Tactical Hawk Comparison Old vs New

Triquetra · Mar 6, 2011

Looking for opinions on how something more traditional like a CS Spike Tomahawk or Roger's Rangers Tomahawk would compare to something like the SOG or ATC Vietnam Hawk, Emerson, or RMJ Shrike in the tactical fighting tomahawk arena. What, if any, would be the disadvantages of the more traditional designs? I'm not really looking for opinions of quality or brands but of design and ability.

Edwood7 · Mar 6, 2011

You will find many opinions on what works best in a fighting axe, some look for a breeching axe that can also work as a fighter, others look to a pure fighter. I have actual real world experience using a tomahawk as a weapon. In my humble opinion, what I look for in a fighting tomahawk is a 15” to 13” handle, noting to long (they work better in a CQC situation). Having a full tang axe really adds to the handling and strength of the axe.
And a short spike for penetrating body armor or tuff clothing like leather is an absolute must in the modern combat world, as the fallowing story i posted on another tread will show you.

I have use my knife in defensive situation before. But recently I used my tomahawk in a life and death situation during a raid on a safe house in the southern part of the country. We wear tipped off about suspicions activities going on in a large house in a upper class neighborhood, the report said that several men whit military uniforms and riffles wear going in and out of the house during the night.

We set up near the house and got the go ahead to enter the house after we got some much needed back up by the Mexican military, once inside most of the almost 11 armed narcos gave themselves up whit out a struggle. We went ahead and cleared the entire house, when we heard one of our guys screaming over the radio for back up. One of the bad guys was hiding in one of the balconies and tried to wrestle the shotgun away from my team mate.

When I arrived to help out, I realized that my friend was struggling to pull out his hand gun from his leg holster, and I pull out my tomahawk and hit the bad guy in the shoulder (he was wearing body armor) the spike on my hawk went right trough the Kevlar and cut his shoulder badly, he immediately stopped fighting and had to be sent to the hospital for stitches. I would have shot him but felt that I might have hit my friend in the struggle. The bastard will live. My friend was alright, but a bit shaken from the whole ordeal. Turns out his leg holster was new and he hadn’t gotten used to it yet. Almost cost him his life. I took these pictures of the vest the idiot was wearing whit my cell phone.

P.S. I was aiming for his head.

My choice and the choice of many professionals that carry a combat axe as a go to fighter is the R & D hawk from Winkler Knives, this axe is just perfect as a CQC weapon.

nutnfancyfan · Mar 6, 2011

i love the looks are those wrinkler hawks , and have been very impressed with his knives as well. i would get myself on of his hawks....but i really have no use for one, and there expensive. i have to ask though, does it ever bother you carrying around such a heavy hawk on your kit? seems to me like people are always trying to get lighter, but you choose to carry a hawk? and how long does it really take you withdraw it from the holster in a combat situation( sorry for all the questions)

cckw · Mar 6, 2011

Edwood7 said:
You will find many opinions on what works best in a fighting axe, some look for a breeching axe that can also work as a fighter, others look to a pure fighter. I have actual real world experience using a tomahawk as a weapon. In my humble opinion, what I look for in a fighting tomahawk is a 15 to 13 handle, noting to long (they work better in a CQC situation). Having a full tang axe really adds to the handling and strength of the axe.
And a short spike for penetrating body armor or tuff clothing like leather is an absolute must in the modern combat world, as the fallowing story i posted on another tread will show you.

My choice and the choice of many professionals that carry a combat axe as a go to fighter is the R & D hawk from Winkler Knives, this axe is just perfect as a CQC weapon.

Good Job!

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

nutnfancyfan said:
i love the looks are those wrinkler hawks , and have been very impressed with his knives as well. i would get myself on of his hawks....but i really have no use for one, and there expensive. i have to ask though, does it ever bother you carrying around such a heavy hawk on your kit? seems to me like people are always trying to get lighter, but you choose to carry a hawk? and how long does it really take you withdraw it from the holster in a combat situation( sorry for all the questions)

Id imagines it could be a burden if I wear in a job that had long foot patrols like some of the American soldiers in Iraq. My job most of the time is anti drug trafficking operations and organized crime related. So we do travel light, no 3 day gear pack etc. most of the movements we have are in vehicles and in helicopter or small plane. At 1 1/2 lbs its not that much of a burden.
The holster that comes whit the hawk is very well taught out, it has a bungee retention cord that can easily be release whit one hand once you get the hang of it. I can have the hawk out in no time.

nutnfancyfan · Mar 7, 2011

thanks for the answer, i see where your coming from now. so...are you like the mexican version of S.W.A.T? thats just kinda what you reminded me of

245Trioxin · Mar 7, 2011

Those are beautiful pieces' but the 800.00 price tag is astounding. The RJM shrike or the VTAC is much more reasonable, as well as almost bomb proof.

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

sigsaur said:
Those are beautiful pieces' but the 800.00 price tag is astounding. The RJM shrike or the VTAC is much more reasonable, as well as almost bomb proof.

Well it is expensive, but a spent almost the same amount on my handgun, I depend on these things. I what to know I'm getting the best when my life. is going to depend on the weapons a carry.

The RMJ hawks are grate but they are not built to be used exclusively as a fighting axe, its a breaching combat axe.

nutnfancyfan · Mar 7, 2011

do you prefer the R&D hawks over the R&D close quarters hawk?

GUN SNOB · Mar 7, 2011

Those are beautiful pieces' but the 800.00 price tag is astounding.

I know its apples and orange's but I have more than $800 tied up in hawks (many, not just one) and its just a Hobie for me not a 'life or death' tool of the trade.

Just saying.

I what to know I'm getting the best when my life. is going to depend on the weapons a carry.

Edwood7, Bet your friend is glad for that $800 hawk.

And thanks for the work you do. Crime dose not know or care about boarders. What you do down south dose affect us here in the north. Thank you for putting your life on the line for all of us.

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

nutnfancyfan said:
do you prefer the R&D hawks over the R&D close quarters hawk?

I have both a short and full sized
R and D hawk, depending on the job, I will take the full sized on night raids and anti drug trafficking operations, when discretion is not a factor. I have it strapped to my armor plate carrier on my left side for a cross draw.

The small one I take when working plain clothes or on executive protection jobs. I have a shoulder strap on it and carry it under my jacket.

They are both grate CQC weapons, I prefer the full sized hawk. Both have their place.

I'm waiting for one of Winklers combat axes, I think its going to be used as both a breaching aid and offensive weapon.

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

nutnfancyfan said:
thanks for the answer, i see where your coming from now. so...are you like the mexican version of S.W.A.T? thats just kinda what you reminded me of

I work for the federal department of public security, it think its our version of your NSA.

nutnfancyfan · Mar 7, 2011

Edwood7 said:
I have both a short and full sized
R and D hawk, depending on the job, I will take the full sized on night raids and anti drug trafficking operations, when discretion is not a factor. I have it strapped to my armor plate carrier on my left side for a cross draw.

The small one I take when working plain clothes or on executive protection jobs. I have a shoulder strap on it and carry it under my jacket.

They are both grate CQC weapons, I prefer the full sized hawk. Both have their place.

I'm waiting for one of Winklers combat axes, I think its going to be used as both a breaching aid and offensive weapon.

YOU HAVE BOTH!!! dude thats a serious chunk of change for a hawk, and you got two? you must of absolutely loved the first one to get a second. either that or Mexico's law enforcement gets paid much better the the usa's

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

nutnfancyfan said:
YOU HAVE BOTH!!! dude thats a serious chunk of change for a hawk, and you got two? you must of absolutely loved the first one to get a second. either that or Mexico's law enforcement gets paid much better the the usa's

Well, I do love knives and specially tomahawks, I'm not rich just very selective, it comes from being a member on this forum.:thumbup:

nutnfancyfan · Mar 7, 2011

im always amazed at how much money people are able to dedicate to knives. i wish i could be one of them.... =(

crossada · Mar 7, 2011

nutnfancyfan said:
im always amazed at how much money people are able to dedicate to knives. i wish i could be one of them.... =(

I've never spent over $200 on a hawk yet but i'm amazed at how much i've spent on some of my fighting bowies though:foot: BUT i sure do love them lol

Here are my two Bill Bagwell Hell's Belles. Amazing fighting bowies to say the least!

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

I only have 5 knives and 2 hawks. I study what I'm going to buy and if its not going to be used I won't get it. Just control the impulse buying.

This is the only custom axe that I have that I don't use. It in the living room, I'm only going to use my custom Magua tomahawk if someone is really asking for it.

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

crossada said:
I've never spent over $200 on a hawk yet but i'm amazed at how much i've spent on some of my fighting bowies though:foot: BUT i sure do love them lol

Here are my two Bill Bagwell Hell's Belles. Amazing fighting bowies to say the least!

I'm really envious of you wright now.:grumpy:

nutnfancyfan · Mar 7, 2011

i have about 13 knives, but i think 6 of them are sak, and i think i only got 1 knife over $100

Edwood7 · Mar 7, 2011

GUN SNOB said:
I know its apples and orange's but I have more than $800 tied up in hawks (many, not just one) and its just a Hobie for me not a 'life or death' tool of the trade.

Just saying.

Edwood7, Bet your friend is glad for that $800 hawk.

And thanks for the work you do. Crime dose not know or care about boarders. What you do down south dose affect us here in the north. Thank you for putting your life on the line for all of us.

Thanks. I only wish I could do more. I'll do it till my body let's me.

Be safe brother.