Supersteels. Practicality or Novelty?

IMO, higher end steels are well worth the price. My primary EDC blades are M390, 154CM or S30V.

I HATE sharpening. When you get accustomed to using M390, cheap steels seem to dull if you even think about using them.
 
I might not need it all the time, but I like to know a higher level of performance and quality are available. Supersteels (for now), yes.

As for the car analogy, I do take one of my cars to the road course and dragstrip several times a season, but I can also use that same car to drive to work once in a while, or just aimlessly drive around in, alongside other car nuts. I also have a car that I drive on a regular basis, because it's more comfortable for long drives, gets better gas mileage, and is dressy enough for a night on the town.

Like someone above said, for a lot of people it's more of a want than a need.
 
Chris Pierce said:
Another vote for novelty. I've used some of the super steels on the job and not had a lot of luck with them. Whether I'm making gaskets, scraping gaskets, cutting out sprayed insulation, opening bags of c-mix or cutting miles of dirty road fabric, the knife is going to need to be sharpened at the end of the day no matter what steel it is. I much prefer spending 5 minutes touching up aus8 than 30 minutes filing the chips out of zdp189 or even vg-10. That brown FFG endura I had was terrible for chipping. YMMV
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And there you go. A man that uses his knives like I do.

I wouldn't go as far as to say the "super steels" are a novelty, as all the steels we have today started out somewhere as "super steels". I remember when 440c came out big in the 70s (note: I did not say debut) and we were all astonished. Who could afford it? Who would need it?

And then the carbon steel devotees proceeded to express their disgust every time it was brought up as they associated stainless knive steels with their crappy kitchen knives or the early offerings of stainless from different makers.

I don't understand the need for the super steels myself because I am in construction and use my knives literally all day. I don't cut up an apple or sandwich or just break down a box now and then. In addition to Chris' comments, add cutting shingles and sheetrock, cutting molding, cutting through fiberglass banding when material is delivered, opening appliance boxes, cutting adhesive tubes, and on an on.

Regardless of the steel, and I have all the way to Kershaw's 110V, they all need a few swipes on the rod at the end of the day to get them ready for work again the next day.

I think it is important to see how knives are used on this forum. When knife pictures are posted, 99% of the knives are in like new condition, even when the user proudly proclaims the knife to be a favorite, carried for years. So IMHO, having a super steel is like a guy buying a super sports car. No, he won't ever use all 600 hp, but if he needed it, he sure could.

To me, if a knife is to be used as a tool, the knife and the steel are user specific as are all my construction tools. I don't buy the finest grade German or Swiss made wood chisels that last forever when cutting soft woods as I know I might hang a door that is made from white oak. My $65 each chisels roll the edge and chip on that stuff just like a $15 chisel. Yet in the field, I can touch up the $15 chisel in a couple of seconds. So matching the tool to the job is the key to me.

That being said, I still think that some (certainly not all) of today's "super steels" will be ho hum stuff and the norm in 20 years.

Robert
 
In my daily life, I would be hard pressed notice the difference between 420HC and S90V. At work, sod and dirt will dull all steel at pretty much the same rate. I preferred 154CM or carbon steel simply because I could put a high quality edge back on the knife with minimal effort. Sure, a DMT fine could sharpen S30V in very short work, but the edge quality was not the best. I'd rather have something that can take a high sharpness edge, hold that sharpness for a while, but still be easy to resharpen. Sure, I'd like S110V, but there would be no way I would cut sod or dig with that knife. It would essentially become pocket jewlery.
 
Well, steels have created a whole new sub-culture of internet metallurgists. I have knives in various steels and I prefer ones that hold an edge longer as I don't like to sharpen knives. Those who prefer sharpening their knives frequently might like less edge retention. Each to their own.
 
Bugout Bill said:
Sure, I'd like S110V, but there would be no way I would cut sod or dig with that knife. It would essentially become pocket jewlery.
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And prohibitive too, is the price of some of these super steeled knives. I know I am going to go right to the edge of abuse (with a truck full of tools, I can usually put my hands on the right one) when using it every once in a while. Tools serve, tools break, and tools wear out; that's the life cycle with me.

Although it has been decades since I actually broke a knife, I would still rather put my Kershaw Tremor in my pocket for a work ($20 delivered on closeout) than my $95 Kershaw Shallot. If an accident happens to a knife or I miscalculate the task at hand and damage a knife, I would much rather it be the Tremor than the Shallot. And since both seem to perform equally as well in the field, my Shallot is as you aptly described, just pocket jewelry now.

Robert
 
I've found the "super-steels" to be handy.
Sure you have to sharpen them, but not as much as often.
On days when I really had to use the hell out of a knife, a steel with better edge retention retained its edge better (gasp! :eek:).
So, I was able to cut more effectively for longer.

Still sharpened it when I got home, but it wasn't as much needed.

No diamonds either...just silicon carbide paper on a granite tile. :)
 
I could care less about labels (supersteel), and status symbol crap. If it works harder and longer, with less cutting effort, I like it. I would rather touch up a very high quality steel at the end of the day, than fool with a badly chipped or rolled edge. I collect users and I love them to the point of dripping perspiration.
 
Akcir said:
If it works harder and longer, with less cutting effort, I like it. I would rather touch up a very high quality steel at the end of the day, than fool with a badly chipped or rolled edge.
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That's pretty much the gist of it all right there. :thumbup:
 
I dunno about practicality. I just don't want to sharpen in the middle of a job because my knife got dull. If that's novelty...*shrugs*...
 
singularity35 said:
I dunno about practicality. I just don't want to sharpen in the middle of a job because my knife got dull. If that's novelty...*shrugs*...
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Does that realistically happen? I have still been able to cut carboard with edges that won't cut paper.

IMO: all steel dulls, some dulls at different rates and dulls in a different manner. I'd rather have a knife with the right steel for its intended scope of use than supersteel in a knife it is not intended in.

If a knife is a slicer, gimme S110V. If it is designed to be a folding pry bar, make it with an appropriate steel. I feel that a lot of sprint runs are done because collectors will buy the knife based on the steel, rather than actual performance (spyderco and Benchmade being exceptions). But I'd have much rather seen a CPM-3V ZT561 than a S110V one.
 
midnight flyer said:
To me, if a knife is to be used as a tool, the knife and the steel are user specific as are all my construction tools. I don't buy the finest grade German or Swiss made wood chisels that last forever when cutting soft woods as I know I might hang a door that is made from white oak. My $65 each chisels roll the edge and chip on that stuff just like a $15 chisel. Yet in the field, I can touch up the $15 chisel in a couple of seconds. So matching the tool to the job is the key to me.
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I pretty much follow this mind set also bud. This thread was interesting in that there is a viable basis for differing views. One example is that some hate sharpening, some don't mind etc. I feel no need for higher end steel and I think that my ''best'' steel owned was in a C95 Manix with S30V. I traded that off for my first ESEE and I am still happy with the trade, even though some feel that the Spyderco had more collector ''value''. And this gets back to personal choice, what we value individualy, and our uses or desires for these tools. I don't mind sharpening a knife, or axe for that matter. And I value wood processing\fire starting. Whatever floats a dudes boat.
 
Bugout Bill said:
Does that realistically happen? I have still been able to cut carboard with edges that won't cut paper.

IMO: all steel dulls, some dulls at different rates and dulls in a different manner. I'd rather have a knife with the right steel for its intended scope of use than supersteel in a knife it is not intended in.

If a knife is a slicer, gimme S110V. If it is designed to be a folding pry bar, make it with an appropriate steel. I feel that a lot of sprint runs are done because collectors will buy the knife based on the steel, rather than actual performance (spyderco and Benchmade being exceptions). But I'd have much rather seen a CPM-3V ZT561 than a S110V one.
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I just knew someone would call me out on that. You may like to cut dirty cardboard by tearing it, I don't.
 
singularity35 said:
I just knew someone would call me out on that. You may like to cut dirty cardboard by tearing it, I don't.
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I didn't intend to cause any offense. If carboard cutting makes up the majority of your cutting tasks, then I'm sure high vanadium steels are very important to you.
 
8cr13mov, aus8 etc. works fine for me. I touch up my blades frequently even if it's just a few swipes on the sharp maker regardless of steel type but something like CPM D2 or m390 does hold its fine edge much longer in my experience.
 
I think that it depends a lot on what's a super-steel. I can whittle or cut boxes with my S30V EnZo Birk all day long without having to sharpen it, but three minutes of boxcutting with my 8Cr14MoV knives and I need to grab my Sharpmaker. The CTS-204P you'd find in my Southard is probably redundant, though.
 
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