facing upwards. Place the right thumb directly over the top of the O nut of the pivot pin and place your middle finger on the middle of the clothing clip on the metal side and hook the stud (on the bottom metal side) with your index finger. Pull to the right drawing the spine of the blade and point towards the webbing of your hand between the thumb and index finger. Once the blade snaps open move your middle finger into the finger choil and pull inwards and down as the knife handle rotates into the palm. Place your index finger along the top portion of the spine. Although this may sound complicated, it is really easy to do once you get the hang of it.
8) Another opening you can use for scalpel grip is to hold the Subcom F by grasping both studs with the index finger and thumb (tang facing upwards). Push backwards on the side edge of the clip with your middle finger directing it towards the palm. Then use the index finger to hook the bottom stud and pull straight upwards until the knife clicks open and place the middle finger into the finger choil and the index finger into the scalpel grip position described earlier.
9) If you favor the ice pick grip/pikal (blade facing outwards) place your thumb on the middle of the clothing clip with the metal side of the Subcom F facing you, with the butt of the Subcom F facing upwards and index finger on the black G-10 side of the handle. Use your middle finger to push downward on the edge of the stud to open. Readjust your hand position to hold the handle in the ice pick grip. If you reverse the knife position so that you now place your thumb on the G-10 handle and the studs face back towards the palm you can use the same technique to open the Subcom F into reverse ice pick /reverse pikal (blade facing inwards). Just a word of caution when pushing the thumb stud in this direction the blade tip will pass closely to your palm, be careful not to let the tip of the blade come in contact with the palm. If this method is not to your liking you can open the knife with the first method and then roll the knife handle in your palm towards your thumb into the reverse ice pick grip.
10) If you want to open the Subcom F and have it ready to go into action but hidden from view try this technique. Do the exact same technique as described in the first part of technique #9 except use your ring finger instead of the middle finger to open the knife. You will notice that the knife now sits nestled into the hollow of the palm. Place your index finger around and over the top of the butt jimping and hold your hand down at your side palm facing backwards and the Subcom F disappears from frontal view.
11) Heres a unique opening and interesting grip position you may want to try. To use the Subcom F in a push dagger grip hold the knife so that the top portion of the handle sits on the palm so you can see the knife spine and tip (blade tip points towards you). Place the thumb over the O nut of the pivot pin. Using your middle finger nail hook the stud on the metal side and lift it towards the front to open as you apply pressure to the side of the knife with your thumb. Next wrap your middle finger into the finger choil and place the index finger on the left side of the handle and grasp the rest of the knife handle into the palm forming a fist. The blade will now extend outwards from between the index and middle fingers. Now the Subcom F can be used to thrust with like a push dagger.
12) Two Handed Openings: This type of opening may seem very obvious to most knife handlers but I thought I would mention them anyway. There is absolutely nothing wrong with opening a knife with two hands when time permits. They are simple methods that anyone who has ever owned a pocket knife will be familiar with. Use the left hand fingers to grab the studs on the Subcom F and while the right hand holds the handle in place the left hand will open the blade. This technique is good for hammer or sabre grip positions.
13) You can also grab the Subcom F by the studs with the left hand fingers and use the right hand to open the handle as the left hand keeps the blade stationary until the blade locks into place. This technique is good for ice pick/pikal grip position.
As you can see there are many ways to practice opening the Subcom F, making opening this knife very fast, functional and fun. Once the Subcom F is already in the open position it is very easy to change from one grip position to another. I recommend you place a small piece of fine grit tape (3M-Outdoor Thread Tape) on the clothing clip so that it will help facilitate changes in grip position while providing a gripping surface for the finger tips. It should also be noted that most of these Subcom F opening techniques will work even if youre wearing cold weather leather gloves.
Can the Subcom F be used defensively when in the closed position? The answer is yes it can!
1) You can use the Subcom F in the closed position as a fist hold by placing it in your palm and closing your fingers around to form a fist. Then the strengthened hand can punch, back fist, or make hammer type blows.
2) You can place the Subcom F in your palm so it protrudes between the first and second knuckles of the index and middle fingers and then use it for poking and thrusting techniques.
3) Wrap a tight fist around the Subcom F so the middle, ring and pinky fingers hold the knife and let the butt end with jimping protruding from the bottom of your fist. The Subcom F can now be used in hammer type blows with great effect. I tested this method by hitting a catchers mitt multiple times as hard as I could and the knife remained unchanged in my hand position, and with no damage occurring to my hand.
4) If you hold the Subcom F like you would a cookie in one hand with the jimping of the handle facing outward you can use the handle side or blade spine side for thrusting into and scraping sensitive parts of your opponent body, i.e. nose, ears, wrists, throat etc.
5) Finally the Subcom F can be held in the hand by curling four fingers and pressing the knife flat into the palm, the thumb can then be extended away from the fist and use to grab or pinch sensitive areas on your opponents body trapping them between your thumb and the jimping on the handle, i.e. nose, ears, fingers etc. Trap you own finger in this way and squeeze to see just how painful and effective this technique can be.
The Subcom F truly measures up to my six point checklist for the title of defensive knife carry and passes all the tests with flying colors. I would not hesitate to recommend this knife for either a deep concealment back-up defensive knife or even as a primary defensive tool.
I have carried and used my test sample Subcom F on a daily basis. I have used it to cut paper, heavy cardboard, plumbers tape, waxed string, para cord, 50 lb test fishing line, nylon rope, zip ties, thick rubber tie down cords (the type with s-hooks), denim, wood, meat, fruits, vegetables, and 3/8 thick leather belts. The Subcom F performed all these cutting tasks with ease. Throughout all the cutting the Subcom F held a pretty decent edge which is good considering the steel used for the knife is 420J2. However, it did need re-sharpening from time to time. Re-sharpening quickly brought back the edge to hair popping sharp. One recommendation I would make is to upgrade the steel quality for this knife. It certainly deserves it!
In conclusion kudos for the people at Boker USA for the quality workmanship that went into making the Subcom F, at affordable pricing for the ELU (end line user) and for recognizing and bringing to us a new and very talented knife designer by the name of Chad Los Banos. This is his first knife design to go into production and a standing ovation is in order for his first time up at bat as he has hit a Grand Slam Homerun! Rest assured that his design endeavor is nothing short of creative genius, meticulously developed and designed from the blade point to the lanyard hole. The Subcom F is both attractive and functional much to his credit. It is refreshing to see new, innovative and creative design work enter the knife marketplace. Mark my words, I can guarantee you that this will not be the last time you hear the name Chad Los Banos.
Sifu Dr. Jan Miller is a Master Instructor of Shaolin Kung Fu, Tai Chi Chuan and Filipino Stick and Dagger Fighting at the Dragon Tiger Kung Fu Center in Smithtown, New York. Dr. Miller has an extensive background in many different forms of Martial Arts, including Boxing, Wrestling, Fencing, Judo, Karate, Several Styles of Chinese Kung Fu, Filipino Stick and Dagger Fighting, and the Western and Asian Forms of Knife Fighting. His colleagues across the United States know him best for his expertise with many different forms of bladed weapons.
1) The blade opens very well with a Kelly McCann-style "marble shooting" opening. This is accomplished with a quick, snappy flick of the thumb forward against the tip of the thumb stud, near the designers (Chad Los Banos) logo. The technique resembles shooting a marble that sits on top of the forefinger and is flicked with the thumb, which some of you will remember from playing marbles is called fulking. The knife then may be griped in the hammer, sabre or the underhand grip after the opening.
2) Chad Los Banos made me aware of what he refers to as a sweet spot on the thumb stud which can be found on the tip edge of the thumb stud near his logo. Applying pressure with your thumb at this point allows for an easier opening of the blade.
3) A fast and easy way to open the Subcom F is to force your thumb nail down to the blade at the sweet spot between the thumb stud and handle and push the stud in a straight line forward to open. This is one of my favorite opening techniques for this knife and it is very quick.
4) With the black G-10 handle side facing upwards try pinching both the top and bottom studs at the same time between the index finger and thumb and then push on the clothing clip backwards with your middle finger towards your palm as you push the top thumb stud forward to open.
5) Spyderco knife fans will love this one. Grasp the two studs between the index finger pad and thumb pad in the tip up blade position with the butt end of the knife facing upwards. A quick snap of the wrist downwards will open the blade as the weight of the handle swings downward. Spyderco lovers will recognize the technique commonly called the spyder- drop. Readjust the handle in the hand for a hammer or sabre grip.
6) Inertia openings are possible with a lot of practice. Most people will have trouble overcoming the spring tension to accomplish this type of opening with any small knife. However if you like opening a knife this way you can cheat a little by pushing both the under stud and top stud just a little, enough to overcome the tension of the spring and then flip your wrist and knife upwards or flip the wrist and knife over (palm facing upwards) for the inertia opening. With practice an inertia opening can done without cheating. This can be accomplished by grasping the G-10 handle in the middle with your thumb and placing the index finger on the back of the clothing clip. Hold it firmly between the fingers, with the blade spine facing downwards, and your palm also facing down. Snap the wrist downwards hard and fast to overcome the spring tension. Once the blade swings partially open you can either flip the knife upwards to open or flip the wrist over into a palm up position to snap the blade into place. You can also do the inertia opening in ice pick grip. Hold the Subcom F tip up, place your thumb high up on the clothing clip and grasp the black G-10 handle side by pressing it against the side of your index finger. Snap your wrist and hand downwards sharply and stop abruptly. The blade should swing open and lock in place.
7) Try this for a quick opening into the scalpel grip (the index finger pressed alongside the top spine of the blade). Hold the Subcom F sideways with the butt end facing to the left. Have the black G-10 handle side facing upwards. Place the right thumb directly over the top of the O nut of the pivot pin and place your middle finger on the middle of the clothing clip on the metal side and hook the stud (on the bottom metal side) with your index finger. Pull to the right drawing the spine of the blade and point towards the webbing of your hand between the thumb and index finger. Once the blade snaps open move your middle finger into the finger choil and pull inwards and down as the knife handle rotates into the palm. Place your index finger along the top portion of the spine. Although this may sound complicated, it is really easy to do once you get the hang of it.
8) Another opening you can use for scalpel grip is to hold the Subcom F by grasping both studs with the index finger and thumb (tang facing upwards). Push backwards on the side edge of the clip with your middle finger directing it towards the palm. Then use the index finger to hook the bottom stud and pull straight upwards until the knife clicks open and place the middle finger into the finger choil and the index finger into the scalpel grip position described earlier.
9) If you favor the ice pick grip/pikal (blade facing outwards) place your thumb on the middle of the clothing clip with the metal side of the Subcom F facing you, with the butt of the Subcom F facing upwards and index finger on the black G-10 side of the handle. Use your middle finger to push downward on the edge of the stud to open. Readjust your hand position to hold the handle in the ice pick grip. If you reverse the knife position so that you now place your thumb on the G-10 handle and the studs face back towards the palm you can use the same technique to open the Subcom F into reverse ice pick /reverse pikal (blade facing inwards). Just a word of caution when pushing the thumb stud in this direction the blade tip will pass closely to your palm, be careful not to let the tip of the blade come in contact with the palm. If this method is not to your liking you can open the knife with the first method and then roll the knife handle in your palm towards your thumb into the reverse ice pick grip.
10) If you want to open the Subcom F and have it ready to go into action but hidden from view try this technique. Do the exact same technique as described in the first part of technique #9 except use your ring finger instead of the middle finger to open the knife. You will notice that the knife now sits nestled into the hollow of the palm. Place your index finger around and over the top of the butt jimping and hold your hand down at your side palm facing backwards and the Subcom F disappears from frontal view.
11) Heres a unique opening and interesting grip position you may want to try. To use the Subcom F in a push dagger grip hold the knife so that the top portion of the handle sits on the palm so you can see the knife spine and tip (blade tip points towards you). Place the thumb over the O nut of the pivot pin. Using your middle finger nail hook the stud on the metal side and lift it towards the front to open as you apply pressure to the side of the knife with your thumb. Next wrap your middle finger into the finger choil and place the index finger on the left side of the handle and grasp the rest of the knife handle into the palm forming a fist. The blade will now extend outwards from between the index and middle fingers. Now the Subcom F can be used to thrust with like a push dagger.
12) Two Handed Openings: This type of opening may seem very obvious to most knife handlers but I thought I would mention them anyway. There is absolutely nothing wrong with opening a knife with two hands when time permits. They are simple methods that anyone who has ever owned a pocket knife will be familiar with. Use the left hand fingers to grab the studs on the Subcom F and while the right hand holds the handle in place the left hand will open the blade. This technique is good for hammer or sabre grip positions.
13) You can also grab the Subcom F by the studs with the left hand fingers and use the right hand to open the handle as the left hand keeps the blade stationary until the blade locks into place. This technique is good for ice pick/pikal grip position.
As you can see there are many ways to practice opening the Subcom F, making opening this knife very fast, functional and fun. Once the Subcom F is already in the open position it is very easy to change from one grip position to another. I recommend you place a small piece of fine grit tape (3M-Outdoor Thread Tape) on the clothing clip so that it will help facilitate changes in grip position while providing a gripping surface for the finger tips. It should also be noted that most of these Subcom F opening techniques will work even if youre wearing cold weather leather gloves.
Can the Subcom F be used defensively when in the closed position? The answer is yes it can!
1) You can use the Subcom F in the closed position as a fist hold by placing it in your palm and closing your fingers around to form a fist. Then the strengthened hand can punch, back fist, or make hammer type blows.
2) You can place the Subcom F in your palm so it protrudes between the first and second knuckles of the index and middle fingers and then use it for poking and thrusting techniques.
3) Wrap a tight fist around the Subcom F so the middle, ring and pinky fingers hold the knife and let the butt end with jimping protruding from the bottom of your fist. The Subcom F can now be used in hammer type blows with great effect. I tested this method by hitting a catchers mitt multiple times as hard as I could and the knife remained unchanged in my hand position, and with no damage occurring to my hand.
4) If you hold the Subcom F like you would a cookie in one hand with the jimping of the handle facing outward you can use the handle side or blade spine side for thrusting into and scraping sensitive parts of your opponent body, i.e. nose, ears, wrists, throat etc.
5) Finally the Subcom F can be held in the hand by curling four fingers and pressing the knife flat into the palm, the thumb can then be extended away from the fist and use to grab or pinch sensitive areas on your opponents body trapping them between your thumb and the jimping on the handle, i.e. nose, ears, fingers etc. Trap you own finger in this way and squeeze to see just how painful and effective this technique can be.
The Subcom F truly measures up to my six point checklist for the title of defensive knife carry and passes all the tests with flying colors. I would not hesitate to recommend this knife for either a deep concealment back-up defensive knife or even as a primary defensive tool.
I have carried and used my test sample Subcom F on a daily basis. I have used it to cut paper, heavy cardboard, plumbers tape, waxed string, para cord, 50 lb test fishing line, nylon rope, zip ties, thick rubber tie down cords (the type with s-hooks), denim, wood, meat, fruits, vegetables, and 3/8 thick leather belts. The Subcom F performed all these cutting tasks with ease. Throughout all the cutting the Subcom F held a pretty decent edge which is good considering the steel used for the knife is 420J2. However, it did need re-sharpening from time to time. Re-sharpening quickly brought back the edge to hair popping sharp. One recommendation I would make is to upgrade the steel quality for this knife. It certainly deserves it!
In conclusion kudos for the people at Boker USA for the quality workmanship that went into making the Subcom F, at affordable pricing for the ELU (end line user) and for recognizing and bringing to us a new and very talented knife designer by the name of Chad Los Banos. This is his first knife design to go into production and a standing ovation is in order for his first time up at bat as he has hit a Grand Slam Homerun! Rest assured that his design endeavor is nothing short of creative genius, meticulously developed and designed from the blade point to the lanyard hole. The Subcom F is both attractive and functional much to his credit. It is refreshing to see new, innovative and creative design work enter the knife marketplace. Mark my words, I can guarantee you that this will not be the last time you hear the name Chad Los Banos.
Sifu Dr. Jan Miller is a Master Instructor of Shaolin Kung Fu, Tai Chi Chuan and Filipino Stick and Dagger Fighting at the Dragon Tiger Kung Fu Center in Smithtown, New York. Dr. Miller has an extensive background in many different forms of Martial Arts, including Boxing, Wrestling, Fencing, Judo, Karate, Several Styles of Chinese Kung Fu, Filipino Stick and Dagger Fighting, and the Western and Asian Forms of Knife Fighting. His colleagues across the United States know him best for his expertise with many different forms of bladed weapons.
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2005
- Messages
- 475
Thanks for such great, in-depth review Dr. Miller. I appreciate the time you took in writing it to cover so many aspects of the tool. Almost like reading a reference volume, albeit one that is easy to read.
Aloha my knifebrothers!
Hey, mahalo much "ZIP" for an incredible review!!! My goodness bro...I always freak out on it no matter how many times I read it!:thumbup:
Thanks SO very much for your time, and for being an SF tester!
God bless and take care:thumbup:
Hey, mahalo much "ZIP" for an incredible review!!! My goodness bro...I always freak out on it no matter how many times I read it!:thumbup:
Thanks SO very much for your time, and for being an SF tester!
God bless and take care:thumbup:
swissbianco
Moderator
- Joined
- May 28, 2005
- Messages
- 820
thanks! any info about the timeframe?
swissbianco said:
Aloha swissbianco,
LOL, no...not yet on the black version. I think that Boker is having a hard time supplying the current version to their vendors, let alone making the all black version.
That's a good sign though...means that it is worth the possiblilities of making a TacBlack SUBCOM Folder! God bless, and thanks for your interest!:thumbup:
swissbianco
Moderator
- Joined
- May 28, 2005
- Messages
- 820
thats ok, no of that folders have reach swiss yet. i only hope it will fit my big swiss hand... for the black color i will look for myself.
for the black color i will look for myself.
u812
Gold Member
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2002
- Messages
- 13,338
I just recieved the SF.
I have to say that I has shocked by the quality of this knife.The action is smooth,00000 and 0 blade play,frame lock is perfect,edge is as sharp out of the box as any knife I have.I love the all screw constuction.I have carried it all day in the watch pocket of my jeans and could not tell it was there at all.There is not a grip you can hold it in that you do not have access to some traction lugs.
The only thing I noticed that I had to work on was the clip,it was to tight to slip over my pocket,very easy fix though and I would rather have to loosen one as tighten it.
Very nice design and I am hopeing to see some more of Chads work in larger pieces.
I have to say that I has shocked by the quality of this knife.The action is smooth,00000 and 0 blade play,frame lock is perfect,edge is as sharp out of the box as any knife I have.I love the all screw constuction.I have carried it all day in the watch pocket of my jeans and could not tell it was there at all.There is not a grip you can hold it in that you do not have access to some traction lugs.
The only thing I noticed that I had to work on was the clip,it was to tight to slip over my pocket,very easy fix though and I would rather have to loosen one as tighten it.
Very nice design and I am hopeing to see some more of Chads work in larger pieces.
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2005
- Messages
- 1
Hello Im new to this forum. I recieved a Subcom For christmas and i love it! For the price and performance it cant be beat. I have added lanyard fob and slightly rounded the jimps for better grip. I think i read in another thread that these knives can be modified to be better. Would you guys know any other mods i can do? Anyways this is a great Knife! I been having a blast practicing my Kali templates with it. I prefer this knife to my Almar slb which made me fall inlove with short fat blades. I will deffinitely get another when they upgrade the steel. Is this upgraded steel version going to be the premium model? It would be nice to have a subcom with premium material. Thanks to CLB for designing a great little knife.