Photos [Updated with BR’s response] Problems with Brand New Bark River Gunny CPM-3V

[shinyedges]

I don't endorse mike Stewart or BRK and I'll admit, I don't know all the drama involved with them. I also don't care.

I will say that I have all the knives that have been mentioned in this thread plus a hundred more in the same category.

I don't own any knives better than my BRK bravo LT in cruwear or my aurora LT in 3v (even if it might be a2).

I always take these threads with a grain of salt and suspicion because they are sometimes started by someone with no posts and brand new. It seems like several people immediately parrot the same trash talk.

Maybe I wear a tin foil hat but there is most definitely some type of agenda to continuously discredit and bash BRK. Yet they still sell a ton of great knives.

Take that as you like but pleas don't begin a debate with me, because I won't defend BRK. I'll only point out there is something fishy and nefarious about the dozens of similar threads

I was referring to this guy, the bold and underlined.

I know about the history. I just think they make a pretty darn nicely finished knife. BRKT is not a company that I simply won't buy their products. There are a couple that I won't buy there stuff. But that may be an overstatement as I probably wouldn't buy their stuff anyway. From my perspective, the cutlery choices available today are amazing.

"Well, we sell 40,000 knives a year to the tune of eight million bucks" is just that, an arrogant response to cover up poor business practices.

I still don't see the statement as being particularly arrogant, rather a statement of fact. I don't think BRKT needs to use the wrong steel to up their per unit profits. I doubt $10 would make much difference at all to a prospective buyer, so there is no reason to do the steel thing intentionally. I think Stewart has a right to be proud of their knives. I'm not really defending him or his company, I just cut them a bit more slack than many. But if I ever have a legitimate problem, I expect them to deal with it honestly. The story below is interesting.... just happened....

I just purchased and had delivered a polish product from the manufacturer. It was supposed to be delivered on Friday and today is Tuesday via USPS. The tracking was truly interesting as the package was shipped immediately to the correct post office for delivery.... and then they shipped it out to another post office. This thing bounced around for a couple days going all over the place (Post office to sort center to post office to sort center and on an on) and after it was delivered I could see no reason for it. I emailed the company and pasted the tracking info before it was delivered.... The president of the company called me in the last evening. Amazing service actually. I was not complaining, just sent them the tracking info in case it was shipped back to them undelivered. Wish Mike Stewart would approach his business and customer service like this.

 

[shinyedges]

Odd then, that he's done his level best in here to discredit:

- the OP and this situation involving this garbage knife.
- Anyone who has ever had this exact situation happen in the past
- The previous posts made by those folks
- Anyone who does not like Mike Stewart.

I guess I just don't understand why some people feel compelled to defend shoddy charcters/companies when they specifically say they are not doing that exact thing..

I mean, does liking a knife mean you are the embassador of the company or the god father of the owners son?!?

 

[jimmyd1982]

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."
-Hanlon's Razor

Do you have any evidence to support the claim that they are acting maliciously and not just negligent?

In this particular incident no, but since MS has admitted to swapping out steels in the past I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he'd do it again.

 

[22-rimfire]

In this particular incident no, but since MS has admitted to swapping out steels in the past I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he'd do it again.

Perhaps. But I see no reason for BRKT to do that at this point. The difference in price is not significant if you want a particular knife. Correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that happened when Blackjack was failing and the knives simply said "stainless steel" or something like that. The Blackjack trademark has bounced around and I believe it's currently owned by Blue Ridge Knives in VA. But BRKT is manufacturing many of the Blackjacks under contract.

 

[Quiet]

I know about the history. I just think they make a pretty darn nicely finished knife. BRKT is not a company that I simply won't buy their products. There are a couple that I won't buy there stuff. But that may be an overstatement as I probably wouldn't buy their stuff anyway. From my perspective, the cutlery choices available today are amazing.

"Well, we sell 40,000 knives a year to the tune of eight million bucks" is just that, an arrogant response to cover up poor business practices.

I still don't see the statement as being particularly arrogant, rather a statement of fact. I don't think BRKT needs to use the wrong steel to up their per unit profits. I doubt $10 would make much difference at all to a prospective buyer, so there is no reason to do the steel thing intentionally. I think Stewart has a right to be proud of their knives. I'm not really defending him or his company, I just cut them a bit more slack than many. But if I ever have a legitimate problem, I expect them to deal with it honestly. The story below is interesting.... just happened....

I just purchased and had delivered a polish product from the manufacturer. It was supposed to be delivered on Friday and today is Tuesday via USPS. The tracking was truly interesting as the package was shipped immediately to the correct post office for delivery.... and then they shipped it out to another post office. This thing bounced around for a couple days going all over the place (Post office to sort center to post office to sort center and on an on) and after it was delivered I could see no reason for it. I emailed the company and pasted the tracking info before it was delivered.... The president of the company called me in the last evening. Amazing service actually. I was not complaining, just sent them the tracking info in case it was shipped back to them undelivered. Wish Mike Stewart would approach his business and customer service like this.

That you don't see the arrogance in that, means you probably don't have much experience in a customer service role. I have that extensive experience, and can tell you that that statement, factual or not, is a straight dismissal of concerns the OP had, hence my statement that it's sheer arrogance. After all, where do you draw the line? What if you were the one who had a clearly defective unit, and when approaching Mike Stewart with your concerns, that was what you were told? I can't help but wonder if your perception would be different. The actual fact is that it's a meaningless statement based in arrogance. OP didn't ask MS how many knives they sell a year, and what their profit margins were. MS was dismissing the OP's concerns, that is clear.

 

[Quiet]

In fact, let's

So, to recap. Someone who is skilled in dealing with customers (or who has a basic understanding of being polite with people who want to give your company money) would have probably responded quite differently. Instead of the above mouthrunning, what was wrong with just stating something like: "This product was clearly defective due to some error on our part, as head of the company the buck stops with me. So, I apologize and want to make this right, please send the knife back for an instant replacement." OP: "Well, some people are saying these things." MS: "Well, we can't really speak to those comments. Anyway, would you like a refund, or another of this model in this steel? I'll make sure that it's the correct item personally before it goes out."

Now, which commentary looks like an arrogant jackass being petulant in his own defense, and which commentary track looks like a professional running a successful business wanting to take care of a customer so they become a repeat customer?

 

[22-rimfire]

In fact, let's


So, to recap. Someone who is skilled in dealing with customers (or who has a basic understanding of being polite with people who want to give your company money) would have probably responded quite differently. Instead of the above mouthrunning, what was wrong with just stating something like: "This product was clearly defective due to some error on our part, as head of the company the buck stops with me. So, I apologize and want to make this right, please send the knife back for an instant replacement." OP: "Well, some people are saying these things." MS: "Well, we can't really speak to those comments. Anyway, would you like a refund, or another of this model in this steel? I'll make sure that it's the correct item personally before it goes out."

Now, which commentary looks like an arrogant jackass being petulant in his own defense, and which commentary track looks like a professional running a successful business wanting to take care of a customer so they become a repeat customer?

I think you are speaking about personalities and the way they view and phrase things. My impression based on prior visits to the other forum is that he is arrogant. But I think it's sort of a character flaw and built into him. Ultimately, he needs to replace the product as far as I'm concerned. I doubt he will ever bow down and say "we screwed up".

 

[Quiet]

I think you are speaking about personalities and the way they view and phrase things. My impression based on prior visits to the other forum is that he is arrogant. But I think it's sort of a character flaw and built into him. Ultimately, he needs to replace the product as far as I'm concerned. I doubt he will ever bow down and say "we screwed up".

I am not speaking about personalities. That's an excuse. I work with some of the biggest asshats, but when they are dealing with people who ultimately are our customers, they are smooth as silk, and Get It Done.

That's why I'm speaking about basic customer service expectations that we as customers should have when dealing with companies who have (albeit in this case indirectly) taken money from us in exchange for a product. Let me tell you, if I was spoken to that way, I'd have laughed in the guy's face. Eight million dollars? There are fast food restaurants that pull in more than that in a year. BRK isn't that huge of an operation. MS isn't Bezos, let's get back to earth here. They're a small company who makes a product that in many respects is no better than a lot of other products in that same market space. AND, as is clear by this very thread, they had one job, but couldn't even do it right 100% of the time (which really is why boasting about shipping out a bunch of knives is laughable). There are a lot of people who might be considering BRK knives, and they do a search and find threads like this where they see the owner of the company act like an arrogant ass to a customer who has a valid, real concern, that probably drives them towards one of any number of viable alternatives. Then that 8 million next year becomes seven million and some change, maybe less depending on how many people saw it. And you remember the old CS axiom, one person who had a great experience may tell one other person. A person who had a bad experience will usually tell everyone.

 

[jimmyd1982]

Perhaps. But I see no reason for BRKT to do that at this point. The difference in price is not significant if you want a particular knife. Correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that happened when Blackjack was failing and the knives simply said "stainless steel" or something like that. The Blackjack trademark has bounced around and I believe it's currently owned by Blue Ridge Knives in VA. But BRKT is manufacturing many of the Blackjacks under contract.

I didn't say he purposefully swapped steels to save a few bucks.

I'm just saying that he strikes me as the type of person that if he realized there was a problem with a batch of knives he would still choose to send them out and fix whatever individuals sent back instead of eating the loss for the entire batch.

It probably makes more sense to him from a business perspective since there wasn't a major backlash the other times he did it. Until screwing people over starts eating into his profit margins there is no real motivation for him to change.

 

[shinyedges]

I didn't say he purposefully swapped steels to save a few bucks.

I'm just saying that he strikes me as the type of person that if he realized there was a problem with a batch of knives he would still choose to send them out and fix whatever individuals sent back instead of eating the loss for the entire batch.

It probably makes more sense to him from a business perspective since there wasn't a major backlash the other times he did it. Until screwing people over starts eating into his profit margins there is no real motivation for him to change.

Agreed. We're speaking about a guy we know has poor morals when it comes to people's money. It isn't a stretch to assume a guy with that kind of moral compass would brush mistakes under the run instead of eat the loss.

Sal would. Mike Stewart? I'll believe it when my turds smell like strawberry sherbet.

 

[yoz's friend]

i have the solution to this problem..... infi

 

[LukeTheSpook]

Jeez Quiet; it’s getting really personal and passionate in here.

This is the Point where it’s hard to believe what the agenda is. When you spout out personal insults about a guy over and over, its plain for everyone to see that there is more to this.

 

[Quiet]

Jeez Quiet; it’s getting really personal and passionate in here.

Is that what you think my comments are? If that's the case, I'd have to say that your dogged defense of Bark River and Mike Stewart probably matches any "passion" you feel I'm bringing to the table. And again, odd coming from someone who stated up front that he had no idea of the history going on here and then went on to personally denigrate anyone who had has ever had an issue with BRK or Mike Stewart. Not a fan of turnabout being fair play, I take it?

 

[Deinos]

Agreed. We're speaking about a guy we know has poor morals when it comes to people's money. It isn't a stretch to assume a guy with that kind of moral compass would brush mistakes under the run instead of eat the loss.

Sal would. Mike Stewart? I'll believe it when my turds smell like strawberry sherbet.

Not to add fuel to the fire... but this is how Sal handles his biz. Thoroughly, hands-on, and constant updates with the community. Class act @Sal Glesser!

 

[Quiet]

Not to add fuel to the fire... but this is how Sal handles his biz. Thoroughly, hands-on, and constant updates with the community. Class act @Sal Glesser!

Class act is right! Sal Glesser has always been 100% about taking care of his customers.

 

[22-rimfire]

... I'm just saying that he strikes me as the type of person that if he realized there was a problem with a batch of knives he would still choose to send them out and fix whatever individuals sent back instead of eating the loss for the entire batch.

It probably makes more sense to him from a business perspective since there wasn't a major backlash the other times he did it. Until screwing people over starts eating into his profit margins there is no real motivation for him to change.

I hate to admit it, but I agree with you generally on the first point (about "sending them out"). That would be a character flaw from my point of view, all business. But I don't condemn him for it. I don't think he thinks that he is screwing people or customers either. I think MS can be a bit snotty with people.

Sal G enjoys a very positive relationship with folks here at BF overall. Where as, if MS had a manufacture's forum, there would likely be a lot of negativity because other than what model is coming out next, it is about problems. I would love to see him correct that.

 

[LukeTheSpook]

Is that what you think my comments are? If that's the case, I'd have to say that your dogged defense of Bark River and Mike Stewart probably matches any "passion" you feel I'm bringing to the table. And again, odd coming from someone who stated up front that he had no idea of the history going on here and then went on to personally denigrate anyone who had has ever had an issue with BRK or Mike Stewart. Not a fan of turnabout being fair play, I take it?

Here comes the BF Mafia to hurl insults and call people names!!!!!

 

[jimmyd1982]

Here comes the BF Mafia to hurl insults and call people names!!!!!

What?

 

[Quiet]

Here comes the BF Mafia to hurl insults and call people names!!!!!

No one is calling you names or hurling insults. I'm calling attention to the fact that you attempted a misdirection of your intentions back at the beginning of this thread. In fact, it's more telling that your first instinct is to claim that I'm getting personal and "passionate", despite the first what, seven or eight pages of this thread being you trying unsuccessfully to cast doubt on the OP's story, and on others who have had this exact issue and posted up about in the past?

Huh.

Anyway, to keep this party on track. OP, I'm glad that you're going to be taken care of by a quality businessman who's in the unfortunate position of covering for a poor businessman.

 

[LukeTheSpook]

not me, the names and trash you’re talking about mike Stewart.

My point in the beginning of this is: these threads may be fake. This OP may never be heard from again. They are only created to talk trash about brk.

Introduce exhibit a: you.