Warranty Issues

E

emerge411

Joined
Feb 6, 2008
Messages
33
Maybe it's just me but... but I am not happy with my first abet only Spyderco CS experience.

I collect and use knifes, mostly Spyderco and Benchmade since materials and fit and finish are important to me. I have had my faith is Spyderco shaken though. I recently received a brand new C11GPFG D4 w/ G-10 from the pharmacy. When I removed the D4 from the Spyderco bubble wrap and opened it the first time I noticed the lock bar does not sit flush with the scales when the knife is open (see pictures). It is noticeable enough that you can feel it with your thumb when you hold the knife and its very visible to the eye. I know this does not effect the function of the knife but I collect knifes (especially $100+ knifes) for form and function. Non of my other Spyderco lock backs have this issue (ZDP-D4, Mini-Persian, Caly3, Stretch II). So I decided I would send it back to Spyderco to see if they could repair or replace it. After a few quick pictures I replaced it back in its box and bubble wrap. I UPS'ed it back to Golden for $10+. After getting back from a business trip today a box from Golden was sitting on my desk. It contains my knife and a letter saying the knife is within QA tolerance levels and "Your knife blade does not look used but there are two marks on the handles and because the knife, in it's present condition cannot be re-sold as new, we will not be able to accommodate your request for an exchange." Two marks? The knife was out of the box for all of 20 minutes so I could take pictures of it's lock. It was handled on a clean office desk with clean hands... I have included pictures of both scales from all angles. It is now back in it's plastic sleeve in it's box waiting for me to figure out what to do with it. Any "mark" on the scales I think could have been caused during manufacture unless it takes place in one of intel's clean rooms. As some one that did consider himself a Spyderco enthusiast or at least one in the making I can't help but feel disappointed. I have now invested 110+ in this "new" knife. I don't think the pharmacy would have used my knife. I have yet to deal with anything but very prompt shipping from them, but Sypderco seems to be saying I was sold a used knife. Which I don't think is true. </vent>

Link to all images

Do you think am a crazy to feel this way? Out of 40+ knifes from several manufactures, this is the first time I have returned a knife and I don't feel like I was taken care of. The worst part, I really like this knifes design... a D4 built like a Caly with screws and a FFG.

-disappointed_in_ny
 
If you opened the box, took out the knife and weren't happy with what you saw, why didn't you return it to the people who sold it to you, along with a note asking them to select a better specimen for you? From what I have read about NGK, they would very likely have accommodated you.
 
yablanowitz said:
If you opened the box, took out the knife and weren't happy with what you saw, why didn't you return it to the people who sold it to you, along with a note asking them to select a better specimen for you? From what I have read about NGK, they would very likely have accommodated you.
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My thoughts exactly. I think that this is a situation where both parties are correct. I understand why emerge411 would want and indeed expect a more refined knife for his collection. Spyderco is correct in that some knives will fall in the outer parameters of manufacturing tolerance, yet still be deemed acceptable.

I am confident that NGK will set things right, as they have an excellent reputation.
 
I will try that route. I sent the knife to Spyderco not NGK because I had an issue with the knife itself. NGK had not sent the wrong knife and I didn't want a different style or a return I just want another sample, or my current one to be "fixed". I have not had to work with NGK CS but I hear its good and they have always shipped my orders quickly and correctly. The knife is new and in the exact condition I received so I still feel Sypderco should have exchanged it. I felt comfortable spending $100 or $200 on a knife made by Spyderco because I heard their CS was very good and would take care of me if I was not satisfied by their product. My experience might not be the norm but unfortunately for me its my only experience.
 
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Sometimes Sal's "shiny footprints" policy really annoys me. Suffice it to say, in my opinion, you are a victim of your own unreasonable expectations.
 
I feel your pain emerge. Some say its nit-picky, some say anal, but at that price you should receive a product that is free from little hic-cups like that.

I had the same experience as you. You feel let down by a big company who you have supported for a long time. And like they told you, they told me "I" did the damage to the knife, in this case your scratches, my case the debris on the G10 around the pivot.

In a case like your word against theirs, whatever they choose to do, weather right or wrong, is the end of it. I wonder if most buyers, either collectors or users, find little problems with their new Spydercos and just accept it? Or do they send it in only to be told what we have or do they get their replacement?

Their CS has a stellar record, maybe we just had the unfortunate luck of catching them on a bad day.

Dave
 
Exactly people collect for different reasons. The D4-G10 was going to be in my edc rotation with the Caly3, Stretch II, and BM440 which are a great examples of a quality knife. I recently gave a Caly3 as a gift as I think its the defacto choice for EDC. I have many spyderco's this is the only one that has an issue that really bothers me. Every person will have a different opinion. The forums should be an open place to share your experience good or bad. I have expressed many good options of spyderco's products and still hold the view that they manufacture innovative knifes of very good quality. If NGK is a dead end I think will take her apart and see if I can sand down the part of the lock bar that protrudes from the scales. I'll take pic's if I do for any one interested in the insides of a D4-G10.
 
I'm not sure how I feel yet about Spyderco CS rejecting your claim. Their remarks about the handle, at least based on your photos, could be seen as petty. Besides, if there was an actual issue with the knife, their ability to resell it should have absolutely nothing to do with their willingness to honor their warranty. Additionally, the lockbar was the issue, which they seemed to be trying to divert attention away from, plus they have enough Foliage Green G10 to sink a battleship with. Did I mention the word petty?

That said, their claim that the lockbar issue is within their QA standards definitely seems to be true...I'm holding a D4 in ZDP-189 in my hand right now with exactly the same characteristic...not really an issue for me...it's better that it sit a little high initially to allow for wear, and I suspect it will drop down with use.

In the future I would suggest, if you did not do so this time, that you speak with Customer Service over the phone or via e-mail prior to sending any knife in. Describe the problem and circumstances in detail and get as much of an idea ahead of time as possible as to whether or not the situation in their opinion even warrants a repair or replacement.

And I would still check with New Graham on their willingness to do an exchange...

Ray :)
 
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411, I think you were correct in sending the knife to Spyderco first. That is where it will end up anyway. Just a more direct path most of the time.
I assure you the knife was not "used" here at the store. The lock-up in you picture is not that uncommon in Spyderco or other brands. (understand, I have looked at tens of thousands of knives in my tender years). But all that said, if you're not happy, we're not happy. Send her back...we'll see if we got something better.
md
 
I have a few Spyderco knives and have been very pleased with them all. I have gotten most of them on that auction site
( I'm really fond of Spyderco Spurs) but I know what dealer to buy current production knives from now. :thumbup:
 
Michael, thanks for the offer I will be in touch. That focus on customer satisfaction will continue to get NGK the patronage of me and I am sure many others.
 
You did exactly what I would have done. I would have returned it to the manufacturer.

If this had happened to me, I would also be very disappointed in the manufacturer. This seems contrary to other stories that I have read regarding their service. Maybe, they are beginning a new direction? I don't know. It seems disappointing to me.

My faith in New Graham is confirmed. You can't argue with a quick response to your post from Michael-bug thumbs up for them! That is why I go to them first.

I hope that this is not indicative of a new level of customer service to be expected from Spyderco. Maybe, you got a new customer service person?
 
I'm surprised to hear how you were treated by Spyderco. They wouldn't (or didn't want to) deal with it, and Mike steps up for you. Good PR for him, bad PR for Spyderco. But really, it shouldn't have to be up to Mike to make it right, but he is. He's definitely the best!

In this case, NGK CS > Spyderco CS.
 
yablanowitz said:
If you opened the box, took out the knife and weren't happy with what you saw, why didn't you return it to the people who sold it to you, along with a note asking them to select a better specimen for you? From what I have read about NGK, they would very likely have accommodated you.
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As for my experience with similar issue: I bought a BM 440 from NGK and it had some flaws - first I contacted NGK and they reply was "the uneven grinds are something we see in many production knives including Benchmades, I looked at several of the opportunist we have in stock and none of them were ground exactly the same".

However when I contacted the Benchmade company, they told me to send it in for warranty replacement and they even refunded me shipping costs.
 
SPXTrader said:
I'm surprised to hear how you were treated by Spyderco. They wouldn't (or didn't want to) deal with it, and Mike steps up for you. But really, it shouldn't have to be up to Mike to make it right, but he is.
In this case, NGK CS > Spyderco CS.
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Right on SPX..... Could not have said it better.... If i got that D4 and i was going to use it... It would bug the hell out of me... and i would have also sent it to Spyderco myself....
Although Spyderco has always been great to me.... Im a bit upset at the situation.... It is and should be covered by warranty.. It is a manufacturing defect ( even if its within the tolerance of QC Dpt..... Even if it happened or stayed like that with months of use... They should have still honored it... I know.. Both Benchmade and Kershaw have done that for me no matter how used my knife was.... But then again... They also did the same " Its just fine" deal with many people... but for minor things..... Any major issues they take care of.. even by sending me new liner locks to put on my knife.....

Its really a shame... Good luck with you knife...

But it is threads like these... that give companies a hint... And usually they make it good... But even benchmade, kershaw and CRK have often sent knives back to people saying it is "normal" or "ok".... But when it has to do with the locking mechanism.. It should be a free fix for sure...
 
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I personally think you're being too anal and nitpicky about your Delica. I understand your disappointment as a collector in not receiving a perfect example. But I think your expectations might be unreasonable. After all, it's a $50 working knife.

OK, I just noticed that it's not the $50 FRN handled Delica, but a special G10 run costing $100. I wasn't aware of these until now.

While I'm still of the opinion that Spyderco makes working knives that are first and foremost intended to be used, many sprint runs like this knife are done at the request of fans (collectors as well as users), and I'm certain they're aware that some knives will never be used and kept in perfect condition.

But I can't disagree with Spyderco in their assessment; the handle marks, to them when you sent it back, probably looked like user wear. As for the lock bar, if it works, then it's fine.

Even with their higher-end knives, Spyderco can't be expected to produce a 100% cosmetically flawless example 100% of the time. There will always be some roughness inside the SpyderHole. Some machine marks can't be erased. On the higher-end Spydercos I've owned, I've seen the occasional line in the satin finish that's just a little too deep (ditto Benchmades), or some other tiny flaw that doesn't at all affect the function; and while given the chance to pick and choose I'd like to have the perfect example myself, I can't expect to receive one every time.

Spyderco can't do this themselves. There will always have to be some degree of acceptable variance. Either that, or the price triples, and they have a sidewalk sale for seconds every weekend. There's a reason Sebenzas and Mnandis cost so much. Hand finishing and hand picking give you a perfect example each time. Production numbers are also far lower for CR than Spyderco.

In my personal opinion, if I wanted to buy a Spyderco purely for collecting, I would expect and accept that I might not receive the perfect specimen. If I wanted only the perfect specimen, or at least the closest I could find to it, I would expect and accept that I might have to purchase several copies, pick the best, and sell the rest.
 
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Maybe it's just me but... but I am not happy with my first abet only Spyderco CS experience.
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It's not just you... LOL... I wouldn't doubt if all the employees of spyderco get on the forums just to spam the "praise spyderco customer service" threads... ;)
of course, "pobody's nerfect"- but I don't believe spyderco was indeed "extending our best effort to conduct business in a proper manner" LOL... I, for one, will continue to say their customer service SUCKS
 
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