W2

[Don Hanson III]

Don, what difference did you find between the round bar and the square stuff? I still have a bunch of that along with a fair bit of round.

The round stock is higher quality, better hamon, cleaner.

 

[Don Hanson III]

I've determined, after working with W1 for about 15 years and W2 for 10, that it's all magic. I think the key, is making sure to hold your mouth just right.

That's some good stuff bubba!

 

[Willie71]

Thanks for that link. The part about the clay not being what determines the hamon makes sense to me now. Because the hamon I got on mine looks nothing like the clay that I put on the blade.

The clay might or might not define where the hamon is, but it's one variable amongst many. Temp, time, steel condition, type and thickness of clay, and quench medium and time all play a roll. Keep notes, and pay close attention to what you feel through the tongs during quench, especially if doing an interrupted quench.

 

[Shipshores]

http://i392.photobucket.com/albums/pp5/csalt09/DSCF4061_zpsodkqk0ln.jpg
Just finished this one and used clay on the blade and racasso. The handle had no clay. The most activity occurred on the handle were I had the tongs. I will definably be doing it differently and trying the no clay approach. Thanks

 

[Willie71]

I got part of one lip right on this one. I first tried for a hamon in 2012, and most of the knives I've done are differentials hardened.

[/url]image by Wjkrywko, on Flickr[/IMG]

[/url]image by Wjkrywko, on Flickr[/IMG]

This was using clay.

[/url]IMG_5926 by Wjkrywko, on Flickr[/IMG]

This was clayless

 

[jdm61]

So are you saying that you sold me a USPS bin full of bad steel? :grumpy: Any difference in the carbon content as far as you know?

The round stock is higher quality, better hamon, cleaner.

 

[Don Hanson III]

So are you saying that you sold me a USPS bin full of bad steel? :grumpy: Any difference in the carbon content as far as you know?

The sq stock was fabulous until I got the round... Then I systematically bought all the round I could afford, over 20,000 pounds.

Carbon seems about the same, I made some good knives with the sq & use a lot of it in damascus. But the round stock is special.

 

[Don Hanson III]

This W2 blade was from neither the sq or round stock, but from Old 1/4" x 1-1/4" flat bar. We like it.

 

[DevinT]

Wow, that's some serious banding, or did you forge and fold that stuff?

Hoss

 

[Don Hanson III]

Wow, that's some serious banding, or did you forge and fold that stuff?

Hoss

Devin, it's banding. Other W2 below with no banding.

 

[Shipshores]

Is the banding from that particular steel or is there a process to develop it?

 

[Don Hanson III]

Is the banding from that particular steel or is there a process to develop it?

The banding is from this particular steel, but it can be produced through heat cycles.
I used to know the particulars but have forgotten the process.

 

[samuraistuart]

You guys with more knowledge correct me if I'm wrong, but banding can be "broken up" by a solid normalizing heat. It can also be "caused" by excessive time at spheroidization temps, or too many cycles in that spheroidizing heat range.

 

[Don Hanson III]

You guys with more knowledge correct me if I'm wrong, but banding can be "broken up" by a solid normalizing heat. It can also be "caused" by excessive time at spheroidization temps, or too many cycles in that spheroidizing heat range.

One normalizing heat wont get rid of it, the blade above was forged & normalized 3-4 times.

Devin will have to answer the rest, he knows A lot more the I do.

 

[jdm61]

I still have two full bundles of the 3/4 and maybe the 7/8 round. I will eventually use some of that for straight razors and small knives. I am a little low on the 1 inch plus stuff as I used it a lot. still have a few bars of the 1 7/8, the biggest stuff that Don sold initially before he let go of some his secret stash of the really big stuff that he slices into little round cookies and forges into 12 into bowie blades!!!!!! I have though about using that big square stuff for "premium" damascus, but I still only have the small press to squish it down.

 

[samuraistuart]

I'd love to hear from Devin about the banding Don! Maybe he will chime in. In the meantime, may I offer the source of where I got the idea that normalizing should fix it?

"Virtually all the desirable properties we want are maximized through homogeneity, banding is the opposite of this and many a scam has be foisted on the public, or other knifemakers, by exploiting general ignorance on the topic. Normalizing corrects banding, one good soak above Accm will pretty much erase it. But excessive slow cooling or excessive cycling at lower temperatures will bring it back." - Kevin Cashen, Hypefreebladeforums, thread titled "Wootz like etch patterns in 52100".

 

[Don Hanson III]

Stuart, I don't always agree with stuff I read on the interwebs.

But yes, a good soak well above critical will erase it, then normalizing to fix the soak at high temp.

This is one case where I do not want to "correct banding".

 

[jdm61]

When I first saw that knife, I thought it was some of your high layer old school W2/iron damascus. So now you admit that you cheated?

 

[Don Hanson III]

When I first saw that knife, I thought it was some of your high layer old school W2/iron damascus. So now you admit that you cheated?

Workin smarter is better than cheated I think. It looks better than my high layer damascus and it a whole lot easier.

 

[DevinT]

Most banding comes from low temp forging and cycling. This stuff looks old. Banding is eliminated by forging above Accm usually.

Hoss