Urban Survival: Do's, Don'ts, & Questions

The dumpsters used by food stores and convenience stores often have out of date bread, cakes, pies ect. It doesn't take long to learn the schedule for this source of food. I used to pick thru them to get food to feed to my pigs. Often the food is in the original containers and perfectly safe for human consumption.

In suburban areas watch for fruit trees and gardens in season. If you ask many land owners will give you surplus produce or fruit, often for free, but you should ALWAYS offer to work in trade. This year I was given the entire pear crop off of a neighbors tree. All he asked was that I pick up the fruit on the round and get rid of it.

Also never dismiss the local creeks for a source of quick protein. Many of the urban and suburban creeks in our area have sunfish, crayfish and even a few catfish.

Here in the southern US there are big tracts of woodland along the creeks in populated areas. I have observed a lot of game, wild fruit, nuts and plant food sources in these corridors. Just try to keep your food gathering low profile and don't leave traces.

As far as weapons and tools; when I used to hitch hike I always carried a walking stick and a small LEGAL pocket knife. They go with a pack and canteen and will often draw little attention. They can be used to dig, fish, for defense, prepare food, and even as a tent pole.
 
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I rarely give homeless people money (I have once in awhile) for the fear of them buying booze or drugs obviously but I will give them food and water all day long. Once when I lived in Phoenix, there was a homeless lady on an off ramp holding a sign. I gave her my Cliff bar that I didn't eat on my hike that day and a bottle of water. You would have sworn she thought I gave her gold. She ate it and drank the water before I got the green light so I know she really needed it.

ROCK6 I lived in Seattle for two years and I was amazed at the number of homeless people there when I first moved there.

I think a lot of people assume that most homeless people who are drunks got homeless because of their problem but how many people who became homeless turned to booze or drugs to alleviate the pain so they could be numb.

Now on the flip side. You have seen these A-holes that the investigative reporters bust who act homeless and get followed to their $50,000 car or $250,000 home. I believe these guys should have their home and/or car confiscated and all of the proceeds go to a shelter. Wouldn't that be justice? Really there should be a law against the fake homeless schemes as they really are stealing from the true homeless. Any thoughts?
 
Where I live you have to get a license to beg. Like some people mentioned our "bums" work shifts and drop each other off in their car. Some park and walk a few feet to the corner. That just isn't right.

I'm just trying to get 100 percent debt free as soon as I can. Then if the economy gets worse I won't be stuck with a payment I can't make. But, I'm young, married, a home "owner" and getting the house paid off isn't happening quickly right now.

Lol, if the economy does ever pick up and if I benefit from that I just hope to never live beyond my means.
 
Barbarossa said:
I rarely give homeless people money (I have once in awhile) for the fear of them buying booze or drugs obviously but I will give them food and water all day long. Once when I lived in Phoenix, there was a homeless lady on an off ramp holding a sign. I gave her my Cliff bar that I didn't eat on my hike that day and a bottle of water. You would have sworn she thought I gave her gold. She ate it and drank the water before I got the green light so I know she really needed it.
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I made it a point during my hobo days to never ask for money, but instead ask for what I needed. If I needed food, i asked for food. If I really needed money, I asked around if there was temp work or day labor, or someone who needed odd jobs done. I got a lot further along that way.

I also liked to go to churches. They'd almost always get me food if I asked. Whether they offered for free or not, I always said I didn't want charity, and volunteered to mow the grass, rake the lawn, sweep the parking lot, vacuum the building, something to work for what they gave me. Often I'd get more than I asked for because of it. Also if they invite you to services (and they will), go. At the very least, you get people to talk to for a while, A/C in the summer and heat in the winter, and you may just learn something.

Barbarossa said:
I think a lot of people assume that most homeless people who are drunks got homeless because of their problem but how many people who became homeless turned to booze or drugs to alleviate the pain so they could be numb.
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Proverbs 31:6 Give strong drink to him who is perishing,
And wine to those who are bitter of heart.
7 Let him drink and forget his poverty,
And remember his misery no more.

Barbarossa said:
Now on the flip side. You have seen these A-holes that the investigative reporters bust who act homeless and get followed to their $50,000 car or $250,000 home. I believe these guys should have their home and/or car confiscated and all of the proceeds go to a shelter. Wouldn't that be justice? Really there should be a law against the fake homeless schemes as they really are stealing from the true homeless. Any thoughts?
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In my experience they are very rare, though they exist. And yes, I just as soon see them lose everything and actually become what they are pretending to be. They are stealing from the legit homeless, they are stealing from charitable people, and stealing from the taxpayers.

I really have to say it burns me to no end when people dehumanize the homeless. Oh they have all kinds of reasons about how dangerous the homeless are and such. Some are. BUT, some are that way because of how they are treated. If you caught me after being harassed for days on end, having almost no sleep, I'd be quite psychotic.

I had that happen one time. I went to every length I could think to avoid a confrontation. I had gone 3 days with almost no sleep. I walked out of town on a dead end road. I went into the woods. I was so tired, I didn't bother hiding my camp, and just sort of plopped down in some bushes. I don't know how long I slept, but I woke to some ***hole screaming about how that's not going to happen in his town, blah, blah. I look up to see this fat, yuppy looking guy in his office attire, standing in the woods screaming at me. I remember grabbing him by his tie. Next thing I remember, he's on the ground, I'm standing over him, and he's bleeding from every orifice, practically naked. Unfortunately, that probably just reinforced his opinion of how dangerous homeless people are, and now he drops into a fight stance if anyone gets closer than 5 feet from him, like a certain fellow from Prac Tac likes to talk about.

Problem is, even having been one of the "good guys", I have to say that 90% or better of the time, bums are scumbags. Note: there's a difference in a bum and a hobo. A bum usually stays in place, and is there for some reason other than choice. Hobos tend to move around and choose that lifestyle. I didn't choose it, but I made what I could of it.

But, like Barbarossa said, I don't know how many are bums because they are scum, or are scum because they are homeless.

For the not-homeless: How to tell if you are talking to a "good guy" or not.
Typically, a GG won't insist on getting into your personal space. They may or may not act ashamed. Try offering what they are asking for money for. They need $10 for gas? Offer to buy them $10 of gas. They want money for food? Offer to buy them food. If they act like they are grateful and you're giving them gold, they are probably a decent person down on their luck and really needed what they asked for. If they get all pissy, f-em.
 
A few years ago, I had the sorry misfortune to babysit one of the foremost wilderness survival experts of modern times. I won't give his name. I'll just call him "E.R." E.R liked to play with bombs and apparently didn't like international competition, amung other serious issues with Federal, State, and Local L.E. E.R. made several of the same points made in this thread. If you want to hide in the woods for years, leave no trail to be tracked, spotlessly police your campsite, and be packed and ready to run at a moments notice.
 
From the pictures, it seemed the individual described in the OP hadn't been there long. It was obvious that there was nothing sustainable about the way that anything was being done. It could actually be argued that everything there was a good example of how not to do things.

If I was trying to build a kit that would enable me to live as a bum, it would have the following:

A decent pack
multitool
wool blankets
cordage
lighters
wire
ducttape
machete
light weight plastic drop cloths.
razors
mirror
camp soap
long underwear
short machete
cookpot
spoon


The main things that would change from typical camp loadout would be the expectation of extended stays and reduced availability of tools and materials needed to provide longterm warmth and shelter.

ETA: Obviously, I haven't put any food procurement in here. While that would vary, nobody actually grows or catches their food, so it would seem to be a moot point.
 
I live right next to Seattle, and yes, we have a lot of homeless here. You can see some camps off the freeway just driving up and down I-5; some are under bridges and others in the woods right by the highway.

One thing I haven't seen mentioned yet are families who become homeless. I have a wife and young children and should we ever become homeless, there are a lot of programs available for women and children, and none of them accept men, even of the same family.

I suppose that is ok, since I would prefer that they are safe rather than out with me. Also, there may be advantages other than safety to have an "in" in the system as a way to hopefully get back on your feet.

Which then brings me to the idea of getting back on your feet. Your way of survival and living will be different depending on whether or not you WANT to get to a better situation. Cpl Punishment had some really great ideas and I completely agree - you have to be as non-threatening as possible, clean and presentable, and open and willing to work in order to move back into society.
 
Great thread! Lots of good ideas re: urban survival skills, just plain living skills, being compassionate...
Thanx all!

Cpl Punishment said:
...I don't know how long I slept, but I woke to some ***hole screaming about how that's not going to happen in his town, blah, blah. I look up to see this fat, yuppy looking guy in his office attire, standing in the woods screaming at me. I remember grabbing him by his tie. Next thing I remember, he's on the ground, I'm standing over him, and he's bleeding from every orifice, practically naked....
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Arg. Some people just have issues. I had a similar type of fellow who accosted me while I was sitting outside a grocery store having a snack. Gainfully employed at the time, not spanging, no sign, looking reasonably clean, and minding my own business. This fellow comes up and starts to berate me, telling me how I should get a job, blah blah. Thankfully I was in a reasonable head space. He got an earful from me, then skulked off. There's no shortage of a-holes in the world.
 
My personal finances are currently in pretty poor shape - but I am able to make rent & buy food so I'm OK at this stage. Luckily I live in a country with a reasonable welfare system and I could go stay with my mother if I had to. My current financial woes are chiefly due to the economic recession - I am self employed and things got really quiet for a while, this year there have been signs of improvement and I have been getting more work. It will take a while to clear my debts though - I'll have to budget pretty carefully for a while.

I am in a city and I do look around me at wooded areas and I think I really would move out of the city pretty quickly if I was homeless - there have to be way better places to camp and live off the land than in the city!
 
Some good thoughts guys.

Quoting Rock6 here...

"Tough clothing would be essential, but depending on your ability to move fast, there would have to be a compromise. Wool would probably be the most robust and best insulator in less than ideal weather, but the weight could offset your ability to move fast."

"I would really want fast-drying clothing, but urban environments are probably the toughest on clothing."

One thing I have noticed is a lot of Carharts in the cooler months and they are tough.

Appearance is a big thing for sure. So is an ability to communicate with potential employers. While they weren't an option the first time around 30 years ago I would definitely have a pre-pay cell phone now. Actually with me being a minor a real job wasn't even an option. I went around finding odd jobs doing mostly lawn work. I got started by asking an old man who was trimming his hedges if I could see his clippers for a minute, I started trimming his hedges and told him he should sit in the shade a few as he looked like he needed a break. By that evening I had trimmed his hedges, mowed and raked his little yard and trimmed some low limbs. I was given lunch, cold drinks and $40.00 for my efforts. A few days later he saw me at a Safeway and told me about a neighbor who wanted similar work done. Through word of mouth I stayed fairly busy right there in that three block area from late spring to early winter doing yard work, painting and other random stuff. I never told any of those people I was homeless and 1500 miles away from my nearest family member.

Yes I have and do test a lot of gear now simply because of the urban environment I live in has so many potential threats and I have a family to think about. In an event I would start out with as much as possible and work through the weeding process all over again. Back then after a while of being in that situation I had some things cached here and there but carried no pack at all most of the time. Having been assaulted a few times by street predators I wanted not to draw any attention and wanted to retain a high level of mobility.

When I lived in Miami about 22 years ago there were homeless people in Coconut Grove who slept in the trees in the park at night and kept most of their belongings cached somewhere.
 
mistwalker said:
I am just curious as to how others think they might deal with suddenly being outside... even if on a temporary basis, due to whatever reason they could imagine forcing it upon them.
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I would give serious thought to doing something (like stealing food from grocery stores) to get me inside a correctional facility, where I would have food, shelter, medical care, and conceivably exercise facilities and a library.
Not sure how beneficial this would be in the long run, but survival is about desperate measures.

People who find themselves homeless typically have substance abuse issues, so it is not reasonable to expect them to think and act rationally.
 
Great thread. A lot of excellent info to soak up here. :thumbup:
 
From reading the responses, it looks like not many have actually been around the homeless.
For the most part, they are dysfunctional, alcoholic, drug users, with a dedication to NOT participating in normal society.
They don't have quality gear, don't much care about quality gear, and are very transient.
They steal from each other, brutalize each other, and get by with theft, vandalism, and by begging. They hang out around the places that local governments provide services.
They are parasites.
 
Great thread, I must add rather progressive for this place (Edit - except for Mannlicher - who is clearly a self-righteous prig with no compassion - Karma buddy, karma). It easy to dehumanize others in different circumstances from yourself. Heck, I remember one time I had a first class airline ticket. I didn't even buy the thing, as I never would, but it was given to me through work circumstances. Its amazing, how sitting around in the little lounge you suddenly get the feeling of how much better you are than the poor SOBs (who I really belong to) are outside. Same goes for folks in our community when they aren't part of the 'landowners club'.

I really like the comments provided by the OP, but Capt'l punishment's experiences were also helpful. Seems like CP's strategy was one of LNT-attitude, i.e. not catering to societies' stereotypes of homelessness and by offering services for food etc., he was actually providing a camouflage of his situation to the community or at least those interacting with him.

Mist's comments about cache your belongings apart from where you sleep, whether that be in outdoors or a communal shelter, also seems like a gem piece of advice even though I think to many of us that seems unintuitive. I guess it all depends on the probability of getting harassed etc.
 
There's a lot of levels of being "homeless."

I'm thinking about this and trying to see what other input I have.

Regarding the Seattle area- there's a lot of bush vets up there. I did that for a few months getting my head straight, too. Some guys make a really, really long term thing out of it. But, generally, you won't see their camps from the freeway.

What is homeless? I spent 3 months (waiting for a house we had signed a lease on) living with wife and at the time one kiddo in a 24 foot RV. Outbacking- no campgrounds (which cost more than a hotel anyway) or hookups. I've also lived out of a car on more than one occasion, a few times when travelling for months. (man, a little nissan is not the machine for that. Even a small station wagon can be rigged for full sleep posture, but not a 2 door anything)

not all "homeless" people - whatever level the word means- are unemployed, and far from all are unemployable. I've seen people from the SE and other deep woods parts of the country come into towns I've lived in and just camp for a few weeks while getting jobs and rent together- that includes families. The attitude from some places seems to be that it's just what you do until you get settled. Like living in a tent while you get the first outbuilding up when homesteading.

The vast majority of "real" homeless people I've known who are obvious about it have major issues. I don't trust them, let them know where I live, and have limited patience for the litany of complaints. The complaints and the lack of basic basic hygeine, like wiping your beard off after eating a chilidog- those are key ins for me.

On the plus side, I've known a lot of road children, travellers, and wanderers, and "settled homeless"- squatters- who were quite decent people with a different frame of reference.

One guy passed through Davis back when I was volunteering at the co op. He had a pack, a bible, and wouldn't eat "neutered fruit" because it was wrong to not care for the earth. He was a bit wild to talk to, but we shared some meals and he was basically walking until he found where he figured God wanted him to be. He didn't worry so much about kit, he had some stuff, but didn't overdo it, didn't have half of what we'd put on a list.
 
Interesting notes about urban survival aside, the documentation (without consent) seems somewhat invasive.
 
Iboschi said:
Interesting notes about urban survival aside, the documentation (without consent) seems somewhat invasive.
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Invasive? Reread the OP again. The former owner of the items considered them "disposable" and had left the state, leaving his garbage and tent, etc. behind. As the OP was asked by a relative to retrieve a few minor pieces of kit for her, not the whole shebang, the rest was obviously intended to be abandoned. The person in the example was not camping on his own land, but squatting briefly on land he didn't own. OP purposely did not mention the subject's name, age, forwarding address or SS#. I fail to see how showing us his pictures and starting a very valid discussion on urban survival using them as an example is 'invasive' or the person who abandoned the things shown in the photographs.

And to the subject of mental problems/addictions and the homeless, often if is difficult to tell cause from effect. Not all people with "issues" are homeless, and not all homeless have "issues".
 
Great thread, Brian. I have really enjoyed reading what you wrote and what the others here have said too.


Bryan
 
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