Theoretical evidence that the strider PT is better than the small sebenza

well everyone knows a mopar will kick a fords ass all day long-

strider sebenza at least is a legit thought-but to compare a mopar and a ferd is just plain rediculous
 
I own a Pt and a couple of small sebenzas, if I had to choose only one it would probably be the sebenza but only because I like the fact that it sits lower and feels more secure in my pocket.

That being said the Hinderer 3" XM-18 may be the best in the 3" class for an extra 50-85 bucks (this is based on all the positive reviews I've read)
 
STR said:
Yep sure did. Well, had a little help with the blade on that one but it was something I wanted to do after doing something a while back for a customer so I repeated it for myself with a twist.

You can read about both in detail and my other recent lockback model I did here at these links below.

Thanks for asking.

STR

Here is the first one I did after being asked if I'd consider tackling it for my very good friend Dirk.
http://knifeforums.com/forums/showtopic.php?tid/776102/


And here are mine.

http://knifeforums.com/forums/showtopic.php?tid/784985/

http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/showtopic.php?tid/784694/
Click to expand...
Fantastic work STR! I really like the first one of your "personals". Looks somewhat inspired by the Spyderco Wegner, yet stands completely on its own designwise :thumbup: .
 
If most people would get past the Finish of the Sebby they may be more comfortable testing the fit.I don't go for this gents knife title the Sebby has taken on because,it wasn't designed for that.Only until the graphics and such were made have some become display pcs.Even those sometimes get used.I use my Regular and Bocote inlay quite a bit.I used my regular to cut 13 heavy duty twisties off of a couple of my sons Christmas gifts,dropped it several times on a concrete floor,cut top grain leather hide,jammed into a 2x4 pretty damn hard,cut a very large sliver about 1in.x6 in. out of a pc. of oak,cut cardboard and opened boxes.This was all within a 7-10 day period.I took it apart,cleaned it,lubed and put it back together.No scratches from the drops,still cuts like a champ.I'm sure if you look under a scope you will find something. But,hey,we are not looking at rare coins,stamps,gems etc.Get over dissecting and start using the knife "hard".I would say alot of people use them hard but some lightly use them and classify them as a Gents Knife.This is a disservice to the knife it was disigned to be!

MPE
 
Rhesus , Here's why basically .

The G10 ,Ti envelope is stronger in total than Ti/Ti .

The pivot on the PT is beefier

The stop pin arrangement is stronger

The clip helps prevent overspringing of the lockbar

Bonus feature: the choil makes it safer in the event of a lockbar shift .The combination of the handle design , the choil . and the grippiness of the G10make it safer in the hand in adverse ( cold /wet ) conditions .

The lock area in the Strider is much more self cleaning .

While i very much doubt you would break either with just hand force , the sebbie becomes insecure it the grip under moderate force , and the lack of a choil makes it harder to control for some cuts .

In cold , wet hands the all Ti ( most common ) version is very slick and slippery . The versions with Micarta inserts may be better , but I doubt they are as good as G10 .

One feature I dont like with the PT is the way it rides in the pocket . The Sebbie has a nicer clip and rides lower . In this regard the Sebbie is inferior to the Mnandi.

As always YMMV

Chris
 
cdf said:
Rhesus , Here's why basically .

The G10 ,Ti envelope is stronger in total than Ti/Ti .
How so? Titanium is a stronger material than G10, please elaborate.
The pivot on the PT is beefier
The pivot is larger, I'll give you that. Does the PT utilize a pivot bushing like the Sebenza? Are the shoulders of the pivot on the PT countersunk, or is the pivot the same diameter all the way through?
(I've never disassembled a PT)
The stop pin arrangement is stronger
How is the stop pin arrangement of the PT stronger? If I understand correctly, the stop pin of the PT is the pin through the blade which contacts the shoulders of the frame. Is there and additional pin sandwiched between the handle slabs?
(Again, I've never disassembled a PT)
The clip helps prevent overspringing of the lockbar
The same can be said for the Sebenza.
Bonus feature: the choil makes it safer in the event of a lockbar shift .The combination of the handle design , the choil . and the grippiness of the G10make it safer in the hand in adverse ( cold /wet ) conditions .
I will agree that the choil and texture of the G10 would make for a more secure grip in cold/wet conditions, however, I've personally used both small and large Sebenza while fishing/hiking/backpacking in all types of weather and I've never had a problem with grip or lock security.
The lock area in the Strider is much more self cleaning .
I don't see how the lock area of the PT is "much more self cleaning", please elaborate.
While i very much doubt you would break either with just hand force , the sebbie becomes insecure it the grip under moderate force , and the lack of a choil makes it harder to control for some cuts .
How does the Sebenza become insecure in the grip under "moderate" force? I've never had this happen in the 5 years since obtaining my first small Sebenza.
In cold , wet hands the all Ti ( most common ) version is very slick and slippery . The versions with Micarta inserts may be better , but I doubt they are as good as G10 .
I regularly use an all Ti Sebenza while fly fishing year round, never once has it been "too cold" or "too wet" to hold onto.
One feature I dont like with the PT is the way it rides in the pocket . The Sebbie has a nicer clip and rides lower . In this regard the Sebbie is inferior to the Mnandi.

As always YMMV

Chris
Click to expand...

I think you make very valid points, but, some seem to be more opinion than fact without clarification.

In regards to some of the comments made by others:
I'm not trying to turn this into a Strider/Sebenza pissing contest.
This topic comes up pretty frequently and cdf seems like an intelligent guy who was making some pretty wild claims as to the superiority of the PT.
Since he owns both knives in question, I was curious to hear his reasoning.
Believe it or not, two reasonably intelligent human beings CAN discuss Ford VS Chevy or in this case Strider VS Sebenza without all the drama.
At the end of the day he won't change my opinion, nor I his, but there will be some rational, civil discussion on the topic to be archived for future reference, dig it?

Nobody should have to rely on theoretical evidence, lol.

Josh
 
A G10 /Ti Laminate is stronger than Ti /Ti . Ti has greater hardness and better tensile strength , while the G10 is resilient and tends to spring back into shape . See Strider FAQ on Badlands Forums .

Re the stop pin bussiness - on impact or stress the 3/16 pin contacts the g10 /and ti scales - load is spread thru the whole assembly , not just to a pin that can be peened , or otherwise distorted .

re; the crud resistance - there is a crud hole in the lockbar arm to prevent fouling of the ball detent . there is also a fairly large gap between the lockbar and the bolster section of the ti scale , again allowing crud to disperse . It's hard to explain clearly without pictures .

I have never dissasembled my Pt , I can see phosphor bronze washers , there may be a bushing , i cant state with certainty .

I'm a fly fisherman , I kayak , and dive a bit , under cold conditions I dont think I'd care to use a Sebbie in any of the above pastimes .

For a more detailed , and more cogent explanation of the overall design , and to get a better overview of the overall design philosophy - check out the Strider FAQ over on Badlands Forums or the USN . Despite his tendency to use colorfull volgarisms , Mick expresses is design related thoughts very clearly - more so than I could ever do .


I have a soft spot for Sebbies , they were the first really nice folders I ever owned . On a jobsite , on the beat , or on active service , give me a Strider anyday .

I apologise for a somewhat disjointed response , I had a long day , and a rather intense scession at the range after work .

I'm delighted to have a rational and civil exchange about the relative merits of fine tools . Mick Strider has come up with a canny design , for hard use applications . Chris Reeves has a brilliant , and elegant design for general outdoor / utility/EDC uses . We are fortunate to be this spoiled for choice . I guess it mostly comes down to personal preference / choice .

Chris
 
Josh , It comes down to something like arguing the merits of Sage Vs. Winston Vs. G.Loomis ( which I dont care for ) . I enjoy civil exchanges on such topics . I agree 100 % - pissing matches have no place in these discussions .

My fave. work / outdoor EDC's are my Striders , my fave. in town / around home carry is a Mnandi . My fave fixed blade is a CRK Aviator . I own a few of each Dog in the fight , and cherish them all .

Chris
 
Each has it's merits. They are the product of a long series of adaptations by knifemakers in general who share their discoveries. We've come a long way from the Buck 110, and it still has a place in the market.

As for Ford, Chevy, and Chrysler, I find it amusing that Smokey Yunick, the early originator of Chevy power innovations, thought the small block was seriously weak in the chain drive - camshaft - distributor arrangement. It allows too much timing variation.

Ingenuity overcame, and Chevy has it's trophies. Ford came back and got theirs, Chrysler came out with the hemi and trumped for a while, but I'd feel hard pressed to choose between a Chevy Nascar stocker from the '60's, a Ford GT40, or a rail dragster with a blown hemi.

The SnG and Sebenza are two different knives. Really hard to compare except they are both heavy duty framelocks.

No substitute for cubic inches.
 
I am currently carring a PT and love it, great control and very strong. I have a couple of Sebs on order, and if Rick sees fit, I will have have a 3 inch XM-18. Look forward to playing with all three. Steven
 
I own a small micarta Sebbie and a PT. I like both, but prefer the Sebbie to dress carry, use the PT for hard use, although how hard can you treat a small carry knife? I think that the Sebbie is up to the task of the PT. To each their own. I have no problem with people voicing their opinions, but please bring more to the table than the blade is differently shaped.
 
carry a pt everyday had a small sebenza(sold it) have a 3'' xm-18 and have a 3'' prototype of yunakives "hard" that should be done in a month or so-

-
 
Have a small classic Seb and a SMF which is not as small as a PT, but I can make one valid observation from the SMF that also applies to the PT. Blade cutting edge length. While the SMF has a roughly 4" blade, a surprising amount of the length is lost with the 2 choils. There is only one sharpening choil on the Seb. The PT looks to have the same 2 choil design which is the only design aspect I would change on the Strider. I would be curious to see the variety in cutting edge length in both similar sized offerings from Strider and CRK.

The fit and finish of the Seb is well known. The fit and finish of my Strider, overlooking the light stamping of "Strider" and reprofiling to 30 degrees, is very high and was pleasantly surprising. Very nice machine work. The guy that made mine sure as hell wasn't blind.:)
 
Not really a fair comparison , one is a Gents knife , one is more to the Tactical side of the house .

Chris
 
cdf said:
Not really a fair comparison , one is a Gents knife , one is more to the Tactical side of the house .

Chris
Click to expand...

I agree.:thumbup:

Both can be considered gents knives, and both can be considered tactical knives, but to the first time observer, the Seb is a gents knife, and the PT is a tactical.
 
I agree that both can be tact or gents.To classify the Seb. as a gents only is a diservice to the knife as I posted earlier.Watch the CRK DVD and see what the line of CRKs are disigned for.

MPE
 
In all seriousness, can someone please tell me what actual "hard use" they've done with the Pt that couldn't have been done with the Sebbie.

I own both knives and am genuinely curious as to how much "hard use" can be done with the Pt's 2 1/4" cutting edge. Maybe my definition of hard use is different?:confused:
 
cdf said:
Not really a fair comparison , one is a Gents knife , one is more to the Tactical side of the house .

Chris
Click to expand...

Ditto. I Agree fully.

Edit: as for the 2 choils, i think this is a wonderful thing on any of the strider folders, to me it is a bonus i think every strider user should be able to appreciate.
 
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