The Shovel Discussion Thread!

Being an experienced shovel operator, landscaping and goosepits.....
I am amazed at the poor technique and stamina lots of guys show when wielding a spade.

We were digging around the inside of my stepfathers fenceline to put in gravel/drainage pipe and poured concrete plant beds and was teasing the hell out of my younger weightlifter brother. One inch shorter, 45lbs more of ripped muscle and 6 years younger. He works out, likes to fight but has never done any real physical work labour for any amount of time.
I would start at one corner of the fence and had him at the other and I met him 3/4 of the way to his side!!!!And after that he was gassed, whinged about his back and slacked the rest of the other 2 fencelines.

He was going red and getting a little hot under the collar with all my "What good is carrying around all that muscle if you can't use it"......"All for show and none for go"........"What are big pretty biceps good for with no backbone".........."Man up, I have a bad knee, shoulder, and a partial abdominal tear and I am still going"
My stepmom(protecting her baby) started trying to defend him........"Brad, you know he had back surgery......", me "Yeah that was 3 years ago for one bulged disc, I have had 2 on my knee and one on my shoulder, do you think he goes to the gym 4 times a week to whine that the weights are too heavy and someone should lift it for him????!!!!"
Baby brother(emphasis on baby) got a little miffed, some words and he went for a walk, while I finished the job with 58 yr old stepdad and his two friends.
He did not talk to me for about 3months until Easter dinner at moms and it smoothed over.
I beat him in a little bit of a tense no striking full wrestling submission backyard fun over beers about 8 years ago and he has never tested the waters again, nobody likes getting whipped by their smaller older brother.
I used to take him to my boxing club when he was little, taught him most of his street moves as well as he never bothered with martial arts and focused on bodybuilding from age 10.

When I worked in the slaughterhouse 7 out of 10 big muscle men we hired never had the stamina to last very long on the line. Good for a few big lifts or 5 minutes of flat out effort and then a big decline.

Bit of a sidetrack rant on shovels but relative to the overall and underappreciated art of the shovel to the uninitiated
My grandpa always said if you measured all the goosepits he dug in his life he could learn to speak chinese. RIP Sonny.

Regards and file that edge!!!!
 
Great story! Extended digging sure is a good way to separate workers from whiners, that's for sure! :D

I hear ya' on the big muscle vs. endurance thing, too. I'm short and wiry and I can go all day if I stay good and hydrated. I may not be able to bench what a musclehead can but I'll still be happily working away long after they've called it quits. "Looks" muscle is VERY different from athletic muscle.
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
Interesting--I wonder how they construct them then! Are you sure they didn't just cosmetically grind down the welds? :D:D:D
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I don't think so, but could be wrong. The welds on their tools are not works of art and standout, especially contrasted against the overall quality and craftsmanship. The shovel is thin and does not show any signs of grinding. The shovel is smooth and consistent from top to bottom.
 
allout said:
What do you think the maximum grind angle could be and still be considered a sharp shovel? I think I have been sharpening my diggers too much like a big knife. I am sharpening shovels soon and found this thread, I am wanting to put a durable edge. Say a knife is 20, then 30 for a shovel, is 35 too much? I think for me the biggest challenge for a shovel is the prying.

Last week I picked up a Husky Supersocket from the orange box store for about $30. Seems heavy duty, but I have the receipt as I will attempt to break this shovel moving several large bushes. It is a fine looking shovel in person. I have a couple of well oiled old wood handle shovels I use for less taxing work. The most used of my shovels has been one of those $20 yellow fiberglass handle things. I am amazed it is still in one piece. I have used it as a pry-bar as much as a shovel.

I have been looking for a company to make a better version of that China shovel. A larger SS or aluminum blade that is not coated would be good for cooking. More thought on use as a seat. For example strap handle to a small tree with the handle up or down if there is a nice sheath in place this may make for a neat camp/hunting chair. More curve in the blade which would allow the shield to work with larger hands. For some reason I like this feature. Maybe to forestall an animal attack so the other hand can deploy whatever is needed. And something in place of that saw. If something is sharp and can kill a zombie how important is a (nice) sheath for that item?

I am stumped on a backpack shovel system. I have for years used the US e-tool. It is too heavy for what it does. The Glock has no hammer and is too small. CS SF does not have the 90 degree option which is wanted/needed. The Hercules model 88 looks good, I wonder how strong it is when prying stuff, enough stuff that a person's body weight gets involved. If the 88 is a good pry-bar that would make up for the lack of 90 degree setting.


Thanks! for the tip on the Leonard Soil Knife, picked one of those up tonight.
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For a sharpening angle that'll depend on the design of the shovel and the nature of your soil. The softer and more root-filled the soil is the sharper and more acute you can make the shovel, but in very rocky soil you'll need to make the edge more obtuse. For a shovel that will be only digging or chopping roots (i.e. normal shovel tasks--not used as a machete like the Cold Steel) I suggest sharpening the interior only as it will aid in making a nice clean cut. I have extremely rocky soil so I keep my rice shovel at about a 35 degree chisel edge with the edge itself left at about 1/4 mm thick (i.e. not knife sharp, but deliberately a little "dull") to keep the edge from turning when encountering stones while doing hard digging.

For use as a pry bar you'll want wither a fiberglass or all-steel handle. If using a fiberglass handle you'll also want an extended neck/socket for further reinforcement. That Husky ought to do a fine job in that aspect. If doing very heavy prying you'll want either a full blown pinch-nosed crowbar or a landscaping/digging bar. Not all that expensive and the right tool for the job.

As entertaining as that Chinese shovel is I see it as impractical for hard use. Hinged neck shovels eventually break no matter how tough they're built. The military uses them because if a soldier breaks one they can just go grab another--it's on the government's dime and used as a just-in-case field tool rather than a "I PLAN on doing a lot of digging" tool.

The Predator Tools Hercules will hold up well to prying--it's an all steel design after all. Just use it within its bound and it'll do fine. Remember that prying in dirt is different from prying open a window, for instance. For that kind of work get an Estwing I-beam pry bar or a Stanley "Wonder Bar"

Hope that helps. :)
 
Ewwwwwwwwwwwwww....I'd send it back. Get a Bully Tools shovel instead. Closed socket and back, a stiffening rib on the bend in the neck, forward steps, and excellent lift. I LOVE my rice shovel from them. And it's USA-made!
 
Posting the video shouldn't be an issue as it's a manufacturer site. I think you'll like the Bully Tools piece MUCH better. Note that if the Husky says it's "assembled in the USA" that means that some or all of the parts didn't come from here!
 
Up to the same level as the tops of the holes. About where the top of the sticker is on the shovel in that vid. I sharpened it only on the inside of the shovel at about 35 degrees and left the edge partially blunt at about 1/4 to 1/2 mm thick since my soil is chock full of rocks and that's still thin enough to chop green roots if need be without having the edge roll when hitting stones hard.
 
I have played with a SF shovel from CS for quite a few years. FUN!

And you don't often say that about a shovel!
 
Bigfattyt said:
I have played with a SF shovel from CS for quite a few years. FUN!

And you don't often say that about a shovel!
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Mostly because the overwhelming majority of shovels on the market SUCK! :p

A well made shovel in the hands of someone who enjoys physical activity and knows good technique will bring a smile to their face. Few things as satisfying as a good and proper shovel, in my opinion.

One of the horses stepped on the aluminum transfer shovel I use for mucking the barn and they flattened one whole side of it. Thank goodness I've got an anvil and cross pein hammer. I was able to smack it back into shape with a bit of work, though the cross pein scarred the crease a bit. :p
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
A well made shovel in the hands of someone who enjoys physical activity and knows good technique will bring a smile to their face. Few things as satisfying as a good and proper shovel, in my opinion.
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We could have used you yesterday! :D

New_trail.JPG
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
Anyone ever see one of the Council folding jobbies in person? They make it for the Forestry Service so I imagine it must be more robust than most other available tools of similar build. Interesting in that it comes with a full-length handle!

Council-Combi-Tool-BEN-_i_bmn133451z.jpg
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I used one on fires for a season. Didn't use it very hard...I was working as a photographer but everyone on the fire line had to cary a tool in case they had to deploy their fire shelter, so I took the Councile folding tool and cut the handle down so I could cary it on my pack. I still have it. Very robust construction.
 
First, I'd just like to say how happy I am to find a place where there is a "Shovel discussion Thread".
Second, Last winter we had a lot of snow, ice, melt/freeze, and basically a shit-ton of driveway chopping to be done.
I have an old flat shovel with a nice, slim wooden handle that I chopped and scraped with almost daily for a couple months.
All it did was make the shovel sharper. Steel is amazing stuff. :)
 
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