What is the case/argument for traditionals over a modern folder?

[Pokerface]

Well...a lot of reasons for me, I think most of them have already been listed here. I personally find traditionals to be more aesthetically pleasing. Traditionals are the knives of yesteryear and that in itself is of value to me. Traditionals in the pockets of the older generations in my family is another reason. I own a Benchmade Barrage that gets almost no carry time because I simply like the traditionals a lot better. My dad's had me around horses since I was 5-6...he's been around ranch animals since he was a young child as well. Same thing with my grandfathers, and so on. I'd feel a bit strange with the Benchmade in my pocket while on the saddle.

 

[FLymon]

Why do I have to choose?

I find real and perceived value in both.
I bet you will too.

After a bit more thought, I don't know well this will convey my intended meaning, but given the choice of modern traditional:

and a traditional modern:

I will take the modern traditional every time.

I like my Traditional knives both ways, but I like my modern knives to be modern knives.

 

[cchu518]

It's arguable but that Kit Carson is just a modern in sheep's clothing!
That Oeser is hot btw!

 

[Peregrin]

Let's keep the emphasis on the Traditional knives, please. If it drifts too much more it's moving to General Discussion.
Also, keep the language 1950s, whittling and rocking on the front porch with Grandma.

 

[akadave2]

Easy, multiple blade/tools in a small package, arguably even more compact than say an SAK.

 

[Toddwalla]

There's not much more that I can add that hasn't been said, but I think that for most of us that fancy traditionals, it's about a feeling. Traditionals remind of us of where we come from, and most importantly, why where we come from matters. It's an aesthetic that makes you slow down and appreciate the usefulness of a knife, and life. When there is a cutting task at hand and I have to stop and slow down, dig into my pocket to pull out my traditional knife, and use both hands to carefully select the most appropriate blade for the job...well, for me, that's part of the appeal!

And now for a picture (because all posts benefit from a picture)

 

[cchu518]

My first foray into traditionals was a Spyderco UKPK slipjoint. Does this qualify as a traditional? I liked the knife very much but ended up trading it. It cut very well, but it was still very modern as you can see.

But thanks to this discussion, I'm going to dip my toes into a true traditional. I found a discussion about the Rough Rider brand of knives, so without going into a geo political discourse, I think this thread has pushed me over to try out this style of knife. I was very hesitant as there are so many interesting doo dads on modern knives to keep someone ogling at them for a very long time. If this goes well I might have to try some vintage Case and maybe GEC.

Btw here is a photo of my python Bella which is why I chose this particular knife rather than just go for a Case or GEC. The motto is appealing too and not too novelty-ish...again without getting into politics.

 

[HFinn]

For me it is many things. The beauty of the natural handle materials is a big bonus. I do own also some modern folders, but they see little use these days.

If I have to say it shortly, it is the beauty combined with the functionality. The joy of using a well working traditional tool. The ethnic and regional knives have a special place in my heart and of course the knife of my country, the Puukko is also very dear.

 

[kamagong]

Christian,

That really is a beauty I will say! A FINE piece of quality that is, I can tell just from the pic.

Beautiful knife, Christian.

Thanks guys.

- Christian

 

[DrPenguin]

The bigger internal struggle for me is consumerism.... it's a struggle to try and scale back and simplify my life in the midst of all this consumerism and temptation.

I've stated the same thing. Of course I am a working research engineer and don't rub shoulders with many of the 1% but I truly understand the sentiment. There came a time in my life when I just looked at the closet full of clothes that hadn't (and wouldn't) been of use, the kitchen full of stuff I didn't even know the purpose of, and the gargantuan allotment of outdoor gear and just said "Enough."

I came to realize that consumerism had robbed me of some of my most enjoyable hobbies. In hunting I was wasting time looking at the latest and greatest instead of relishing the upcoming hunt. Same with fishing. I cleaned house and have never regretted it one bit. My knife collecting hobby changed too. I still buy the occasional knife but they go into the collection box. They'll be passed on to the next generation and I hope the knives I have chosen will tell them a story of how tastes and workmanship fared over the course of my life. But when it comes to my pocket and what goes in it? That decision has been made. There won't be anything new in my pocket till something gets broken, lost, stolen, or what-have-you.

I believe traditional knives fit this lifestyle better. Simple, functional, with a touch of style.

Will

 

[Woodrow F Call]

I've stated the same thing. Of course I am a working research engineer and don't rub shoulders with many of the 1% but I truly understand the sentiment. There came a time in my life when I just looked at the closet full of clothes that hadn't (and wouldn't) been of use, the kitchen full of stuff I didn't even know the purpose of, and the gargantuan allotment of outdoor gear and just said "Enough."

I came to realize that consumerism had robbed me of some of my most enjoyable hobbies. In hunting I was wasting time looking at the latest and greatest instead of relishing the upcoming hunt. Same with fishing. I cleaned house and have never regretted it one bit. My knife collecting hobby changed too. I still buy the occasional knife but they go into the collection box. They'll be passed on to the next generation and I hope the knives I have chosen will tell them a story of how tastes and workmanship fared over the course of my life. But when it comes to my pocket and what goes in it? That decision has been made. There won't be anything new in my pocket till something gets broken, lost, stolen, or what-have-you.

I believe traditional knives fit this lifestyle better. Simple, functional, with a touch of style.

Will

I am struggling with the whole consumerism bit myself. I'm working on how much of my "stuff" I really need or even want in my life.

 

[Will Power]

When not in the pocket, Traditionals look very nice scattered around the house as ornaments. In the worry-stone dept. there's no contest....

That said, I like a couple of Moderns as useful tools, but I can't gain association or attachment!

 

[Ernie1980]

I like both, and have many of each. Traditionals are my go to work knife though. Since there is no lock and require two hand to open, there is less threat. Also, in terms of legal issues there are less facing their use. I also like the thin blades and the exotic natural handle materials found on many traditionals.

 

[DrPenguin]

I am struggling with the whole consumerism bit myself. I'm working on how much of my "stuff" I really need or even want in my life.

It's a tough question isn't it? And you have what seems like an entire society that has evolved into telling you that you need, or deserve, this that or something the other. That you'll look slimmer and feel younger and have fuller, thicker hair if only you send in your payment of $X.XX so rush before they're sold out!

Bah.

My little traditional knives will, without any doubt in my mind, get me through whatever squirrel or trout or packing tape or whittling or whatever life throws my way. And if they won't I doubt seriously any knobs or buttons or Zombie Green plastic parts or a compass in the handle will make any difference. I like carrying something that I have a history with. You can't buy history you have to put it in your pocket and carry it and do things and experience things with it.

Will

 

[liamstrain]

It's not an argument for one over the other, for me. It's more a matter of situationally, what is my preference - horses for courses. I wouldn't use most traditionals as a quick deployment/one hand deployment blade. And I wouldn't use most big tactical folders when wearing a suit, or just cutting up an apple with lunch.

Lots of grades in between. They are different types of tools - each with their own purposes and strengths.

 

[cchu518]

Personally, I'm not down on moderns, love 'em. I'm struggling with why I need a dozen of each! I know that I don't and so have been forcing myself to stop going for the bigger, badder, more expensive item.

Quite literally today, I was debating three different Ti-Framelocks to pull the trigger on.

I bought a Benchmade Pinnacle 750 recently. Had it for 10 minutes. I got what it was about. Realized it was overkill. I already had kept out of a dozen knives at that point the UKPK, a Fixed Blade Skyline, Drifter, Ambitious, Mini Grip. Well the UKPK and Skyline went away with that trade, but the trader had sent me that Opinel. It was ironic as I was actively trying to decrease the amount of pocket knives I have.

Each one of those knives though are virtually as strong and useful as the other in normal everyday use of a knife.

I searched back on some threads so see what Woodrow and Dr Penguin meant in their statements. It was very poignant. I want to give up all the extra things and have myself know that the world does not stop because I don't have the next new fangled thing and be at ease with that. I.E. I use knives a lot with my garden. Ultimately its the vegetables that we harvest in our garden on the weekends that my wife and myself love to eat in the summer and why we look forward to summer every year. So we need a little knife to cut string or put a notch into a pole, detangle deer fencing etc...etc... My compulsion for framelocks shouldn't be penultimate to the enjoyment of the harvest, the cutting instrument shouldn't factor at all and I was allowing that to get in the way of things. I think I'm working through that now. With that said, I just picked up a traditional and to date still have four of the dozen modern folders I had picked up in the past few months. It's a good start in trying to stop my own personal consumerism, I'm going to try, really try to not purchase another knife through the end of the year. Let's see how it goes!

 

[rune1279]

The practical aspects having been well covered, I will give the mushy answer:

A traditional knife has a sort of a bargain that goes along with it. It is often carbon steel, so you will look after it or it will rust, and you will keep it sharp or it will be useless when you need it. It is a slipjoint, so you will use it mindfully or you will bleed for your carelessness. But if you take care of it, it will last -- it will last until the blades are black with age, as thin as toothpicks and still snapping like a trap. It will last until your great-grandkids bury it with you, or -- even better -- until they refuse to.

You'll want it to be beautiful -- A Fine Example of the Cutler's Art, yes? You'll want bone, horn, antler, or wood, (or all of the above, if you have the Affliction) -- something with warmth and character of its own. You'll want the pins polished until they vanish into the bolsters and the shield perfectly inlet into the scale material. You'll want it to snap the way they do when they've been fitted together just-so by somebody who cared enough to do fine work. And then it serves as a reminder that work of quality finds an appreciative audience someday (even if it's just you), and also as a tool for producing work of quality, yourself.

I admit that as someone who works in front of a computer in a little grey cubicle, I seldom have cause to use my little pocketknives day to day, and so this sense of 'receiving and propagating a tradition of quality' is more philosophical than practical. But I'll also say from weary years of experience that this environment is an awfully easy place to lose your perspective -- i.e. just where a tool that doubles as a reminder is a fine thing to have tucked in your pocket.

--Mark

 

[pinnah]

As another forum member said they all cut things. The No. 9 does a wonderful job at cutting things and the handle is just superb. While I love my Spyderco's and benchmade's I have been hankering for something with a thin blade that basically disappears in my pocket. Folks have been decrying every type of knife as being non-tactical but to be honest almost any knife in some way shape or form can be tactical. Hoodlums from my days growing up in NYC would put fear and terror into people wielding a razor blade. So that said what kind of damage could a Spyder Delica or Buck 110 do?

Couple of things...

Regarding consumerism, the Opinel is a great anti-consumerist knife. Just keep saying, "It's all about the blade." Pirsig says (roughly) that quality is that which gives you peace of mind. There is hope in this, since we can change our mind. Forums suck for this. Just create doubt and the sense of inadequacy that drives us to buy.

As for tactical... Yes, a ball point pen or a bat can be used as a weapon and yes, any knife can be used as a weapon. But, speaking as an engineer who's done a bit of military related work (A colleague noted that our job was to help the military kill more efficiently...) some designs are inherently better at killing than others are. That is precisely why they get chosen by the military or law enforcement officers. They give a decided tactical advantage over other similar, albeit less efficient competitors.

I was working in my shop a bit this morning, found myself holding a bunch of stuff in my left arm and realized I need to cut something. I pulled out my Opinel 9 and opened it one handed, cut the offending zip tie, and closed the Opinel one handed just as smooth as silk. Yes, one handed opening is handy. No, the Opinel isn't going to get confused with thumb stud or Spyderco style tactical.

Regarding the Buck 110 specifically, I think a short version of folding knife bad-boy history can be stated thusly:
Spanish Navaja -> Buck 110 -> Spyerco

All of these knives have had a dual purpose in their day. One part utility knife for laborers. One part weapon. We could pretend it was otherwise, but it would be pretending.

 

[Pokerface]

I was reading some of the posts in this last page about "consumerism" and I couldn't help but think of Fight Club and what they say there about life becoming an Ikea catalog...it's neither here nor there, but I thought I'd drop it in.

 

[Planterz]

I've done the modern "tactical" knife thing. Big knives like the Military, BM710/806, large Sebenza, Severtech, ZT, etc. I found that I don't need that much knife. I only have a handful of modern folders left, and they have thin blades, thin bodies, and even though I carry them, it's usually the traditional knife in my pocket that I prefer to actually use.

Here are my personal reasons for preferring a traditional knife over a modern "tactical" one:

Aesthetics. I like jigged bone, burnt stag, the natural grain of wood, and the simplicity of yellow delrin. I like G-10 and Carbon fiber too, but there's much more charm and class in the traditional materials.

Tradition. I'm relatively young, but I like carrying an old (or old-style) knife because I feel it connects me to the older (and disappearing) generations.

Thinner blades. I don't need to chop a limb, baton wood, or carve up a car door, so a thick "folding prybar" knife is overkill. Thinner blades suit my needs better.

More blades, different edges. A 3½" stockman has nearly 6" of cutting edge packed in that small frame. Main blade for general use, the sheepsfoot for opening packaging, and the pen/spay for detailed work. Or you can choose any multi-blade knife that suits your needs. You can put different edges on blades; fine for delicate jobs, coarse for rough jobs. You can choose redundant blades and have a second blade ready if the first goes dull. The choices and possibilities are almost endless.

They don't scare people. Even though I live in Arizona, where you can carry and own pretty much any "weapon" you want (except nunchucks), I'm still not all that fond of whipping out a big honkin' modern knife to do something simple like opening a box cleaning a fingernail.

They're more honest. As I just said, I feel foolish pulling out a large "tactical" folder to do something that I can do with a small slipjoint. I don't need a 4" blade to trim a loose piece of thread or cut out a coupon. I don't need the strongest lock in the industry - or any lock at all really.

I still understand the convenience of a knife that can easily be opened with one hand and can lock, which is why I still carry them as well. There may come a situation where digging into the bottom of my pocket for a knife that requires 2 hands to open wouldn't be an option, but the quickly accessible and opening knife clipped to my pocket might be a necessity. But for the most part, the knife I go to for daily use is the multi-blade traditional slipjoint.