This is a Scotch Thread

[shaldag]

I am sorry to hear that.

 

[RNST]

Sad news, well known beer and whiskey critic and author Michael Jackson passed away last night in his London home. Here is a link to the news article:

http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/whatsontap/archives/120913.asp?from=blog_last3

I was considering picking up his guide to single malt scotch, so when I heard the news I pulled the trigger. Should be here next week.

Be sure to raise your glass to him tonight.

Cheers Michael, I always respected your opinions on beer and whiskey!

 

[Nimick]

This just in:

Bruichladdich has just put out a new release:

The Port Charlotte 5 Y.O.
First Release from Bruichladdich
HEAVY PEATED Whisky


I have already reserved a bottle.

$130.00 wholesale

At least that's how much it costs on this side of the pond.

 

[Steven Roos]

Well, got my copy of the Jackson book today. Haven't had much time to look at it, but looks like a nice guide!

Also tried the Macallan 12 at the Hearthstone Lounge inside the Grand Californian Hotel at Disneyland. Nice atmosphere to enjoy a nice drink. Aside from the fact that it was $12 for barely over one fingers worth, it was a very nice drink! I'm going to have to pick some up for myself at home so I don't have to pay highway robbery prices!

 

[UnknownVT]

got my copy of the Jackson book today. Haven't had much time to look at it, but looks like a nice guide!

It is really the Single Malt Scotch guide.

I assume you got the latest (5th/2004) edition?

Would you mind please looking up the ratings/scores for these Scotches?

Lagavulin 16 years (95, 95)
Highland Park 12 years (90, 90)
The Macallan 12 years (91, 91)

and if he made any comments if they have changed over the years, please?

Thanks.

The scores in parenthesis are from the 3rd/1994 and 4th/1999 editions respectively.

Also tried the Macallan 12 at the Hearthstone Lounge inside the Grand Californian Hotel at Disneyland.

For now I think the Macallan 12 and Highland Park 12 are relative "bargains" -
alas Lagavulin 16 is no longer the bargain it used to be -
although for my personal taste it probably should be regarded as good value at any price

--
Vincent
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[DEA]

i just got my hands on a bottle of macallan 18
it's quite a bit smoother than the 12
the next time i go on a trip i'll probably get the 25 from the dfs
those suckers are expensive =.=

 

[Steven Roos]

Would you mind please looking up the ratings/scores for these Scotches?

Lagavulin 16 years (95, 95)
Highland Park 12 years (90, 90)
The Macallan 12 years (91, 91)

From the 5th Edition:
Lagavulin 16 Y/O (95)
Highland Park 12 Y/O (90)
The Macallan 12 Y/O (91)

No mention of changes over the years. I'd imagine these are signature bottlings from their respective companies, and they take a lot of care to make sure they make a consistent product.

The Macallan 12 is pretty reasonable at $40.99 for 750mL. The Lagavulin 16 is $69.99 for 750mL, still not crazy expensive, but just pricey enough that I haven't yet picked up a bottle. Went by Trader Joe's last night and found a nice looking Macallan 10 Y/O. It looks heavily sherried; it is as dark or darker than the Macallan 12 I tried. A bargain at $25.99 for 750mL.

 

[Steven Roos]

i just got my hands on a bottle of macallan 18
it's quite a bit smoother than the 12
the next time i go on a trip i'll probably get the 25 from the dfs
those suckers are expensive =.=

The Macallan 18 is $150 here in SoCal. I was too afraid to try the 18 Y/O at the bar because if it had the same markup as the 12 Y/O, it would have been $49 for one drink!

I'm trying to decide what I'm going to try at Ruth's Chris for my birthday. Had the Lagavulin 16 last year...

 

[UnknownVT]

From the 5th Edition:
Lagavulin 16 Y/O (95)
Highland Park 12 Y/O (90)
The Macallan 12 Y/O (91)
No mention of changes over the years. I'd imagine these are signature bottlings from their respective companies, and they take a lot of care to make sure they make a consistent product. .

Many thanks for that -
so there has not been a change in ratings over at least 3 editions and 10 years - 3rd/1994 through 5th/2004.

Although I'd agree about care on consistency - since the "skill" for many, many years - before single malts became popular - was the blending of Scotch whisky.

Remember single malts are not necessarily from a single cask (those are normally sold at a much higher premium) - but mixed/"blended" from multiple casks of the same "single malt" - with the youngest determining the bottle's labeled age. So the youngest malt in the Lagavulin 16 "blend" would be 16 years old

However, I have read somewhere some think that Lagavulin 16 year had changed since about year 2000 -
I didn't think I had thought that - although on just one occassion, tasting a friend's fresh/recent sample, I thought it was more medicinal/iodine tasting.

The label on the bottles have however changed -
on the smaller upper oval label - pre-2000 had "By Appointment to Her Majesty" -

whereas the newer post-2000 label just has a sailship

see -
http://www.whiskyfun.com/ArchiveApril04.html

about 2/3 down the page dated April 15, 2004.

The Macallan 12 is pretty reasonable at $40.99 for 750mL. The Lagavulin 16 is $69.99 for 750mL, still not crazy expensive, but just pricey enough that I haven't yet picked up a bottle. Went by Trader Joe's last night and found a nice looking Macallan 10 Y/O. It looks heavily sherried; it is as dark or darker than the Macallan 12 I tried. A bargain at $25.99 for 750mL.

The Trader Joe Macallan 10 does sound like a real bargain -
in my 4th/1994 edition the Macallan 10 40% vol was rated by M. Jackson as 87 - I just pulled this from -

WhiskyWeb - Michael Jackson on the Macallan 10 40% (this is from the 3rd/1994 edition) -
"10-year-old, 40 vol
Amber.
Sherry and buttery, honeyish, malt character. Lots of roundness and depth, even at this young age.
Full, without being syrupy.
Lots of sherry, without being rich. Plenty of malt. Sweetish.
Satisfying, malty, gingery, becoming dry, with a hint of smoke.
87"

this 87 rating is pretty high -
but not quite as extraordinary as the 91 for the 12.
or obviously the 95 of Lagavulin 16!

--
Vincent
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http://clik.to/UnknownVT2004
http://clik.to/UnknownVincent

 

[Steven Roos]

this 87 rating is pretty high -
but not quite as extraordinary as the 91 for the 12.
or obviously the 95 of Lagavulin 16!

Yea, I know the Lagavulin rates way up there, along the same lines as the Macallan 25 YO. I really want to pick up a bottle, but something about the $50 and above price point always makes me hesitate. I just need to stop myself from buying so many other cheaper things and just saving so I can buy an expensive bottle!

My beer habit is getting in the way! Right now, I'm trying to find some friends nearby to split the cost of a bottle of Sam Adams Utopias, the worlds strongest "beer" at 25% ABV. I use the term beer loosely given that is doesn't have any carbonation to speak of and it drinks more like a cognac.

 

[kinzli]

Yea, I know the Lagavulin rates way up there, along the same lines as the Macallan 25 YO. I really want to pick up a bottle, but something about the $50 and above price point always makes me hesitate. I just need to stop myself from buying so many other cheaper things and just saving so I can buy an expensive bottle!

Lagavulin 16 is one of those whiskies that will either repel you, or cause you to go head over heels in love.

IMHO, it's one of the finest examples, at any price, of a very nice Islay. If you *really* like the Islay style, then there are others that are very good in their own right, different, but I still come back to Lagavulin 16 as one of the most enjoyable Scotch whiskies around.

If you do enjoy the Laga, then you are destined to find Ardbeg, which, IMHO, is the quintessential Islay. If you enjoy Islays, then you will no doubt love Ardbeg 10, it's like candy for an Islay lover (in more ways than just taste!).

Obviously I cannot say enough about my love for the Islays. I do fully recognize that many cannot stand the "typical" Islay style, yet for me it's definately a love.

 

[DEA]

i got mine from the duty free shop for like 100 usd ^ ^
the 25 y/o is more than double that

i can't find ginger ale anywhere near my place, so im now bastardising my 18 y/o with crap like sprite and mango juice (please don't crucify me)
but i find i like it best just with plain water
having it neat makes me cough for minutes

 

[Steven Roos]

If you do enjoy the Laga, then you are destined to find Ardbeg, which, IMHO, is the quintessential Islay. If you enjoy Islays, then you will no doubt love Ardbeg 10, it's like candy for an Islay lover (in more ways than just taste!).

Sounds like it would be worth a try. Is that pronounced like it looks? ("aard-beg") Might have to try that this weekend.

 

[Steven Roos]

i got mine from the duty free shop for like 100 usd ^ ^
the 25 y/o is more than double that

i can't find ginger ale anywhere near my place, so im now bastardising my 18 y/o with crap like sprite and mango juice (please don't crucify me)
but i find i like it best just with plain water
having it neat makes me cough for minutes

Say it ain't so!

Stick with the water, for the malt's sake!

 

[UnknownVT]

i can't find ginger ale anywhere near my place, so im now bastardising my 18 y/o with crap like sprite and mango juice (please don't crucify me)
but i find i like it best just with plain water
having it neat makes me cough for minutes

Dilution with plain water is not a crime -
in fact years ago, many books on Single Malt Scotch said to best taste was to dilute as much as 2 waters to 1 scotch.... apparently professional tasters used to do this - I won bets showing people the sections in the book (c/o book store). When I went to Scotland for tasting - single malt was served either with a small pitcher of local water - or bottled "Malvern Water".

Since then fashion has changed, and this is what Mr. M. Jackson said in his 3rd/1994 edition on-line here -
"Dilution
The texture - but not necessarily the aroma and palate - of the fuller-bodied style of the malt is best appreciated if it is sampled undiluted. A good compromise is to add just the odd drop of water, "like the dew on a rose", in the words of whisky-merchant and writer Wallace Milroy. A small amount of water will help awaken the bouquet of a malt, and bring out aromatics in the palate. Some professional blenders work only with their nose, not finding it necessary to let the whisky pass their lips. Others like to sample the whisky undiluted, though this can soon anaesthetise the palate. Some blenders like to dilute 50-50, using distilled or very pure water."

--
Vincent
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http://clik.to/UnknownVT2006
http://clik.to/UnknownVT2005
http://clik.to/UnknownVT2004
http://clik.to/UnknownVincent

 

[kinzli]

Sounds like it would be worth a try. Is that pronounced like it looks? ("aard-beg") Might have to try that this weekend.

Yes, correct, pronounced like it sounds, with the accent on the 'beg'.

Ardbeg 10 is available from most shops that stock a decent range of Scotch. It runs around $45-50/bottle. It is very, very tasty, and I think you'll note hints of caramel and a very candy-like essence without being sweet (well, just a touch).

It is, however, what I would consider a classic Islay, that is it's smoky in nose and finish. The smokeyness arises from peat-fueled drying of the barley, and is usually what either attacts or repels people from Islay whiskies.

I'm in Central CA, btw, and have most of the classic whiskies on hand, if you're ever up my way

 

[Steven Roos]

Might have to make a road trip! lol!

Wish I could find a bar that would do samplers, like you would do with beer. Just a fraction of a portion; just enough to get an idea of the nose and roll around on the tongue. Probably wouldn't be the best way to taste, but would be good to get an idea of various malts without buying lots of bottles.

 

[UnknownVT]

Lagavulin 16 is one of those whiskies that will either repel you, or cause you to go head over heels in love.

IMHO, it's one of the finest examples, at any price, of a very nice Islay.

If you do enjoy the Laga, then you are destined to find Ardbeg, which, IMHO, is the quintessential Islay. If you enjoy Islays, then you will no doubt love Ardbeg 10, it's like candy for an Islay lover (in more ways than just taste!).

Sounds like it would be worth a try. Is that pronounced like it looks? ("aard-beg") Might have to try that this weekend.

For me the most obvious Islay malt was supposed to be Laphroaig - the basic 10 at that - since that is most likely what people will have tried first.

from that link M. Jackson rating/comments of the Laphroaig 10 -
"10-year-old, 43 vol
Full, refractive, gold.
Medicinal, phenolic, seaweedy, with a hint of sherry.
Medium, oily.
Seaweedy, salty, oily.
Round and very dry.
86"

I think it was the "oily" and medicinal quality that put me off the Laphroaig 10.

In my former quest for a more reasonably priced substitute for Lagavulin 16 - I tried Ardbeg and found it too astringent and fiery for my tastes, and I am not really one for "smooth" or mellow Scotches -

But his is how M. Jackson rates Ardbeg -
"10-year-old, 40 vol
Fino sherry.
Smoke, brine, iodine dryness.
Only medium to full, but very firm. A light heavyweight with a punch worthy of a higher division.
Skips sweetly along at first, then becomes mean and moody in the lengthy middle of the encounter.
Hefty, lots of iodine.
85

18-year-old, 43 vol, Master of Malt
Gold.
Fragrant, with seaweed and a hint of oak.
Medium to full, smooth.
Sweetish, developing to seaweed and salt.
Soothing, long, appetising.
90

18-year-old, 58.1 vol, Cadenhead
Pale gold.
Seaweedy, sweet and sour.
Medium to full, with some viscosity.
Sweeter, maltier, then flavours reminiscent of edible seaweed and intense salt.
Salty, tidal, attacking.
91"

In the end I realized trying to find a "substitute" for Lagavulin 16 for me was futile -
any "similar" Islay just led to the "well, it ain't Lagavulin" -
so for me, I'd rather drink other different characteristic single malts,
and just reserve Lagavulin 16 for special occassions.

--
Vincent
http://UnknownVincent.Shutterfly.com
http://clik.to/UnknownVT2006
http://clik.to/UnknownVT2005
http://clik.to/UnknownVT2004
http://clik.to/UnknownVincent

 

[kinzli]

Might have to make a road trip! lol!

Wish I could find a bar that would do samplers, like you would do with beer. Just a fraction of a portion; just enough to get an idea of the nose and roll around on the tongue. Probably wouldn't be the best way to taste, but would be good to get an idea of various malts without buying lots of bottles.

WhiskyFests will do that for you...give you a chance to sample some good vintages.

Also, some of the better whisky shops put on tasting events from time to time. There's one in the bay area that does it regularly.

I would imagine http://www.hitimewine.net/index.asp or even BevMo in your area would have some occasionally.

 

[kinzli]

For me the most obvious Islay malt was supposed to be Laphroaig - the basic 10 at that - since that is most likely what people will have tried first.

Yes, Laphroaig is a very good and well-known Islay, for sure. One of the biggest, if not the biggest and most well known. Laphroaig 10 is available almost anywhere for $30/bottle and is a great dram, IMHO.

Laphroaig Quarter Cask is wonderful, right up there with the best, too. An excellent whisky at a reasonable cost.

Laphroaig cask strength is a powerful one, packs a punch with fire. Love it.