Symbols of the American West Eaten by Rich Foreigners

[namaarie]

Perhaps we should make America a huge nature preserve. Remove all people, except backpackers and khukuri lovers. Ahhh, utopia realized...

 

[Dave Rishar]

Perhaps we should make America a huge nature preserve. Remove all people, except backpackers and khukuri lovers. Ahhh, utopia realized...

Until we run out of beer.

 

[munk]

Buffalo Commons- tell the Plains States occupants to hit the road, the Buff are coming.

lets see...A meterorite can hit Earth and end Man, Yellowstone its super Volcano self and end Man as we know Him today....or Man can end Man: in any event, will the animals and insects really have too long to wait? I prefer to let them wait just a little longer.








munk

 

[Yvsa]

Quote:
Originally Posted by namaarie
Perhaps we should make America a huge nature preserve. Remove all people, except backpackers and khukuri lovers. Ahhh, utopia realized...

Until we run out of beer.

Don't need beer as long as you have marijuana, mushrooms, and peyote.
Let alone some of the other intoxicants my people had long ago.

To quote an old wise-assed ndn I know in response to the question whether we came over the Bering Strait, "We are here for we have never left. Hayv!"
Besides if that isn't true then where are the ndn people on the other side of the Bering Strait? Surely if the immigration story is true not everyone immigrated.
There are always the ones who stay home no matter what.

 

[Yvsa]

Too get back on topic...
Even the American soldier of yesteryear was known to eat his horses or mules if there was no other food available. My people commonly ate our dogs when no other food was available and sometimes even when it was.
Meat is meat no matter where it comes from. The only thing one has to remember is that, "Meat's not meat until it's in the pan cooking," an old hunters saying.
I would have no hangups about eating horse, or mule, or dog, as long as I didn't know the animal personally. That's one reason most people who raise beef cattle don't name 'em. If you name something then you're not supposed to eat it.

But then ndns often have a strange sense of humor. When I'd go to my aunt's and uncle's places we would often laugh and say, "Give me another one of Porkies pork chop's." or the like. Even though we knew the animal was named we knew that it would eventually wind up as meat and in the pan.

 

[Nasty]

I suppose almost any animal, or at least part of it (like blowfish) can be food for us. After all, like bears, we are omnivors. That's just one of the reasons we are the top level predator on this planet...we are adaptable. Can you imagine man being like being a koala and eating only eucalyptus or other highly restricted food?

 

[Ben Arown-Awile]

...where are the ndn people on the other side of the Bering Strait?...

There is a whole continent full of them. They are generally referred to as Asians.

But they weren't the first immigrants to this continent. The Negroes beat them to it. They came from what is now Australia and share genetic roots with the Australian Aborigine. They settled in Brazil, and their remnants can be found along the southern tip of South America.

But even before them, a Caucasian group came from Europe, probably over the Baffin land bridge to the East. They have been traced to, of all places, France.

So, Yvsa, maybe you are right after all. You're people might not be of Asian origin. Maybe they are really Frenchmen!

 

[Ben Arown-Awile]

...Meat is meat no matter where it comes from...

I agree. When I ate meat, I ate most everything that walked, crawled, or swam, including horse, but that's not the point.

It's not the eating of the meat that the I oppose, it's the extinction of the species and the loss of what it represents to our history and culture.

The selling of the meat is a by-product of the slaughter. The purpose of the slaughter is because the cattle corporations don't want to share the grazing rights with the horses and burros, even though the cattle are grazing on public land and the horses were there first.

It's more important to profit from selling Big Macs to fat-ass Americans than to preserve a connection to a historic way of life.

Seems like I remember the government doing something similar to your people, Yvsa?

 

[Ben Arown-Awile]

Weren't horses re-introduced by Europeans after they go extinct near the ice age?

I was thinking about this again, and a question came to mind that maybe someone here knows the answer to.

If there were no native horses before the Spanish brought them here, how did the plains Indians get around? Their way of life revolved around the horse.

When they went on a raiding party, did they walk up to an enemy’s camp and steal his laundry?

Hunting buffalo must have been quite a trip - running along beside the thundering herd trying to bring one down.

Would Crazy Horse's great-grandfather been named Crazy Moccasin?

 

[hollowdweller]

I don't have much trouble killing and eating stuff that I raise, mainly goats and chickens. I feel bad killing anything of course, but I think it's a basic human trait of our self consciousness to be able to empathize to a degree with stuff we eat. If you look at almost all primitive religions, most have elaborate rituals of atonement to either the animals, or more in the abstract the sun which are the source of their food supply. This is even true to a great degree in Christianity with the celebration of the eucharist("take this bread it's my body, the wine is my blood") and a lot of the ascetic practices which have their roots in atonement for Jesus's sacrifice.

 

[munk]

Ben said it. I wasn't going to....but the indications are the oldest group in America came from what is now France.

But they're always finding new things. There are still undiscovered wonders in about our Earth. I hope to God one of them is we didn't come from France. But if we did, at least we know a small peace, for we gave them McDonald's, and almost wipes the slate clean.

Ben- that's right- the horse changed everything for many ndns. I believe it's what made the Cheyenne able reach Canada.

munk

 

[DannyinJapan]

As far as we know the pre-Columbian plains indians did not have horses, so their life must have been different.
(unless they rode dogs)

"There is a whole continent full of them. They are generally referred to as Asians.

But they weren't the first immigrants to this continent. The Negroes beat them to it. They came from what is now Australia and share genetic roots with the Australian Aborigine. They settled in Brazil, and their remnants can be found along the southern tip of South America.

But even before them, a Caucasian group came from Europe, probably over the Baffin land bridge to the East. They have been traced to, of all places, France."

this all sounds like mitochondrial archaeology to me. If there is physical evidence of all this, I'd like to hear about it.
I am familiar with some similarities to the Jomon culture and some middle-american pottery shards, but I havent heard anything about Australoids in Brazil.

Can you give me something to look at about all of this ?

 

[hollowdweller]

I hope to God one of them is we didn't come from France. But if we did, at least we know a small peace, for we gave them McDonald's, and almost wipes the slate clean.
munk

I like France. They are as stubborn and independant as we are, they support their farmers way better than we do, they have great food and they love goat cheese! And they make great wine! I could do without the horse meat and goose liver though.

 

[Ben Arown-Awile]

..I am familiar with some similarities to the Jomon culture and some middle-american pottery shards, but I havent heard anything about Australoids in Brazil. Can you give me something to look at about all of this ?

As far as physical evidence, much research has been done on the African-Olmecs of Pre-Columbian America.

Although probably not yet part of mainstream Anthropology, here is some other interesting reading: The full text is here: http://tinyurl.com/64emw

"The earliest people in the Americas were people of the Negritic African race, who entered the Americas perhaps as early as 100,000 years ago, by way of the Bering straight and about thirty thousand years ago in a worldwide maritime undertaking that included journeys from the then wet and lake filled Sahara towards the Indian Ocean and the Pacific, and from West Africa across the Atlantic Ocean towards the Americas.
According to the Gladwin Thesis, this ancient journey occurred, particularly about 75,000 years ago and included Black Pygmies, Black Negritic peoples and Black Australoids similar to the Aboriginal Black people of Australia and parts of Asia, including India."


Here is another interesting thesis: I have extracted from the introduction and the conclusion. The full text is here: http://tinyurl.com/5gfkm

"...the recent discovery of skeletal remains from Brazil, which date back 15,000 years, also adds weight to the growing mountain of evidence which seems to contraindicate the prevailing paradigm, as they represent a person of markedly African ancestry. Taken together, all indicators seem to point to the likelihood that more than one distinct racial group was present in the Americas during the early Paleolithic..."

"...it would be disingenuous at best for them or anyone else, in good conscience, to continue to deny the fact that 'The early inhabitants of North America were members of diverse ethnic groups, and did not all necessarily resemble the Asiatic Mongoloid genotypes which we commonly think of as being 'Native American' today.'..."

 

[Bill Martino]

Interesting stuff and thanks.

 

[Yvsa]

I was thinking about this again, and a question came to mind that maybe someone here knows the answer to.

If there were no native horses before the Spanish brought them here, how did the plains Indians get around? Their way of life revolved around the horse.

When they went on a raiding party, did they walk up to an enemy’s camp and steal his laundry?

Hunting buffalo must have been quite a trip - running along beside the thundering herd trying to bring one down.

Would Crazy Horse's great-grandfather been named Crazy Moccasin?

From another post... It's really strange there ain't no Asians that look like ndns in Asia then. I do agree that there may have been some immigration from other lands, perhaps even France that intermingled and married the ndn people that were already here.
For some odd reason I prefer too listen too my elders about our origins than a bunch of damned fools who don't have roots to this land like we do.

To answer these questions from this post though...
The ndns that migrated from place to place following the game and season done it all by back and dog.
The dogs were fitted with either packs or small travois like was used on the horse.

The buffalo were hunted either by stealth or by stampeding them in a chosen direction over a cliff. The waste of meat must have been horrendous according to the scientist that study such things.
According to the old stories I have heard the people that hunted buffalo in that way camped there for weeks eating their fill and preserving most of the rest.
On Howard's website he mentioned the length of time that pemmican was suppsed to keep.
When properly stored in dugouts the pemmican could last for decades. I've heard 30 years and supposedly longer but 30 years doesn't seem impossible to me.
Not a lot of non-ndns know about the dugouts used to store excess food. They could be quite large and were dug in a sort of bell shape.
There were the public ones open to everyone who needed the food and the smaller private ones used to also store some long term perishable food like pumpkins and squash and other hard native foods.
All were lined with grass and the food was placed in in layers.
The root cellar was here long before the invaders, Wasichu or in the Cherokee tongue the Yonegi.
Wasichu is translated as "Eaters of the fat." Yonegi is "white person, or white eyes." I've heard it both ways.

Not much raiding was done before the horse although full out war was. The object was to earn honor and a high place in the tribe.
Some tribes experienced times of great peace under the Old Ones who were sent to them.

Crazy Moccasin is possible as the men who went on the warpath always took moccasin material along with them so as to always have footware. Real mocs don't last long when worn all the time.

 

[munk]

"and Black Australoids.... "


Are these the ones in Space that will hit the Earth and kill us all?




munk

 

[hollowdweller]

"and Black Australoids.... "


Are these the ones in Space that will hit the Earth and kill us all?




munk

I have some black austrolorps (chickens)

 

[Ad Astra]

Neat stuff, Yvsa, and from a reputable source! I'd heard that ndns knew of the wheel- used it as a child's toy- but preferred the travois for ease of use/replacement. Course they couldn't yet make iron-shod wheels. Ndns worked soft metals, though? I don't know much of their state of metallurgy.

Now tell the truth, as the Elders relate, how the first True Bent Blade was handed down from the Sky People, to us- the enlightened forumites... and how it migrated to the Celts & Greeks, then Nepalese. Maybe a saucer just flew over and dropped the things... Somehow, you got one before I did!

AA

A "Khukuri Creation Myth" thread might be a great topic for a slow day... all due respect to Bishwakarma, who loves us greatly.

 

[Yvsa]

I forgot to reply about the loss of the wild horse. Yes, I agree it's the cattle people, just like they're doing the same thing near Yellowstone with the buffalo and their claims of the buff carrying brucolitious(sp).

But like the buffalo the wild horse will survive in small lots in small places just like my people have done. Speaking of my people there are nearly 300,000 enrolled Cherokee now I think. If I would get off my lazy ass and trace down my ancestory there would be one more. It's the shltz Having to Prove you are something although I do support the tribes right to do so unlike some azzholes I know of.

They want on the rolls for the benefits not even understanding how damned meager they are! NDN health care sucks thoroughly!!!!

However thanks to the Casinos things are improving all over for the ndn people, much to the displeasure of those same azzholes because they're not getting any of it. HEE as my friend Tsimi would say.