Thoughts on Coyotes

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dougo83 said:
Easy there. No reason to make ASSumptions about people you don't know. Remember, our human interference is, in large part, the reason that so many damn animals are extinct, endangered, or protected. Guess who got them protected? The loony left. Guess it doesn't hurt to listen to them, huh? It has been mostly proven, by the way, that human interference doesn't help controlling populations as much as just leaving them alone will.

Cheers

A red-blooded, gun-totin, right wing terrorist.:thumbup::cool:
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I guess the boar isn't totally dead. :rolleyes:

Millions of species went extinct before man was on the planet, many more will after we are gone. The looney left however blames everything that happens on man, just like you and phil are doing. Sometimes I wonder if they think that man should have never evolved. I say bull, we are at the top of the food chain and should not be ashamed of it.

We need to protect and preserve nature, agreed, however if there is a surplus we should be able to take and use it. Whether or not you think it is just for the "pleasure" of killing or not, if the polulation will support hunting, people should be able to do so, whether or not you agree with it. Hunting is all about controlling populations not being one with nature, Timothy Treadwell tried that, now he is truly one with nature. Modern hunting and conservation practices are working wonderfully and game populations all across the US prove it.

What gives you and Phil the right to tell us that we shouldn't hunt Coyotes even if they are overpopulated in our area and we are wrong and sick if we enjoy it. Keep trying to ram your ideas down everyone else's throat, well your not really, your just talking out your ass on an internet forum. Chris
 
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August West said:
What gives you and Phil the right to tell us that we shouldn't hunt Coyotes even if they are overpopulated in our area and we are wrong and sick if we enjoy it. Keep trying to ram your ideas down everyone else's throat, well your not really, your just talking out your ass on an internet forum. Chris
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What gives them the right? Feedom of speech.

You have the right not to agree. Don't get your feathers ruffled over a difference of opinion, though (especially in a thread about opinions!). This would be a boring place if everyone agreed about everything.

All the best,

- Mike
 
Coyotes are an invasive species here in Tennessee. Like armadillos, English sparrows and fire ants. They are not a natural part of our ecosystem. Our State game management biologists recognize this and allow hunting them year-round. They displace indiginous preditor animals. They prey on birds and other wildlife that we are trying to reestablish. I see no problem with culling them, and neither do our biologists. At worst case, the population isn't greatly reduced, but they are more fearful of humans and less likely to prey on domestic pets, poultry and livestock. I don't consider them to be dangerous to humans in general, but all of my children are grown. I might feel differently if I had small children and the yotes were bold enough to come into my yard looking for an easy meal.

Michael
 
Mentor said:
What gives them the right? Feedom of speech.

You have the right not to agree. Don't get your feathers ruffled over a difference of opinion, though (especially in a thread about opinions!). This would be a boring place if everyone agreed about everything.

All the best,

- Mike
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Agreed Mike, but I didn't call anyone sick or tell anyone what they are doing is wrong. If people don't want to hunt coyotes, fine, don't, but unless you can prove what I am doing is not ecologically sound and hurts the environment, don't tell me I shouldn't because you don't like it. Chris
 
sawgrass7 said:
hey philwar,

I was thinking about your posts here and wrote something that I almost put here in this thread.

Please see my new thread today here on the WSS forum titled " WSS Gratitude and Merry Christmas thoughts"

Wishing you a Merry Christmas - sawgrass7
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Thx for that post. It's not as if I don't know the outdoors, I've lived in rough places all over the world for extended periods of time.
I have no problem with killing animals for defense or food. I am however firmly convinced there's something really wrong with people shooting an animal that does not threaten them (or their family/pets/lifestock) in anyway and won't be used for food. And you can rationalize and explain it away as much as you like, it's bloodlust pure and simple.
In Sweden a few days ago, licenses were issued to shoot some wolves, less than 30 (thirty) to be exact. MORE THAN 10000 HUNTERS APPLIED FOR A LICENSE.
The news reporter jokingly said it was gonna be crowded in the Swedish forests, with thousands and thousands of hunters going after 27 wolves. More were not allowed to be shot, so it was gonna be a real race.
So all these guys just wanna help out and rid Sweden of the wolf investation? :rolleyes: "It's just a hoot to shoot me a wolf, 's all... "
Bloodlust. It does not belong in a sane and rational person.
 
The oldest rule in the book is to protect your family and your livelihood from anything or anyone who tries to harm or rob you. In some places, nature provide a balance, sometimes that balance gets shifted and must be corrected.

Where I live the coyote really had no natural enemies for a long time and overran their food supply, Now the mountain lions have really taken hold and are raising hell with the deer herds and livestock competing with the coyotes. Coyote population here have taken a nose dive. The results, we are now hunting mountain lions.
 
philwar said:
It does not belong in a sane and rational person.
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So I am insane and irrational. :confused:

30 wolves needed to be killed to keep things in balance, 1000 hunters wanted to do it, just because you don't, does not make people that do insane. I really don't understand your position and to me it is irrational, I like to hunt just as my father and his father before did. I love coyotes and would be crushed if they weren't here for me to enjoy and hunting is part of that joy. Chris

I think everything that can be said has been and am through with this discussion.
 
August West said:
So I am insane and irrational. :confused:

30 wolves needed to be killed to keep things in balance, 1000 hunters wanted to do it, just because you don't, does not make people that do insane. I really don't understand your position and to me it is irrational, I like to hunt just as my father and his father before did. I love coyotes and would be crushed if they weren't here for me to enjoy and hunting is part of that joy. Chris

I think everything that can be said has been and am through with this discussion.
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it's 10000 (10k), not 1000. And the point is that there are more than 10k hunters who can't wait to shoot a wolf, for no good reason at all. Just kill.
I believe you when you say you don't understand my position. You've always hunted, as did your forefathers, and many millions if not billions of others did and do as well. And again, I have no problem with killing an animal for food or defense.
What I cannot get across to you and many others is that killing for killing's sake is wrong. You don't accept that premise. You don't see anything wrong with killing for sport. For you, playing basketball is a sport, and hunting bear or coyote is a sport too.
For me, basketball is a sport too. But for me, willfully destroying life is not, can never be sport. I honestly think that the wanton destruction of life for the purpose of pleasure warrants thorough examination.

I don't mean to offend anyone by my qualifications, although I do stand by them. Perhaps my hope to make sporthunters reconsider their motives for hunting - what exactly is this pleasure they get from killing - if they've ever examined them at all, perhaps that hope is idle. But it would be nice if people would give a hard look at exactly what it is that drives them to kill for no good reason at all.
 
Where I live, many if not most people hunt. Their reasons vary. Most people who shoot coyotes do not kill them just to be killing something. Most do it for the pelt, the bounty or because they are loosing livestock and such.

I have always been a hunter but I have never killed an animal just to kill it. People here shoot varmints and coyotes are in the category.
 
Guys, nothing constructive is served by continuing this disagreement. I guarantee you, neither of you (Phil and August) will change your mind. All it does is introduce more discord into a, so far, relatively civil discussion.

Agree to disagree and let's carry on.

Doc
 
DOC-CANADA said:
Agree to disagree and let's carry on.
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How do we carry on? The whole pint of this thread is to fight about Coyotes and whether or not killing them is justifiable. I'd ask that it not get personal, but it's been a lovely fight so far.
 
seriously, if you guys can't play nice in WS&S, it is going to be another thread shut down about canines. The first complaint the moderators get about this and it gets shut down.
 
Thank you for all of the inputs. I really gained some insight from other's perspectives on this subject. Thanks for the constructive inputs.

Joe or another mod, please lock the thread. Creating discord isnt something that I am aiming to do on this fantasic forum.
 
I'm enjoying some parts of this thread. Not all, but some.

One thing that's become obvious is that whther or not coyotes are danger/nuisance/varmint greatly depends on your region.

Absolutes won't work there. period. dot. If you are losing sheep or deer in quantity and it's verifiable, then there's a problem. Humans are predators, too.

If you aren't losing animals, if the coyotes aren't a problem, then sure, leave them be.

Understand that there's no possible way human shooting of coyotes can eradicate or endanger them- you might get some population control (or might not) and you might teach them to avoid a given area or range (more likely) - which is fine.

Look, I don't eat rat on a regular basis, but if one gets into the house it's TOAST. I don't eat flies, either. Still kill them.


Now, this whole idea of nature in balance struck a thought in me many years ago, and I'd like to bring it up here. Nature isn't ever in balance- it's always a dynamic, moving system. The expansion of coyotes is part of the dynamism. So is our modification of the environment by whatever means we use. It's sort of silly to claim we cannot manage the environment- we obviously can have nearly any level of impact and enforce nearly any change we want- what we need to do is be smart about it!
 
philwar said:
it's 10000 (10k), not 1000. And the point is that there are more than 10k hunters who can't wait to shoot a wolf, for no good reason at all. Just kill.
I believe you when you say you don't understand my position. You've always hunted, as did your forefathers, and many millions if not billions of others did and do as well. And again, I have no problem with killing an animal for food or defense.
What I cannot get across to you and many others is that killing for killing's sake is wrong. You don't accept that premise. You don't see anything wrong with killing for sport. For you, playing basketball is a sport, and hunting bear or coyote is a sport too.
For me, basketball is a sport too. But for me, willfully destroying life is not, can never be sport. I honestly think that the wanton destruction of life for the purpose of pleasure warrants thorough examination.

I don't mean to offend anyone by my qualifications, although I do stand by them. Perhaps my hope to make sporthunters reconsider their motives for hunting - what exactly is this pleasure they get from killing - if they've ever examined them at all, perhaps that hope is idle. But it would be nice if people would give a hard look at exactly what it is that drives them to kill for no good reason at all.
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Paraphrasing Ortega Y Gasset, I do not hunt in order to be able to eat, on the contrary I eat in order to be able to hunt.
 
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