What do you think of the Camillus talonite EDC? (pros and cons please)

Wire,

Afraid I'm not much good at singing. I have a Carson Model 4 in Talonite with carbon fiber scales. I'm afraid it's not quite up to my regular Mod. 4 in ATS34 with G10 scales, although it certainly is a pretty piece for the collection. My Mod. 4 Talonite is my first and only Talonite blade blade and it may be my last.

Sorry to cut this discussion short - I can see the surging herd stampeding for the S30V versions of just about everything heading this way and I don't want to get trampled! :D
 
The only advantage I see to the 154CM or D2 versions, over Talonite, is when you’re push cutting very thin materials like newspaper. Talonite doesn’t seem to get “scary scalpel sharp” like the stainless steels. Actually it does, but it takes a lot of work and loses it quickly. But do we really need scary scalpel sharp? Nope. That’s just a plaything with little real-world meaning, IMHO. If we were talking Talonite straight razors, I might feel differently.

As for S30V, I’ll hold my breath. I don’t really need another “impossible to resharpen” steel. I’ve had enough of that with my 440V. The person who can field sharpen 440V is a much better man than me. I want something that takes a good edge, and gets it back instantaneously.

It is true that Talonite isn’t a pry bar steel. Then again, I don’t pry rocks with my small knives. I have big steel knives for that kind of stuff. This is meaningless though, as you could never do any substantial amount of prying with a knife as small as an EDC.

I’ve found that Talonite takes a pretty good edge and holds it fairly well. Not like 154CM or BG-42, but pretty well. It does slice fibrous materials long after the edge has dulled, which is a great EDC feature. Nobody wants his or her knife to completely run out of gas in the middle of the afternoon. So you’re cutting cardboard and the Talonite runs out of gas. You just strop it back with a piece of that cardboard you’re cutting.

And it’s completely stainless. That’s a biggie for me. The biggest advantage though is in the sharpening. You just strop it a little. No removal of actual blade material is required. It’s kind of like a good carbon steel in this respect.

Sure Talonite has trade-offs, if you’re a person who likes to sharpen his knives all night long, and then cut silk and newsprint. But if you actually cut normal stuff all day long, and don’t want to mess with the knife all night, Talonite is a wonderful thing. :)
 
Originally posted by Blade Santa Cruz
What a Deal!! You can get a 154CM version of the EDC for about $50, or you can get a Talonite blade which is about half as strong (check tensile strength which translates roughtly to flexural strength which correlates to its ability to take abuse when prying, twisting, and doing all those things we should never do with a knife but end up doing frequently with an EDC). A few claim the Talonite holds an edge longer, but that's open to question, particularly when compared to 154CM, which takes a better edge in the first place. ....
...
... And finally, I can get ALL(?) those advantages of Talonite at only FOUR TIMES the cost of the 154CM-bladed version!! The only real draw-back I see is having defend my decision to pay that premium for the latest buzz-word in blade materials and not look too foolish in the process.
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"...and not look too foolish in the process." OOooops, too late. ;)

{edited to remove all my drivel, except for the part above, which now must refer to me. :rolleyes: I have to admit, though, that I am very surprised at your dissatisfaction with Talonite, BSC. And I still say that it takes a much better edge than any of the ATS-34 or 154CM that I have experience with, and that includes a couple of good customs. Maybe the edge that 154ATS takes feels sharper, but if I cut anything that has fibers in it like soft wood (balsa) or cloth, it finishes up with a bunch of those fibers hanging on the edge, that it didn't cut through but just dragged along with it. I have experienced that numerous times with many examples of 154ATS, but never with Talonite (or carbon steels, or 420HC, 440C, and so on). And it still cuts cleanly long after any other knife has gone to butter. ;) }
 
Buzz, S30v is hard to sharpen??? Save your opinions/guess until you try it. I just love all these exsperts who know everything .
 
You're correct. Sorry. I shouldn't base my opinions on rumor. Maybe my Seb will come back from Chris Reeve this month with an S30V blade, and I'll be able to get some experiential input on the new steel.
 
Ok gang,
A few comments from my perspective on the EDC/TALONITE/other steels....

Which is better, the TALONITE EDC, or one of the premium steel bladed version? Guys, that question is loaded with so many variables, its no wonder you have gotten so many different opinions. My opinion, yup, for MY uses, its ALOT better.

UglyJim,
I hear you about the blade-finish on the TALONITE. We have been striving to improve it, but its really simple, this stuff is very difficult to work with. We ARE getting better at it, but unfortunately, that doesn't help your knife...its IS part of CAMILLUS constantly improving what we do.

On the subject of "beefing up" the frame....trust me, the .10" fully heat treated 420 stainless frames are MORE than strong enough for a folder in this size class. The blade[on either the TALONITE or the steel bladed version] would break/fail long before the frames. Guys, this is a 2.95" bladed folder, not a BK&T TACTOOL:rolleyes: The knife is the EVERY DAY CARRY...its designed to be easy to carry, and provide cutting power and strenght/durability for everyday use.

I have seen ALOT more problems with custom Ti framelocks than I have with the steel framed production EDC's. Thats no slam against custom makers, its just that Ti is weaker than heat treated steel, and it wears faster...period. If you would rather see a thicker handle[set of frames] for ergonomic/comfort's sake, thats fine. But don't think you need thicker frames to have enough strenght.

RockSpyder,
I've tested the flipper option on an EDC...and for some ergonomic reason, it really didn't work out that well on that size knife. You just couldn't get enough "oomph" out of the flipper action to get the blade on around. On the big CUDA MAXX 5.5, thats not a problem...

;) SNAP!

Blade Santa Cruz,
Sorry that you have not been happy with TALONITE. We have tested TALONITE in identical knives, and found its edge holding to be VASTLY superior to most commonly used production knife steels, with special attention paid to ATS34/154CM, when cutting common materials that folders and smaller belt knives tackle. It is ESPECIALLY good on flesh, making with out a doubt, the BEST skinning knife blade material I have ever used. It also, as BUZZBAIT points out, very good on everyday materials like cardboard, in my experience. I also find that using nothing more than a Spyderco Sharpmaker and a leather strop, it gets fully as "scary sharp" as any ATS34/154CM blade I own. And it gets sharper ALOT easier in my experience. It does not, however get as sharp as A2, but I'm not sure I have found any common[or even relatively common] blade material that does.

But believe me, I fully understand that different knife users have different qualities that they look for, and certainly have different needs. I'm with you that the EDC/154cm is a "better buy", but IF you like TALONITE, the EDC/TALONITE is a GREAT BUY. If you want to get rid of the CARSON M4 with TALONITE blade, lemme know....
;)

Buzzbait,
GLad you are enjoying your MiniTalon, and I think you will really like the TALONITE EDC. Concerning S30V, I've been testing a SIMONICH RAVEN in S30V for a couple of weeks, and I don't find it NEARLY as hard to sharpen as either 440V or 420V. I think, it may even be easier to sharpen than 154CM, but I will need similar blades out of both materials really be able to open my big mouth about that one:rolleyes:

So far, S30V is looking pretty good. But we have ALOT of testing to do first, so don't ya'll get carried away with requests. Let me state for the record, we have NO PLANS for any S30V knives at this time. Nor will be be looking at any new blade materials for awhile....heck, we just started with Curcible's AIRDI-150 D2 and 154CM.:D

Thanks for the interest everybody....and IMHO ...TALONITE RULZ!
 
I've tested the flipper option on an EDC...and for some ergonomic reason, it really didn't work out that well on that size knife. You just couldn't get enough "oomph" out of the flipper action to get the blade on around.
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Oh well. I guess Camillus will just have to make a larger sized version of the EDC to incorporate a flipper. :) :D :)

And Will.... Boy do I hope that you're right about S30V!!!!
 
I'll take a piece of what Will Fennell says! I love the taloninte knives I have gotten from Will and company....Talon, Mini-Talon, & EDC.

If they make a bigger EDC in talonite then I will get that one too!

YES,YES,YES I am sold on talonite!
For the big and rough stuff I have all but one of the models of BK&T's that will take all the beating that I am able to dish out.

:rolleyes:
 
Just received a Camillus Talonite EDC. I always begin with the paper test and it slices paper cleaner than anything. Then moved up to cardboard and it did a better job than most. That about does it for now, but it may be safe to say that this one'll live in my right front pocket for many years to come.
 
Thank you, this is the most intelligent discussion of Talonite I recall seeing in a long time. There are some very intelligent comments about edge shape, sharpening and cutting ability where people recognize that the relationship is different when the materials are different.

When we developed Talonite and started working with Rob Simonich and later Will Fennell of Camillus we all agreed that the only thing that counted was how well knife users liked it. This means it is all personal. We did a lot of lab tests but we decided that we were not making knives for testing but for using. (The differences can be subtle but tremendously important.)

We are very pleased at how many knife users really like it. In all honesty a big part of that is that some truly excellent knife designers have worked with it and Camillus has done a huge amount of excellent work to use it in production.

Personally I get a thrill maybe once a day when I realize how good my Tom Mayo Talonite TNT cuts. (Admittedly I'm prejudiced.) I haven't used a Talonite Camillus EDC yet because I keep giving them away. I bought five but never got past the stage where I just looked at them. The one that was supposed to be mine went to the great Oregon knife folks for a prize at the Eugene show.

Anyway, it is really nice to read reviews by intelligent people who show a great deal of respect for different opinions.

2. Dear UglyJim, We haven't figured out how to get a high polish on Talonite. We are working on it but haven't got it yet.

tom
 
I'm with ya, Will. I had a pretty good idea that you guys wouldn't have put the EDC series into production if you had doubts about the structural integrity of the frame. Overbuilt stuff is just my style, that's all. Thanks for your response, and time spent explaining. This has been a productive post all the way around...

By the way, you guys giving out any free samples of those DDR-designed Cuda Maxx's? That is without a doubt my most anticipated production release of the new year. Good form, man, jolly good form.

:)

Professor.
 
I'm gettin' here kindof late, but I'm with Geoff in Philly: Who's cutting stuf harder than citrus/meat/cardboard? Any wood butchers out there? How's this stuff suppose to work on rope, poly, plywood:barf: , hardwood, insulation, etc?

Just curious--would give me a reason to throw away my D2 and 52100 blades and start over:D

Barry H
 
Think I'll drop by and see ol TomWalz next time I run up Seattle way. Keeps givin' em away eh? We'll test that theory alrighty. ;)
 
Originally posted by Barry H
I'm gettin' here kindof late, but I'm with Geoff in Philly: Who's cutting stuf harder than citrus/meat/cardboard? Any wood butchers out there? How's this stuff suppose to work on rope, poly, plywood:barf: , hardwood, insulation, etc?
Just curious--would give me a reason to throw away my D2 and 52100 blades and start over:D
Click to expand...

I've used mine in the yard cutting and trimming branches. Various trimming of other soft woods (pine sticks, etc.). Works great. But I certainly wouldn't start throwing away D2 and 52100 blades. They are going to cut just as good, for probalby just as long, or nearly so. But, the Talonite will do it while remaining totally unstained.
 
Talonite is fairly soft isn't it? Seems like the carbides are very hard but the rest is fairly soft. Would this give the edge a tendency to roll or deform?
 
I think Talonite comes in at about 47-48 Rockwell. From everything I've heard, you will roll an edge faster when cutting into hard materials, but on the upside, edge chipping is almost "nil" and restoring the edge is very easy and quick. This material is still in it's infancy. Time will tell. Apparently, it will cut flesh almost indefinitely.

That said, I love mine. It's become a true EDC and even sees a bunch of use around the kitchen.
 
Originally posted by shootist16
Talonite is fairly soft isn't it? Seems like the carbides are very hard but the rest is fairly soft. Would this give the edge a tendency to roll or deform?
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I've yet to roll the edge on either my Talon or EDC, but that's not to say it can't happen. Just that I haven't babied either of them, and haven't seen a problem. I do know that ... um... Penguin (IIRC?) dropped his Talon onto the concrete one day and suffered some edge damage. If anyone is interested, they could probalby look up his profile, email him, and get him to weigh in here. Whatever the specifics were, I do know that the same person has LOADS of Talonite knives (well, many, at least), so it's pretty obvious that he likes the stuff.
 
This probly doesn't help, but here goes. I think Talonite is great stuff. I also have not babyed mine, and have not had any rolling of the edge. However I have had it chip out. Small chipps and have no idea how it happened.
 
got to disagree with you there professor, on the rinky dinky sound of the lock engaging

compare that with the axis lock, and it sounds so much more secure, at first my EDC had a nice thunk when it engaged, now its more like what you described, too many openings and closings.

but it beats the little 'click' of the axis lock, that knife doesnt feel secure when you open it. heh, one of hte springs just broke two weeks ago

but i love the edc, solid little knife, great cutter, and very nice looking. camillus did a great job on mine

Daniel
 
I'm eating my words on one comment about Talonite (chew, chew, chew). The comment I made had to do with Talonite not taking that scary-scalpel-sharp edge, based on my experience with the Mini-Talon. I got my Camillus Talonite EDC, and it takes an absolutely wicked edge!!! Very, very sharp. And that was with a 40 degree SharpMaker angle. I shudder to think what kind of edge I'd get at 30 degrees!!! :eek:

Oh yah. I had the chance to test Talonite out on some soft white cedar and hard cherry wood this weekend. The Talonite cut beautifully. Excellent performance. The recurve on the EDC wasn’t exactly optimal for shaving strips of wood, so I primarily used my Mini-Talon. Suffice it to say that the full-sized Talon will be my next knife purchase.
 
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