the fallacy of firesteels

KuRUpTD said:
I like using magnesium bars ... if it's windy you can put your magnesium scrapings on a piece of duct tape :thumbup:
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That sounds like a good idea. I had actually taken a magnesium bar by a friends house, and asked him to scrape off some shavings and light them. I was just showing him that the smaller shavings don't ignite though.
 
KuRUpTD said:
I like using magnesium bars ... if it's windy you can put your magnesium scrapings on a piece of duct tape :thumbup:
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That's a good idea I can use for a couple of things.Thanks!:thumbup:
 
abo4ster said:
Same form factor as a firesteel but not mentioned was its combination with Magnesium.

I have lit natural tinders with my little firesteel/magnesium rod where others have failed with the best firesteels and scrapers alone. Incorporating magnesium gives your another 2,000*F+ plus a brief radiant flame... enough to light old pine needles and hardwood leaves regularly.

Fine vs. Gross Motor Skills
Using a firesteel is a gross motor skill. Getting a match out of a packed match-safe can easily become a fine motor skill. Something to consider.

Nonetheless, I carry REI Stormproof matches, firesteel/magnesium combo, bic, fresnel lens, tinder and at the bottom of my fire kit is friction fire (rope, knife). Always on my person though is the firesteel/magnesium.
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Nice video, Mr. Quiet Bear (aka abo4ster), however I must take exception to one of your statements. You mentioned Coghlan's as being "honestly crap" - not so, and here's my thread to back it up.

Doc
 
I knew this was coming Doc as I have been corrected before on it and should have added a foot note to my post. Bottom line, based on the bars I have from China and experience from others, subpar mag blocks exist, so test yours out before you really need it. Thanks, Chris
 
Using a firesteel is not a gross motor skill, and in the event that matters, producing something from natural materials that you can light with a firesteel isn't either.
 
abo4ster said:
I knew this was coming Doc as I have been corrected before on it and should have added a foot note to my post. Bottom line, based on the bars I have from China and experience from others, subpar mag blocks exist, so test yours out before you really need it. Thanks, Chris
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That is a given.
I take nothing to the woods that is critical that hasn't been tested in the back yard first A sleeping bag,tent,magblock etc that fails in the back yard when it is 5 degrees is no big deal. Failing at 2:00 am in 5 degree temps 5 miles from the truck on the other hand is serious
If you stake you life on an item you have never used before you are a fool , not trying to be hard , just a realist
Roy
 
OwenM said:
Using a firesteel is not a gross motor skill, and in the event that matters, producing something from natural materials that you can light with a firesteel isn't either.
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Exactly correct. I think that using a large-handled firesteel and a knife requires less dexterity than striking a match, but I don't believe that someone who is so cold as to be unable to strike a match is going to succeed with a firesteel.

It's not quite the same, but for giggles I put on my largest pair of mittens (down-filled with a heavy leather palm) and had no trouble removing a match from my matchsafe and lighting it. It's not THAT dexterous a demand.

Frankly, anyone who's gotten to the point that they can't use their hands well enough to strike a match and are reliant on being able to light a fire for warmth has made some pretty bad decisions that no piece of gear is likely to fix.
 
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sutured said:
The reason I say this is because firesteels are dependent on very fine, very dry, very flammable tinder. Without the purest of tinder a firesteel will never get a fire lit, as the spark has no ability to dry out or preheat inferior tinder.
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Not sure I agree with the above statement totally.

1. Firesteel igniting damp yellow birch bark directly on the wet slushy ground. Everything was wet.

[video=youtube;DxH6tCTus1M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxH6tCTus1M[/video]

2. Firesteel igniting GREEN hemlock shavings.

[video=youtube;VNofQEo-4QM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNofQEo-4QM[/video]

Clearly dry tinder is better but my examples show this isn't always 100% needed.
 
Paper
Dry leaves (mostly maple)
White Pine needles
Grape vine inner bark
Dry grass

All last Saturday. Just about anything one would call "tinder."

ED: The steel that one strikes with natural flint to get a low-temp spark is often called a "fire steel." Those sparks do need really good tinder.
 
I doubt my 'well supplied' day pack would be hanging on a tree. Most likely, it would be on my back or belt, depending on which one I had with me.

My little fire kit is packed in a water proof bag. Dryer lint, fat wood sticks, matches, Bic lighter and yes, a firesteel. I have yet to find a time when I could not start a fire at will. That included a two night outing in the Jumper Creek Swamp off the Withlacoochee River this month. Rained and rained. Still got a dandy fire going. Twice. Used a fire steel. Oh my!
 
The thing about fire starting is even on a car camping trip you're never really in ideal circumstances. Whether it rained recently, lots of rotted wood, etc. No matter what you're using starting a fire takes knowledge and preparation. It's never as easy as lighting a leaf on fire and watching it all burn easily. You constantly have to watch it and play with it especially in the early stages.

Anything goes when it comes to starting fire. No matter what you're working with have to figure out a way to get it going. Firesteels are good because unlike matches and lighters you can get them wet. Another great thing to carry however is some type of easily flammable starter. Whether it's Vaseline cotton balls, dryer lint, the sticks you but at sporting stores, etc. another great skill to have is making bird nests, these things are pretty easily made and a lot of people don't really know how to. Tinder is just as important as whatever ignition source you're using.
 
Interesting thread. I suppose the mountain man living in the bush for months at a time learned what he needed to to bring a spark into a flame with flint and steel. Prior preparation is essential. Gather what you will need in any situation and package it like your life depended on it. They also had black powder to add to the mix, but it was the spark from flint and steel or frizzen that made the fire.
 
Loosearrow said:
Interesting thread. I suppose the mountain man living in the bush for months at a time learned what he needed to to bring a spark into a flame with flint and steel. Prior preparation is essential. Gather what you will need in any situation and package it like your life depended on it. They also had black powder to add to the mix, but it was the spark from flint and steel or frizzen that made the fire.
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I have seen "reinactors" start fires with their flintlocks.
 
Odds are the "mountain men" were very good at starting fires with flint and steel. So were the Romans. Betting they didn't use charcloth all that often either. Anyone for a second think back in colonial times people really feared their kitchen/heating fires going out? Probably not all that much. Brimstone matches charred materials and a carbon steel striker plus maybe 10 seconds. Clearly unless working on skills packing 3 ways to start a fire plus some OMG it has gotta light tinder is better.
 
Woods Walker said:
Odds are the "mountain men" were very good at starting fires with flint and steel. So were the Romans. Betting they didn't use charcloth all that often either. Anyone for a second think back in colonial times people really feared their kitchen/heating fires going out? Probably not all that much. Brimstone matches charred materials and a carbon steel striker plus maybe 10 seconds. Clearly unless working on skills packing 3 ways to start a fire plus some OMG it has gotta light tinder is better.
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Historically speaking though many people during those time periods died of starvation and exposure, even large armies which were properly supported had many deaths out of combat that we call attrition, and those deaths were due to starvation, dehydration, exposure, sickness. While many people don't possess the same skills humans had back then, it isn't like everyone back then were masters of these skills and easily started fires with flint and steel or were as to live off the land. Many of these people were supported by civilization, even nomadic tribes such as the mongols who were no doubt very skilled raided cities and villages constantly to support themselves. The thing that makes some of these mountain men so well known and extra ordinary or even steppe tribes for that matter were their unique ability to survive when many people during the same time period would of died. No doubt things like waterproof matches and Firesteels would have saved many lives back then.
 
The skill of starting a fire with natural flint and steel was no doubt more common when used on a daily basis.
 
One of the points that has been lost on starting fires with traditional flint and steel is that back in Europe it was normal to use a chemically treated form of man made tinder to catch the spark. I've never saw a reference to this in the New World but it would seem some of this must have reached the colonies.
 
Sidehill Gouger said:
One of the points that has been lost on starting fires with traditional flint and steel is that back in Europe it was normal to use a chemically treated form of man made tinder to catch the spark. I've never saw a reference to this in the New World but it would seem some of this must have reached the colonies.
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Saltpeter?
 
Thanks for the great post, OP. I agree. I carry a firesteel, but I also carry storm matches and a lighter.
 
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