Thinking about open-carrying a dagger

Northwest Knives said:
Ok. Here is my take. I am former Law Enforcement and carried a SOCP dagger on my Tac Vest. You want something easy to deploy under duress. The Benchmade SOCP is not it. When you have elevated stress and adrenaline you will lose all of your fine motor skills and you will revert to Gross motor skills. Manipulating small objects and finger manipulation is near impossible. That is why most firearms training involves big movements and whole hand manipulation of the firearm.

With that being said.....you would be better off getting a knife with an Emerson wave and train with it for quick deployment. Everyday carry, you are used to where the knife is, gross motor skills under stress and a better weapon without the hassle by the police.

Just my 2 cents
Click to expand...

I agree. I was carjacked with my Buck Mayo in my pocket...I didn't even remember I had it until they drove off...but then I'm trained in the liberal not martial arts :)

I have an auto Stryker, Matriarch and the waved Spyderco Pikal, but more for moral support than planning to actually use em. The waved Pikal opens the fastest. I practice in the alleys while walking the pit. You can wave that sucker open in a variety of ways and all pockets.
 
jackknife said:
Fact, the knife makes a p--s poor self defense tool. When Sam Colt invented the first reliable repeating handgun, and John Moses Browning perfected the small self loading pistol, the knife took an instant backseat. The Bowie knife faded in both popularity and size. Now we're in the 21st century, a knife is still a handy thing to have in a pocket. But...that word again, if you plan on using a knife for self defense, go get a gun.
Click to expand...

Vague generalities that assumes everywhere is the US, or that carrying a 40 ounce 1911 for thirty years is better than getting shot, or, even better, will prevent you from getting shot...

jackknife said:
If you are really serious about self defense, go down and get the paper work, take whatever course you have to get certified, pay for the finger printing and mug shot, and carry a gun. And then practice. Practice a lot. Or just carry some pepper spray. Leave the medieval weapons to history.
Click to expand...

More US centric advice. If you are that serious about self defense, wear a bulletproof vest and carry nylon bands that can be used for tourniquets. If wearing a bulletproof vest is too inconvenient, then carrying a gun outside the car can't be that far behind... I would say that, outside the home, the bulletproof vest should certainly come first.

jackknife said:
At the battle of Agincourt the French army outnumbered the rag tag English by at least two to one, and heavily armored knights at that. But the English were archers. The French brought swords to a projectile fight and got slaughtered in spite of outnumbering the English and being more heavily armed. There's a lesson there..
Click to expand...

Rag tag? They were a professional and regulated army with their King present... It was the French who were a collection of disparate hot headed nobles, with no King to keep them in line, and who could not obey the simplest order, like staying put for instance...

Yes there's a lesson, as duly noted by the real historians of Agincourt...: Send a few hundred knights to clear the nearby woods, and hack the archers hiding there to pieces... Lol.

This would have kept a small minority of knights occupied, while the rest did what they should have done (instead of sinking to their knees in the charge), which is wait half a day or more for the mud to dry, instead of actually physically drowning in it, without a scratch on their bodies...

Gaston
 
ZTFan said:
Also, thank you to everyone who has commented. It’s been really great to read your responses and most of you will be happy to hear I will not be purchasing the SOCP or carrying a dagger.

Instead, I will keep my Griptilian and I just finalized the price for someone’s used handgun. I’ll be purchasing an HK USP 45 Compact SS for $725, and once the FFL transfer is complete I’ll be applying for my CCW permit. Thanks again for all the great responses!
Click to expand...

Has California changed since I left 3-4 years ago? I lived there for many many years and from what I know is that is is damn near impossible to get a CCW unless you are LE or have a “need”, like transporting large amounts of cash. And in that case you are only allowed to carry when actively engaged in transporting the cash etc.

I hope it has changed but the only change I have seen from that state regarding gun laws is in the opposite direction. All out ban on any mag with 10+ rounds and such.
 
ZTFan said:
Also, thank you to everyone who has commented. It’s been really great to read your responses and most of you will be happy to hear I will not be purchasing the SOCP or carrying a dagger.

Instead, I will keep my Griptilian and I just finalized the price for someone’s used handgun. I’ll be purchasing an HK USP 45 Compact SS for $725, and once the FFL transfer is complete I’ll be applying for my CCW permit. Thanks again for all the great responses!
Click to expand...
Please don't be mislead that a gun requirers any less training and practice to master for SD than a knife . Learn how to avoid trouble , situational awareness , etc . A gun is just a tool , not a magical solution to every security need .
 
chopsaki said:
Has California changed since I left 3-4 years ago? I lived there for many many years and from what I know is that is is damn near impossible to get a CCW unless you are LE or have a “need”, like transporting large amounts of cash. And in that case you are only allowed to carry when actively engaged in transporting the cash etc.

I hope it has changed but the only change I have seen from that state regarding gun laws is in the opposite direction. All out ban on any mag with 10+ rounds and such.
Click to expand...

My county allows them occasionally, and since a lot of my work puts me in bad parts of town late at night, I thought I might as well give it a shot.
 
DocJD said:
Please don't be mislead that a gun requirers any less training and practice to master for SD than a knife . Learn how to avoid trouble , situational awareness , etc . A gun is just a tool , not a magical solution to every security need .
Click to expand...

I have every intention to train with it as much as time and money allow!
 
A knife to consider while your waiting on the CCW Application process. Cold Steel XL Counter Point. Six inch blade, false edge, dagger shaped blade, comfortable handle, and the mighty Tri-Ad Lock. Being a folder you can carry it concealed. Has a bias towards closure so it's not a switchblade under California law.


PENAL CODE - PEN
PART 6. CONTROL OF DEADLY WEAPONS [16000 - 34370]
( Part 6 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
TITLE 1. PRELIMINARY PROVISIONS [16000 - 17360]
( Title 1 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
DIVISION 2. DEFINITIONS [16100 - 17360]
( Division 2 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
17235.
As used in this part, “switchblade knife” means a knife having the appearance of a pocketknife and includes a spring-blade knife, snap-blade knife, gravity knife, or any other similar type knife, the blade or blades of which are two or more inches in length and which can be released automatically by a flick of a button, pressure on the handle, flip of the wrist or other mechanical device, or is released by the weight of the blade or by any type of mechanism whatsoever. “Switchblade knife” does not include a knife that opens with one hand utilizing thumb pressure applied solely to the blade of the knife or a thumb stud attached to the blade, provided that the knife has a detent or other mechanism that provides resistance that must be overcome in opening the blade, or that biases the blade back toward its closed position.

(Added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. Effective January 1, 2011. Operative January 1, 2012, by Sec. 10 of Ch. 711.
 
Man with no name said:
Sheath knives must be open carried, including dirk knives and daggers.

CHAPTER 4. Dirk or Dagger [21310 - 21390]
( Chapter 4 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )

21310.
Except as provided in Chapter 1 (commencing with Section 17700) of Division 2 of Title 2, any person in this state who carries concealed upon the person any dirk or dagger is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or imprisonment pursuant to subdivision (h) of Section 1170.

(Amended by Stats. 2012, Ch. 43, Sec. 94. Effective June 27, 2012.)
Click to expand...

SOO glad I don't live in Commiefornia. Sorry, just being honest. ;)
 
I live in Fresno. We have no laws that supersede state law. I've been carrying a large fixed for almost 3 years with no issues.



I was an infantryman in the invasion of Mosul. Even then, a dagger was something I wouldn't want to carry. I carried a Camillus Dominator or a Spyderco Native on my vest and a Microtech D/A Socom in my pants pocket.

 
Nothing wrong with carrying a knife. Realistically using your knife for self defense is a statistical anomaly for most people and if it isn't you should probably consider body armor in addition to a gun.

Getting back to knives, I honestly have found looking at knives from a tactical or fighting perspective to be a waste of time. Being all decked out and having nobody to stab is pretty much all that ends up happening. In more practical terms it has been more useful to carry something that has a function I can utilize.
 
22-rimfire said:
Guess I'm a bit confused as to CA legalities in terms of knives. Charlie Mike openly carries a fairly large fixed blade in CA. Are there a lot of variences between municipalities?
Click to expand...

Charlie Mike WAS that one freaky lookin' dude with a fixed blade Legendary Jarl saw.
 
Last edited:
Gaston444 said:
Vague generalities that assumes everywhere is the US, or that carrying a 40 ounce 1911 for thirty years is better than getting shot, or, even better, will prevent you from getting shot...



More US centric advice. If you are that serious about self defense, wear a bulletproof vest and carry nylon bands that can be used for tourniquets. If wearing a bulletproof vest is too inconvenient, then carrying a gun outside the car can't be that far behind... I would say that, outside the home, the bulletproof vest should certainly come first.



Rag tag? They were a professional and regulated army with their King present... It was the French who were a collection of disparate hot headed nobles, with no King to keep them in line, and who could not obey the simplest order, like staying put for instance...

Yes there's a lesson, as duly noted by the real historians of Agincourt...: Send a few hundred knights to clear the nearby woods, and hack the archers hiding there to pieces... Lol.

This would have kept a small minority of knights occupied, while the rest did what they should have done (instead of sinking to their knees in the charge), which is wait half a day or more for the mud to dry, instead of actually physically drowning in it, without a scratch on their bodies...

Gaston
Click to expand...

I agree with you that living in a country where it is illegal for us to carry guns a knife becomes a much more viable self defense option. (Still usually illegal to defend yourself with but atleast you won't get 5 years automatic jail time carrying) Yeah many countries do not want their citizens defending themselves.

But later you wrote: "-or assume that carrying a 40oz 1911 around for thirty years is better than being shot,....". Maybe this is an assumption of my own but I think most people would prefer to carry the weight rather than being shot.

I am not saying carrying the 1911 will prevent you from being shot necessarily, that is not my point.
 
Lap, self defense is not illegal in Canada either. You have to prove equivalent force, minimum intent to harm, and no other option. Going to trial to justify ones actions is not the same as something being illegal. Carry of a knife for self defense is premeditation to commit harm. Yes it's weird, but it's two different laws, or at least sections.
 
Gaston444 said:
Vague generalities that assumes everywhere is the US, or that carrying a 40 ounce 1911 for thirty years is better than getting shot, or, even better, will prevent you from getting shot...

More US centric advice.
Click to expand...

The OP lives in California. He says that in his OP. Last time I checked California is in the US. Why the flying fornication shouldn't anyone give him "US centric" advice?

Besides, a 40 oz Colt 45 works every time.

If you are that serious about self defense, wear a bulletproof vest and carry nylon bands that can be used for tourniquets. If wearing a bulletproof vest is too inconvenient, then carrying a gun outside the car can't be that far behind... I would say that, outside the home, the bulletproof vest should certainly come first.
Click to expand...

First of all, WHAT?!?!
Secondly, body armor isn't legal everywhere (it is in CA though, I'll give you that).
Third, WHAT?!?!?
 
Last edited:
Planterz said:
The OP lives in California. He says that in his OP. Last time I checked California is in the US. Why the flying fornication shouldn't anyone give him "US centric" advice?

Besides, a 40 oz Colt 45 works every time.



First of all, WHAT?!?!
Secondly, body armor isn't legal everywhere (it is in CA though, I'll give you that).
Third, WHAT?!?!?
Click to expand...

It's okay Planterz, Gaston is just being Gaston. It's a full time job that requires little thought but lots of time to be that irritating. Facts don't matter as they just get in the way of things.

As for a 40 ounce Colt,, a 26 ounce Glock, 14 ounce S&M airlight, a 6 ounce Ruger LCP, or a host of other very concealable guns will do a far better job of protection than some medieval era tool hanging on your belt. Or shoved down the front of your pants. We're living in an age of plenty for firearms, to stick ones head in the sand like an ostrich is not only self defeating, but fatal.

And Gaston, your knowledge of history is as flawed as all your other spouting. Henry's army was rag tag, and starving short of rations, and ill equipped. They were saved only by the over confidence of the French and the ineptitude of the French bringing a knife to a bow fight. By the way, when are you going to take me up on my offer to fly you down here for our personal "training session?" The offer still stands and the gold eagles are still waiting for you to prove how a little non metallic stick is not effective.
 
Last edited:
I continue to believe that, on balance, the entire notion of a "knife as defensive weapon" is foolish and dangerous. The number of circumstances in which it makes more sense to try to use a knife in self-defense than it does to walk/run away approaches zero. Add to that the probability that carrying a knife for self-defense will engender a false sense of security and it's just not a good mindset.
 
PS, I took the advice of people on this board... A year ago, I started training in Pekiti Tirsia Kali. A knife can be an extremely effective weapon if you know when and how to employ it.

And yes, I keep body armor in my car.

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top