What can you fairly expect a knife to do?

I'm not surprised at all by the response. Admitting that the HT was faulty on the knife in question would also mean that a bunch of other knives are faulty, since they're HT'd in batches. They wouldn't want news of that to get out.
Mike Stewart's even more of a scumbag than Tony Marfione. This isn't the first time he's done something like this, and he's done worse, too. A quick google search of his name will pull up a bunch more, but here's a few of the worst:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...k-Jack-knives-I-could-not-talk-about-til-now-)

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/585934-Bark-River-has-taken-16-000-of-My-Money

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/687173-Whats-the-truth-about-the-Bravo-1
 
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Dan57 said:
I'm not surprised at all by the response. Admitting that the HT was faulty on the knife in question would also mean that a bunch of other knives are faulty, since they're HT'd in batches. They wouldn't want news of that to get out.
Mike Stewart's even more of a scumbag than Tony Marfione. This isn't the first time he's done something like this, and he's done worse, too. A quick google search of his name will pull up a bunch more, but here's a few of the worst:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...k-Jack-knives-I-could-not-talk-about-til-now-)

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/585934-Bark-River-has-taken-16-000-of-My-Money

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/687173-Whats-the-truth-about-the-Bravo-1
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Wow. Just wow.
 
Any outdoors type knife should hold up to chopping and splitting provided you use common sense. Some companies are better than others as far as warranty goes, ESEE are excellent, Cold Steel not so much. Anyone who tries to tell you that you shouldn't be chopping and splitting with a CS trailmaster is an idiot. As far as the Bark River knife goes, I am somewhat surprised at both the failure and the response from the company considering their reputation. It will certainly make me think twice about spending the significant amount of money they ask for on their products. Also there is no reason why the knife should have failed considering what you were doing, even if you were using 'improper technique'.
 
Moses2792796 said:
Any outdoors type knife should hold up to chopping and splitting provided you use common sense. Some companies are better than others as far as warranty goes, ESEE are excellent, Cold Steel not so much. Anyone who tries to tell you that you shouldn't be chopping and splitting with a CS trailmaster is an idiot.
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I'm pretty sure it was Lynn Thompson. If it wasn't, it was one of the people who work for him. The statement was made in a YouTube reply to a post about a Trailmaster failing.

As far as the Bark River knife goes, I am somewhat surprised at both the failure and the response from the company considering their reputation. It will certainly make me think twice about spending the significant amount of money they ask for on their products.
Click to expand...

Yeah. I almost bought either a Rogue River or a Golok from them just a few months ago - now I'm really glad that I didn't.

Especially after finding this:

http://www.cliffstamp.com/knives/forum/read.php?3,814,page=1

CKC (quite a hot custom knife maker, based in New Zealand)

I was talking to Cliff today about how my knives from them were crap and I wish I had one to test under the microscope..

Then it hit me that I had 2 brand new unused 12c27 Escort Boot knives from BRK that are the same size, thickness and geometry (roughly) as my knife i used in my geometry videos over the last week.
I told cliff I'd test it..
It is far far worse than I even thought..


I tested, and it failed terribly after about 1 minute of cardboard cutting.. the equivalent of what Ankerson does on 1 small to medium cardboard box.

so i sharpened it and did it again..
Click to expand...


And

On a humorous side note..
I looked carefully at the micarta handle scales that fell off and was quite astonished.. the glue is impregnated with metal dust, bits of human hair, and dir.t

I am guessing that they lined them up in a row on a table and sprayed them all with adhesive, and then waited to fit them. all the while having dust and rubbish blowing around
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Not great for making a maximum strength bond. And also - just yuck. It's not like I lick my knife handles, or even that I don't get them dirty, but having dirt and someone else's hair permanently bonded there just seems disgusting.
 
Also: if Bark River isn't going to warranty a damn survival knife for chopping twigs, then shouldn't they tell people this? Shouldn't it be on their website and in a manual that comes with their knives???

And ditto for Cold Steel and batonning.
 
If chopping with a 4" knife designed for cutting is your idea of proper technique, I suggest your technique is flawed.

Batoning with a small blade is the proper technique, of course many of you think that's no way to treat a knife.

Also, when it comes to the Bark River warranty, the poster in that original KnifeForums thread is told within two follow-up post to send it to have it taken care of.

Some folks here really don't care much about the truth, but love to continue repeating each others internet opinions.


If you don't like Bark River fine, don't buy there products; simple enough.


I've never seen a Forum where hate and BS is allowed to run unabated.


I don't care what brands you like, the fans boys rule on this Forum, and the mods let them spread opinion like it's the truth.


Trust what you know and what you've experienced, take everything else with a healthy dose of skepticism.


JMHO, YMMV.




Big Mike
 
Big Mike said:
If chopping with a 4" knife designed for cutting is your idea of proper technique, I suggest your technique is flawed.

Batoning with a small blade is the proper technique, of course many of you think that's no way to treat a knife.

Also, when it comes to the Bark River warranty, the poster in that original KnifeForums thread is told within two follow-up post to send it to have it taken care of.

Some folks here really don't care much the about truth, but love to continue repeating each others internet opinions.
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I have to agree with these parts of your post.

Except that it isn't just here---or even just on the internet---where truth is less accepted than opinion.;)
 
Big Mike said:
If chopping with a 4" knife designed for cutting is your idea of proper technique, I suggest your technique is flawed.

Batoning with a small blade is the proper technique, of course many of you think that's no way to treat a knife.

Also, when it comes to the Bark River warranty, the poster in that original KnifeForums thread is told within two follow-up post to send it to have it taken care of.

Some folks here really don't care much about the truth, but love to continue repeating each others internet opinions.


If you don't like Bark River fine, don't buy there products; simple enough.


I've never seen a Forum where hate and BS is allowed to run unabated.


I don't care what brands you like, the fans boys rule on this Forum, and the mods let them spread opinion like it's the truth.


Trust what you know and what you've experienced, take everything else with a healthy dose of skepticism.


JMHO, YMMV.




Big Mike
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Except that knife would have suffered pretty much the same damage or worse of the owner would have battened with it taking into count the damage and what it looked like.

The edge would have fallen apart anyway.

I personally could care less about BRK one way or the other or MS for that matter...

Just going by the damage of that blade.
 
Big Mike said:
If chopping with a 4" knife designed for cutting is your idea of proper technique, I suggest your technique is flawed.

Batoning with a small blade is the proper technique, of course many of you think that's no way to treat a knife.

Also, when it comes to the Bark River warranty, the poster in that original KnifeForums thread is told within two follow-up post to send it to have it taken care of.

Some folks here really don't care much about the truth, but love to continue repeating each others internet opinions.

If you don't like Bark River fine, don't buy there products; simple enough.

I've never seen a Forum where hate and BS is allowed to run unabated.

I don't care what brands you like, the fans boys rule on this Forum, and the mods let them spread opinion like it's the truth.

Trust what you know and what you've experienced, take everything else with a healthy dose of skepticism.

JMHO, YMMV.

Big Mike
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Lol, cute. :rolleyes: Feel better now, "Big Mike"? If childish ranting like this what I can expect Bark River's response to be when I have concerns, I will most certainly take my money elsewhere. ;) :barf:
 
Dorito Monk said:
If childish ranting like this what I can expect Bark River's response to be when I have concerns, I will most certainly take my money elsewhere. ;) :barf:
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Why would what someone on an internet forum says who doesn't represent the company affect your buying habits?:confused:
 
stabman said:
Why would what someone on an internet forum says who doesn't represent the company affect your buying habits?:confused:
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I'm sorry, I may have made a total boob of myself - the way Big Mike so adamantly defended Bark River, and dismissed any contrary evidence or opinions as 'Fans Boys' or 'BS', I assumed that he must be in their employ. :confused: If that isn't the case, I retract my statement - Big Mike's whining won't be what keeps me from buying Bark River.
 
Big Mike said:
Also, when it comes to the Bark River warranty, the poster in that original KnifeForums thread is told within two follow-up post to send it to have it taken care of.

Big Mike
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Well he didn't say he'd "take care of it". He said he'd grind it out, that it would be a little smaller but still ok. Would you be happy with that if it were your knife?

If they blew the HT, which unless the OP was lying seems the only explanation, then re-grinding the knife isn't going to solve anything. He's just going to have a seven tenths Bravo1 with damage-prone steel.

And in the same post you mention, the OP is basically accused of hammering bones with it, before any explanation for the damage was given. So from the start the tone is set that the damage is the fault of the user. With that established, now grinding half the blade away seems like a great deal for the customer. When really, what the discussion should center around is a steel fault with the knife, due to the sheer extent of the rolls. If that is allowed to enter the conversation as a possible cause, then it would be obvious that re-grinding the blade is not going to fix the issue. That's what I find interesting, the mentality, and how its shared even by the customers it affects.
 
It seems we got folks here who can test hardness using internet photos. :eek:


I doubt HT was a factor, Bark River just grinds their knives thin.


I beat on knives for a living and a passion, and have done similar damage myself.

Re-profiling the edge to a thicker edge spine always solved the problems, and I always went back to re-rest them harder then before, if it was HT it would be obvious.


Bark River sells 30,000 or more knives year to people who know how to use quality cutting tools, it's the fine cutting edge that sets them apart.



A few ham-fisted crybabies damage a few edges and the sky is apparently falling.


Bark River has more orders then it has time to make knives, their knives work for their main customer base, I doubt their too worried about the few who prefer an obtuse edge.


And, just for the record, I use and have tested many Bark River Knives, but I have never worked for the company in any position or manor.




Big Mike
 
Big Mike said:
Bark River sells 30,000 or more knives year to people who know how to use quality cutting tools, it's the fine cutting edge that sets them apart.
Click to expand...

Here's a YouTube video where someone tries to SLICE A CHOPSTICK and a BKRT's edge chips...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4ss8NtqEkw

Saying that this problem is because BKRT grinds thin edges is utter, complete rubbish. Yes, a thicker edge might help - but you shouldn't need a thick edge to cut a twig or a chopstick! You can slice a chopstick with a razor blade, for goodness sake!
 
Big Mike said:
If chopping with a 4" knife designed for cutting is your idea of proper technique, I suggest your technique is flawed.
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Then you obviously don't know anything about "proper technique."

- This is a survival knife, not a scalpel

- If you want to cut thin willow branches to make a shelter, then chopping them is the only really effective way; you can't baton them because they're too flexible - the idea is ridiculous, Mr Self Proclaimed Expert.

I have a $25 Bahco Wrecking Knife made of the same steel that a of of the defective BKRTs are and I've sharpened it as a zero-grind Scandi. It has no problem chopping branches! (In fact it would probably made a damn good surival knife - it's 4 inches of 4mm 12c27, correctlt heat treated.)

Now let's look at the claimed reason for the knife failure again:


When chopping small sticks the edge bites the wood before it starts to bend from the impact much like grabbing the fine edge and twisting.

Larger sticks that require "chopping" aren't moved by the chopping energy so the edge isn't being torqued.

This is why you don't "chop" things that require only one or two chops.

Excuse me? How would this alter if the blade was longer? It wouldn't! All the would happen is that longer blades would be destroyed by even bigger branches! If "Big Mike" had ever used a machete for a day then he'd have made hundreds of one-chop cuts. And if he argues that a machete edge isn't fine enough, well, leukus are kept very fine, and a lot of the cutting done with them traditionally is of thing branches. What he says isn't just nonsense it's OBVIOUS nonsense.
 
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meanwhile said:
This is a survival knife, not a scalpel
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Wrong. :thumbdn: :( :thumbdn:


Study the history to discover the Bravo-1 is a hunting knife modified to meet the needs of a small group of Force Recon Marines.

They required a GP/Utility knife to handle cutting chores, not a "survival" knife.



The knife has become Bark River's biggest seller because America's knife user's like a knife that cuts; sharpened pry-bars are all to common in the knife world, when in reality other tools are better suited for such tasks.

Somehow some fools think the Bravo-1 is designed to cut concrete blocks and car hoods; get a clue, it's meant to slice the things that need a sharp edge for cutting.



Big Mike
 
Big Mike said:
Study the history to discover the Bravo-1 is a hunting knife modified to meet the needs of a small group of Force Recon Marines.

They required a GP/Utility knife to handle cutting chores, not a "survival" knife.

The knife has become Bark River's biggest seller because America's knife user's like a knife that cuts; sharpened pry-bars are all to common in the knife world, when in reality other tools are better suited for such tasks.

Somehow some fools think the Bravo-1 is designed to cut concrete blocks and car hoods; get a clue, it's meant to slice the things that need a sharp edge for cutting.
Click to expand...

Or, much more likely, it's become their biggest seller because they released some vague story about it being designed for armed forces use and issued to elite warriors, and America's knife buyers will buy literally anything if someone claims it has a connection to an armed forces branch (whether it actually has any connection to said forces or not). :rolleyes:

You could sell goddamn knitting needles by the thousands in the U.S. if you falsified some vague story about them being used by 'a small group of DEVGRU operators'. :eek:

Just ask Mick Strider. ;)
 
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