Thoughts on authorized dealers raising GEC prices above the minimum sale price.

skx013k2 said:
What % of individual knives from the recent drops are going direct to the normal consumer as opposed to being listed directly by the retailer (or their surrogate) on eBay? I believe the latter is becoming quite prominent.

The reason I said it’s being done with GECs blessing is exactly what you mention above - GEC doesn’t appear to be doing anything to dealers who are engaging in this behavior. If authorized Rolex dealers were selling their inventory directly (or through a surrogate) on eBay to the highest bidder, they wouldn’t be authorized Rolex dealers much longer.
Click to expand...

I have no clue. My point is that GEC has options at their disposal to respond to market forces. The Rolex example is precisely why I don't think dealers are doing this at scale. Sure, you can make a $500 profit by doing shady ebay deals but those are limited. When you try and scale it, you risk losing the broader GEC relationship. GEC likely doesn't care whether they sell thru dealer A vs dealer B and dealer B is more then happy to take the inventory on since its a guaranteed profit.

Jiki said:
I wonder how many of the secondary "flippers" are really members of this collecting community and are using the profits to finance their personal collection? Profits they take from the rest of us. The reason they are so angry is because the dealers are cutting into their profit.
Click to expand...

That's actually my point with why speculators are critical to a well functioning market. Effectively, they place their own capital at risk and push the boundary on price. This benefits everyone else as they discover the upper bound of pricing without ever risking a single $.
 
abcdef said:
You can use Word Hippo or the dictionary to look up the word "fair".

You are a parser. We all know that is exactly what you are.

Anyway, you have diverted this discussion too far from the topic. But since the issue is now settled, I'm done with it and suggest we return to the discussion of GEC dealer prices.
Click to expand...
I already suggested that. But you had to have the last word and hurl some supposed insult at me. And BTW, YOU diverted the discussion. NOW, if you are done abusing the English language to justify greedy practices, we can go back to the topic. As I previously suggested.

It seems to me that there are two issues. One is between GEC and its dealers. Their business, IMO. Hard for me to see much reason for comment on this from anyone but those parties. YMMV. Anyway, IF GEC really wanted to curtail this, I think it would actually be pretty easy. Print serial numbers on the labels of all GEC tubes going forward. Traceability.

The other issue is between GEC dealers and GEC customers. I think it would be EXCELLENT if someone created a list somewhere - maybe not here at BF; maybe at Reddit; anywhere really - of all of the GEC dealers that have been discovered to be selling their allotment of knives well above MSRP - directly, on eBay, here - wherever. Specific examples would be excellent. Then we would all know exactly which dealers to boycott in the future if/when supply and demand settle at a different price point and they decide that they want to return to their old business model.
 
The Amazing Virginian said:
The other issue is between GEC dealers and GEC customers. I think it would be EXCELLENT if someone created a list somewhere - maybe not here at BF; maybe at Reddit; anywhere really - of all of the GEC dealers that have been discovered to be selling their allotment of knives well above MSRP - directly, on eBay, here - wherever. Specific examples would be excellent. Then we would all know exactly which dealers to boycott in the future if/when supply and demand settle at a different price point and they decide that they want to return to their old business model.
Click to expand...
It seems to me that this thread would be an appropriate place for naming names. (unless I'm incorrect about forum rules)
 
ooitzoo said:
That's actually my point with why speculators are critical to a well functioning market. Effectively, they place their own capital at risk and push the boundary on price. This benefits everyone else as they discover the upper bound of pricing without ever risking a single $.
Click to expand...
I would question if this is a well functioning market. However that wasn't my point.

My point is that there are some less than reputable people among us that are actually the flippers. Which on its own doesn't bother me. It is the denial and then bitching about the flippers that I find off putting. Basically the lie, if you're a flipper that's your business but don't lie about it.
 
ooitzoo said:
I have no clue. My point is that GEC has options at their disposal to respond to market forces. The Rolex example is precisely why I don't think dealers are doing this at scale. Sure, you can make a $500 profit by doing shady ebay deals but those are limited. When you try and scale it, you risk losing the broader GEC relationship. GEC likely doesn't care whether they sell thru dealer A vs dealer B and dealer B is more then happy to take the inventory on since its a guaranteed profit.



That's actually my point with why speculators are critical to a well functioning market. Effectively, they place their own capital at risk and push the boundary on price. This benefits everyone else as they discover the upper bound of pricing without ever risking a single $.
Click to expand...

A flipper that scoops a knife out my cart that I wanted to buy at dealer price ( say $100.00 ) and then tries to sell it to me on the secondary market for $300.00 isn't doing anything positive for me.... in fact he's pissing me off.... I consider flippers, scalpers and personal injury lawyers among life's low crawlers....
 
Jiki said:
I wonder how many of the secondary "flippers" are really members of this collecting community and are using the profits to finance their personal collection? Profits they take from the rest of us. The reason they are so angry is because the dealers are cutting into their profit.
Click to expand...

HEMI 49 said:
A flipper that scoops a knife out my cart that I wanted to buy at dealer price ( say $100.00 ) and then tries to sell it to me on the secondary market for $300.00 isn't doing anything positive for me.... in fact he's pissing me off.... I consider flippers, scalpers and personal injury lawyers among life's low crawlers....
Click to expand...

I agree that the flippers doing this is just as bad as dealers selling at high prices. I don't know how close everyone watches the exchange, but there was a knife purchased on it at the end of January that most of us would like to have. It sold for under $130, as the person selling it seems to be a decent person and wanted to pass it on at a reasonable price to another collector. Said purchaser then sold the exact knife, now i'm not to say if they had another or what, but they sold it for right around $300 on the exchange. Either way, they made over double their money and cost the second buyer $170 extra.
 
rcs86 said:
I agree that the flippers doing this is just as bad as dealers selling at high prices. I don't know how close everyone watches the exchange, but there was a knife purchased on it at the end of January that most of us would like to have. It sold for under $130, as the person selling it seems to be a decent person and wanted to pass it on at a reasonable price to another collector. Said purchaser then sold the exact knife, now i'm not to say if they had another or what, but they sold it for right around $300 on the exchange. Either way, they made over double their money and cost the second buyer $170 extra.
Click to expand...
That's BS and bad form. If I was the original seller I would talk to the Mods.

That being said, that's why I pick the people I sell to and don't use the exchange. Much less likely for that to happen to me, but at the end of the day I will not sweat it if it does.
 
HEMI 49 said:
A flipper that scoops a knife out my cart that I wanted to buy at dealer price ( say $100.00 ) and then tries to sell it to me on the secondary market for $300.00 isn't doing anything positive for me.... in fact he's pissing me off.... I consider flippers, scalpers and personal injury lawyers among life's low crawlers....
Click to expand...

I hear people say that. Then when they get injured due to someone else's negligence, they all call a personal injury lawyer.

20 years ago I knew a woman who was plowed into by some jackass in a big truck going way, WAY, over the speed limit and not watching what he was doing. The had to bring in the chopper for emergency evacuation to the hospital, and she was in the ICU for weeks and nearly died. Then she spent a couple of months in a rehab facility before she could go home. Her medical bills were unbelievable. And she was in her early 60s, working as a nurse at the time, but she could never work again due to the fact she could never even walk right after that.

Was she supposed to just suck it up buttercup?

Dude who hit her had a $1.4 million liability policy. His negligence was not at issue - the cops were prepared to charge him with vehicular manslaughter if she had not made it. She collected a few hundred grand in a settlement with the insurance company. Didn't make her rich. Paid her medical bills and helped her pay her mortgage and such since she couldn't work anymore.

Damn personal injury lawyer!
 
The Amazing Virginian said:
I hear people say that. Then when they get injured due to someone else's negligence, they all call a personal injury lawyer.

20 years ago I knew a woman who was plowed into by some jackass in a big truck going way, WAY, over the speed limit and not watching what he was doing. The had to bring in the chopper for emergency evacuation to the hospital, and she was in the ICU for weeks and nearly died. Then she spent a couple of months in a rehab facility before she could go home. Her medical bills were unbelievable. And she was in her early 60s, working as a nurse at the time, but she could never work again due to the fact she could never even walk right after that.

Was she supposed to just suck it up buttercup?

Dude who hit her had a $1.4 million liability policy. His negligence was not at issue - the cops were prepared to charge him with vehicular manslaughter if she had not made it. She collected a few hundred grand in a settlement with the insurance company. Didn't make her rich. Paid her medical bills and helped her pay her mortgage and such since she couldn't work anymore.

Damn personal injury lawyer!
Click to expand...

Personal injury settlements have enlarged my insurance premiums my entire life.... Someone pays for the multi million dollar settlements and the big cuts to the lawyers..... The money doesn't fall off of trees.......
But I'm off topic........ Knife content.....
Case Gunstock
20210213_144543.jpg
 
I got an email last night from a dealer about their urban jacks becoming available today. At $150. To me, thats secondary pricing. I dont mind paying that money on the secondary market, but when i do that its because its for a specific pattern that im targeting. Ive got 6 gecs and they are $100-$120 dollar knives, not $150 and definitely not what flippers are scamming people for. That being said, i can pay up to $200 for one but id only do that for something that i know ill enjoy and another knife cant be substituted. It also makes a difference when someone is selling to me because i asked not because they were looking for a buyer.
 
Mass1632 said:
I got an email last night from a dealer about their urban jacks becoming available today. At $150. To me, thats secondary pricing. I dont mind paying that money on the secondary market, but when i do that its because its for a specific pattern that im targeting. Ive got 6 gecs and they are $100-$120 dollar knives, not $150 and definitely not what flippers are scamming people for. That being said, i can pay up to $200 for one but id only do that for something that i know ill enjoy and another knife cant be substituted. It also makes a difference when someone is selling to me because i asked not because they were looking for a buyer.
Click to expand...
I guess you didn't get the email where they were selling for $170. Sold out in seconds BTW.
 
Mass1632 said:
I got an email last night from a dealer about their urban jacks becoming available today. At $150. To me, thats secondary pricing. I dont mind paying that money on the secondary market, but when i do that its because its for a specific pattern that im targeting. Ive got 6 gecs and they are $100-$120 dollar knives, not $150 and definitely not what flippers are scamming people for. That being said, i can pay up to $200 for one but id only do that for something that i know ill enjoy and another knife cant be substituted. It also makes a difference when someone is selling to me because i asked not because they were looking for a buyer.
Click to expand...
I entered the drawing they had for the 15 and scored one, paid what I thought was a fair price. However, this time I agree with you, $150 seems high. I have to say though, I’m not interested in these “comb” knives and wouldn’t buy one anyway. That said, I do like the idea of the drawings.
 
Ive limited my attempts to only two dealers. Not the best way to score but its more relaxing. I cant complain about not scoring doing it this way but i accept that. Its too frustrating otherwise. Ive skipped around on this thread and not read the entirety.

i like the drawing concept also, one of the reasons i try to support that dealer. Not going to be able to support him today though.
 
I’ve done the same thing, I only deal with 2 dealers and my stress level has gone down a lot as well. I’ll be on a bit of a break for a while. Not interested in the “comb” knife or the 85s. I know I’m in a total minority, which is fine, but I’m not into the cap lifter thing and the coke bottle shield doesn’t do anything for me either. It would have been good on the 97 however.
 
The Amazing Virginian said:
"If another company starts producing a knife af similar quality for a more reasonable price, will people not buy it because it doesn't come in a GEC tube?"

Correct. The market is not pricing them according to their quality as tools anymore. IMO. they have moved beyond the market for tools and into the realm of collectibles. In fact, pretty much all of the GEC knives I see for sale on The Bay are sold in the Collectible Folding Knives category. I do not believe folks are mostly buying them for their quality as tools anymore, and I believe that few of these GEC knives going for $250 or $300 or more (e.g., $700 2019 BF knives!!!) are going to see a lot of pocket time. Folks are buying them and collecting them. As GEC knives. In their tubes. Whether Viper or Lionsteel or Case or even a custom maker makes a similar or better quality knife for a lower price is pretty much irrelevant. At least that's the way it seems to me.
Click to expand...
This is what gets me, these used to be knives that cut stuff. Now they're collector commodities. GEC was a good knife company once. These tubes and their contents have strayed far from that now. For knife users GEC is now practically as dead as Queen. No one would pay that much for a user. The value simply isn't there except as bragging rights and the brand recognition isn't like a rolex or leica, you're not going to impress anyone because the vast majority won't have a clue. So from the users perspective, what's the point in buying one any more?
 
Pomsbz said:
This is what gets me, these used to be knives that cut stuff. Now they're collector commodities. GEC was a good knife company once. These tubes and their contents have strayed far from that now. For knife users GEC is now practically as dead as Queen. No one would pay that much for a user. The value simply isn't there except as bragging rights and the brand recognition isn't like a rolex or leica, you're not going to impress anyone because the vast majority won't have a clue. So from the users perspective, what's the point in buying one any more?
Click to expand...

IMO, with a few exceptions, you have to be pretty well off to pay $300 plus for a user pocket knife, and there are other "good enough" options for a ton less. Then again . . . what's the point of even having more than 2 or 3 pocket knives? That's where it all starts. How many of us have 6? 10? 20? 40? We're way beyond "user" somewhere in there.

BTW, what's leica - maybe their brand recognition isn't as good as you think.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top