The Bears' Den--Shirogorov Showcase

dburpasaurus · Apr 23, 2020

CPP said:
Thanks for a great write up about a great knife. I'm curious about the dust protectors you mentioned over the bearings. I found a picture of the Quantum broken down on Shiro's site but don't see anything of this nature.

Perhaps you are referring to the translation of Shiro's description of the blade's tang?

A design feature of the base of the blade allows, if necessary, to easily eliminate contamination of the node without disassembling the knife or any special means.
Looking at the picture of that part of the knife while closed it seems that the placement of the bearing/pivot assembly so close to the rounded segment of the tang allows for easy access in cleaning and lubricating.

Hi CPP - you are astute! Curiosity got the best of me last night and I had to disassemble the quantum. You are correct there are no dust protectors, what I was seeing as shown in your second pic was simply the bearing races that are exposed. As you pointed out the blade has material removed in this area creating a flush condition. I thought those silver races were an additional washer for dust protection but was incorrect. I do believe Shiro's theory that this design will aid in cleaning / keep gunk out of there. This only adds to my belief that this is an extremely well thought out and detailed knife design.

Thanks for pointing that out.

Mr.sig239 · Apr 24, 2020

Got my Covid mask and am ready for work.

Ajack60 · Apr 24, 2020

ChazzyP · Apr 24, 2020

Mr.sig239 said:
Got my Covid mask and am ready for work.

Certainly creative, brother, and at least a little creepy to boot.

SlideRacker · Apr 24, 2020

dburpasaurus said:
Hi CPP - you are astute! Curiosity got the best of me last night and I had to disassemble the quantum. You are correct there are no dust protectors, what I was seeing as shown in your second pic was simply the bearing races that are exposed. As you pointed out the blade has material removed in this area creating a flush condition. I thought those silver races were an additional washer for dust protection but was incorrect. I do believe Shiro's theory that this design will aid in cleaning / keep gunk out of there. This only adds to my belief that this is an extremely well thought out and detailed knife design.

Thanks for pointing that out.

New Shirogorov owner here and the Quantum is my first one. It just arrived today. I need some help from the Shiro veterans. Well, with all new knives and especially with new knife brands, I go through some learning pains. And I do mean literally "pains", lol. The Quantum and me just got to know each other and it told me in no uncertain terms how it did NOT want to be flipped open. Several band-aids later but thankfully no ER visits I think I have a better feel. Seems like a quick, forceful and committed flipping motion is the most effective method as the detent is fairly stiff. I couldn't get cute with it like I do with my ZTs and gradually increase the pressure on the flipper tab to see where it breaks. Well, I could but there are consequences. Has anyone perfected their flipping motion to where you can consistently break the detent without having your finger slip off the flipper tab?

ChazzyP · Apr 25, 2020

SlideRacker said:
New Shirogorov owner here and the Quantum is my first one. It just arrived today. I need some help from the Shiro veterans. Well, with all new knives and especially with new knife brands, I go through some learning pains. And I do mean literally "pains", lol. The Quantum and me just got to know each other and it told me in no uncertain terms how it did NOT want to be flipped open. Several band-aids later but thankfully no ER visits I think I have a better feel. Seems like a quick, forceful and committed flipping motion is the most effective method as the detent is fairly stiff. I couldn't get cute with it like I do with my ZTs and gradually increase the pressure on the flipper tab to see where it breaks. Well, I could but there are consequences. Has anyone perfected their flipping motion to where you can consistently break the detent without having your finger slip off the flipper tab?

I posted an inquiry over at the USN Shiro pages regarding your issue and perhaps will get some feedback for you. I know that

mikomonday has picked up a serial Quantum and I'm sure he'll have some thoughts to share about this.

mikomonday · Apr 25, 2020

dburpasaurus said:
Hi CPP - you are astute! Curiosity got the best of me last night and I had to disassemble the quantum. You are correct there are no dust protectors, what I was seeing as shown in your second pic was simply the bearing races that are exposed. As you pointed out the blade has material removed in this area creating a flush condition. I thought those silver races were an additional washer for dust protection but was incorrect. I do believe Shiro's theory that this design will aid in cleaning / keep gunk out of there. This only adds to my belief that this is an extremely well thought out and detailed knife design.

Thanks for pointing that out.

This is really crucial and why I think that Shirogorov bearings are much better at handling "dirt and grime" compared to other caged bearing designs. Taking a quick micrometer check, the bearings are 1.5mm diameter and the race on 2 of my knives are approx 1.41mm. There just isnt a lot of stuff that's less than a tenth of a millimeter that can get in and stop your knife from working

I should receive my quantum today, it has had a LONG journey. My custom quantum flips quite easily, and the actual flipping motion isn't any different than any other Shirogorov. However I have heard and experienced later NeOn Zero models with horribly stiff detents, something the workshop is aware of and said they have addressed. I hope the quantum doesn't suffer similar issues...

ChazzyP · Apr 25, 2020

It was an RDD day today as we enjoyed some finally warmer, sunny, calm weather and took a ride down-Cape.

dburpasaurus · Apr 28, 2020

SlideRacker said:
New Shirogorov owner here and the Quantum is my first one. It just arrived today. I need some help from the Shiro veterans. Well, with all new knives and especially with new knife brands, I go through some learning pains. And I do mean literally "pains", lol. The Quantum and me just got to know each other and it told me in no uncertain terms how it did NOT want to be flipped open. Several band-aids later but thankfully no ER visits I think I have a better feel. Seems like a quick, forceful and committed flipping motion is the most effective method as the detent is fairly stiff. I couldn't get cute with it like I do with my ZTs and gradually increase the pressure on the flipper tab to see where it breaks. Well, I could but there are consequences. Has anyone perfected their flipping motion to where you can consistently break the detent without having your finger slip off the flipper tab?

Hopefully your wounds are healing up! I don't find the flipping motion of the quantum much different than say an F95 or F3 - the flipper tab on the Quantum is a little bit different shaped however. Personally I have always used more of a light switch opening method on flippers so my finger basically moves parallel to the knife (down the handle) to actuate the flipper. I never found the push button style very enjoyable but that's just me. I haven't had any failed flips so far on the quantum but I will report back if I learn any "what not to do's."

ChazzyP · Apr 28, 2020

S SlideRacker , there's only one reply to my query on your behalf over at the USN Shiro pages. That was from Tom, the host and Shirogorov rep there who indicated there was no intent from the Workshop to ramp up the flipping resistance on their knives. He did suggest that you make sure you're not putting any pressure on the lockbar when trying to flip the knife open. It had not occurred to me to mention that to you as you wrote you were experienced with your ZTs so I figured that advice went without saying. Some knives are much more susceptible than others to flipping failure when pressure is inadvertently applied to the lockbar simultaneously.

Like D dburpasaurus , I tend to be more of a light-switcher and also use my ring finger on the clip as a flipping fulcrum, making sure my middle finger stays neutral and back while floating over the lockbar.

SlideRacker · Apr 28, 2020

ChazzyP said:
S SlideRacker , there's only one reply to my query on your behalf over at the USN Shiro pages. That was from Tom, the host and Shirogorov rep there who indicated there was no intent from the Workshop to ramp up the flipping resistance on their knives. He did suggest that you make sure you're not putting any pressure on the lockbar when trying to flip the knife open. It had not occurred to me to mention that to you as you wrote you were experienced with your ZTs so I figured that advice went without saying. Some knives are much more susceptible than others to flipping failure when pressure is inadvertently applied to the lockbar simultaneously.

Like D dburpasaurus , I tend to be more of a light-switcher and also use my ring finger on the clip as a flipping fulcrum, making sure my middle finger stays neutral and back while floating over the lockbar.

Thanks

ChazzyP and D dburpasaurus . I think you nailed it. The Quantum definitely is highly sensitive to even the slightest pressure on the lockbar, much more so than ZTs. After flipping it many times and making sure my fingers were not on the lockbar it's running better now. I almost have it to the point where it will drop shut smoothly, but not quite there yet. I think it needed some break-in time as well.

ChazzyP · Apr 28, 2020

I'm glad it's working out for you S SlideRacker . There are always lotsa raves from ZT guys about how their knives flip out like rockets, but it's been my experience with most of those I've had that their action depends on stiff detents so it makes sense that some additional pressure on a ZT lockbar wouldn't make as much difference as it would with a knife with a less resistant opening release. Good point on break-in too--so many expect a knife's action to be just right out of the box, when anything mechanical takes some use to run in and function as it was intended.

You owe us some pics, though. You can upload to a photo-sharing host like Imgur, copy the BB code at the desktop site, and paste it right into the body of your text.

SlideRacker · Apr 28, 2020

ChazzyP said:
You owe us some pics, though. You can upload to a photo-sharing host like Imgur, copy the BB code at the desktop site, and paste it right into the body of your text.

Here you go . . . . .

ChazzyP · Apr 28, 2020

SlideRacker said:
Here you go . . . . .

Sweet pics and a sweet knife, man. Thanks for sharing, congrats on your new blade, and welcome to the Den!

ARTT1 · Apr 28, 2020

Mr.sig239 · Apr 28, 2020

Very nice Artt1!

rmill7 · Apr 29, 2020

Howdy Bear's Den! I recently became a zookeeper and now have two bears! The first (F95NL) absolutely blew my socks off. Zero lock stick, true free fall close, solid and comfortable in the hand. I thought I had some nice knives but nothing I have is like this knife! One thing led to another......... and I needed a Shiro to fill that smaller knife slot ya know? You all know. The NeOn Lite joined my collection.

The Neon came to me used, but in great condition with CoA. Tiny bit of marking on the back screw but really not bad at all. My question to other Neon Lite owners out there is two parts: Do you have a small amount of lock stick? Does yours fall shut freely?

I disassembled mine and cleaned it thoroughly and that helped a bit. The action is awesome on open (double click-clack) and is oh so smooth and consistent on the close. It can be shaken shut easily, it just doesn't jump towards your fingers like the F95 (I am comparing mine to the action in the first Shabazz video). Anyone have any tips?

Mr.sig239 · Apr 29, 2020

Nice pair of bears! My neon is old and well worn. No lock stick at all and falls shut on it's own weight or with a slight wiggle once past the detente ball.

ChazzyP · May 1, 2020

Nice pair of Bears indeed,

rmill7 , and welcome to The Zoo, er The Den.

I received my NeOn UL LNIB a couple years back not broken in at all. It was smooth and flipped well enough out of the box but didn't subsequently break in to the point of being free-falling. I eventually gave it my usual first-time cleaning and tune-up which includes getting all the grease out of it, interior polishing, and re-lubing with W10 NanoOil. I don't like grease in any knives--washered or bb'd--and prefer a lighter, freer lube. Interior polishing is done on all pivot contact surfaces--small parts on an old green-loaded strop I use for that purpose and larger parts like blade tang, liners, or slabs can be done with a Dremel and light jeweler's rouge. Of particular import in this are getting the bearing races well-cleaned then de-burred on the strop and soaking the BB's in alcohol to get all the grease and gunk off them.

My NeOn now joins my 111 as one of my top free-droppers despite its small, light blade. The pocket-sword 111 went through those steps around the same time and is now a true thumb guillotine.

rmill7 · May 1, 2020

ChazzyP

Mr.sig239 Thanks for the welcome and advice!

I think despite it's age, the NeOn has not been broken in!! After a couple days of flipping, it is showing less and less resistance. It did have some grease/dried lube in the bearings when I disassembled it. I use Tuf-Glide on my bearing knives, I like that it "dries" and tends to accumulate dust and debris a little slower. At the cost of a little smoothness I'd guess.

The 111 has caught my eye in every picture I have seen of it. It's gotta be the one with the fuller though

Now that I've gone to the deep end, might as well swim down and see where it goes