What makes a fighting knife

[J W Bensinger]

Stabbing with a khuk isn't generally going to have the end of cutting off your own fingers, but it generally isn't the most effective way to use the tip of the knife in a fight.

Take the M-43 for example: The acute tip is driven home by the arc of the swing. It's much more effective imagining it as a big raptor's claw that hooks in powerfully.

It's true-but they do thrust pretty well, especially the angled thrusts of kali and silat.

 

[J W Bensinger]

You've made me curious, what do you choose/have you chosen for those conflicts?

Scara-I carried this:
Jambiya based, dedicated reverse grip, with the inside edge being the primary edge. Not a dueling knife...more of an antipersonnel scraper/grappling accessory. Only time it came out was to make sure it would still come out.
If I was going to pick a dueler it would be a bowie or this-I have a weakness for the design and this one cuts like it's a foot longer than it is:

As far as a mixed utility/turn things into pez dispensers knife, the Ang Khola by Dhan that Jack got me for solstice.
I do think the previous post mentioning "the knife you happen to have when it kicks off" is pretty accurate though.

 

[Bawanna]

Guess I blew it on my guess huh? Well can't be right all the time I reckon. I'd be tickled to be right just once myself.

I figured scorpion for sure. My bad.

 

[J W Bensinger]

Guess I blew it on my guess huh? Well can't be right all the time I reckon. I'd be tickled to be right just once myself.

I figured scorpion for sure. My bad.

Haha-the scorpions existed only in a very rudimentary form when I was still going silly places. This thing was actually the earliest step towards that design.

 

[Scara]

It's true-but they do thrust pretty well, especially the angled thrusts of kali and silat.

I think I'll have to do some research on kali and silat thrusts. One interesting little quirk of some kukris, for example my Lachhu WWII is that they thrust fairly well, but are far more effective when that thrust is turned into a chop by letting the wrist flick with the weight and momentum at the end of the thrust. I imagine the M43 with it's more acute tip would be even more effective with the thrusting chop.

Seriousblade, several people I trust have mentioned that the kukri is not unsafe in a thrust and their reasoning makes sense to me, but I have an experiment in mind to test it for myself in a safe manner, safe to myself, my kukris, and the property of my landlord. It'll be a few hours until I can go forward with the experiment because I have work to get done, but it should be plenty definitive for my purposes.

Also, my point was not to say that you believed speed to be the only element, but that one can compensate for a lack of speed by being good in the other two foundational elements of conflict: distance and rhythm. Thus they are all important, but one can compensate for being poor in one by being good in the others.

 

[Seriousbladeno1]

Scara, not that i do not believe that in relation to fighting knifes,,,,khukuries can't be necessary used as a thrusting/stabbing in fight,of course it is possible,surely it is.....My concern however is fact,that in so serious situation such as fight with knifes would be,,,one must fight the way,he will succeed in every costs and what are the chances of hand slipping over edge,we must think of,when we stab/thrust with edged weapon without guard? Is it 50%? Is it 60%? There is no correct answer,because it will depend on volume of sweating,handle material,bone structure,armour plating of enemy gear,etc.etc.the only fact is the probability is very likely that this will happend.

If tendances on fingers are cut and interupted,what are the chances of unintentionally dropping the knife in that second? Very-very high.....What are the chances of opponent will use this to his advantage? Very high....last resort is individual unarmed combat skills,when cornered empty handed,with one hand out of order...Chances of even highly trained individuals to survive this,are very-very slim....if the person with knife is even only little bit skilled and determined enough.

Let alone all Hollywood movies and "martial artist tricks",,,this is scenario that nobody is trained and prepared for enough.....This is why,i would leave stabbing /thrusting with anything that have no guard as last resort in serious situation like fight with knifes....my point of view.

Of coarse there are many other "very special" or individual edged knifes/weapons designed to fight with,having no guard,but other features such as Karambit etc.but stabbing/thrusting is also not their primary function in general....

 

[Moonw]

As far as I remember, gurkhas were notorious for stabbing the belly of the opponents. That's when they didn't send bodyparts flying around.

 

[Bawanna]

The Liberty Series thunk up and designed by Mr. Howard Wallace should fill the bill nicely for any thrusters out there. To my knowledge they are each one of a kind, never seen another offered on a DOD or anything.
At this point I'd say if your dress was blown up over your head you'd have to chat with Auntie about a custom.

I've yet to link up with him (not for lack of trying, always seems to be a conflict) to see them first hand but seems to meet the criteria.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1085492-The-Liberty-Series?highlight=liberty+series

Cut wood, not people, that's my motto. I'm a shooter and a lover, not a stabber and a bleeder.

 

[Scara]

The Liberty Series thunk up and designed by Mr. Howard Wallace should fill the bill nicely for any thrusters out there. To my knowledge they are each one of a kind, never seen another offered on a DOD or anything.
At this point I'd say if your dress was blown up over your head you'd have to chat with Auntie about a custom.

I've yet to link up with him (not for lack of trying, always seems to be a conflict) to see them first hand but seems to meet the criteria.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1085492-The-Liberty-Series?highlight=liberty+series

Cut wood, not people, that's my motto. I'm a shooter and a lover, not a stabber and a bleeder.

Those are beautiful knives. I wouldn't mind owning any one of them.

JW, I'm trying to show someone your Hu Die Dao, but they don't have Facebook and they don't use this forum, so I can't show them the pictures from your Facebook page or from here. Is there somewhere I can find a link that will work to show them?

 

[J W Bensinger]

They should still be able to look at the business page's photos, f-book or no f-book.
Otherwise feel free to save the pic and email it to 'em.

 

[davidf99]

What makes a good fighting knife? On the theory that a picture is worth a thousand words, here's one.

View attachment 518530

I've been looking for an excuse to show off this newest acquisition, a Western W49 bowie customized by Bill Siegle based on the Bill Bagwell modifications. Steel pins, very comfortable micarta handle, full convex razor sharp grind, modified hand guard, fully sharpened swedge, original sheath. Made in the 1970s. Rescued and modified more recently by Bill.

This is a quintessential fighting knife, 15" overall length, 18.5oz. Light enough to be fast, heavy enough to do damage, feels as good as it looks.

Maybe not as effective as a similar-sized khukuri, but less likely to raise eyebrows and set off alarms in people that see you with it. You can say that you are celebrating the Alamo, or some such excuse for carrying it. Let me know if that works.

By the way, I've never been into western style bowies and this is my first one. It caught my eye because the modifications are so good, both in concept and execution.

 

[Seriousbladeno1]

What makes a good fighting knife? On the theory that a picture is worth a thousand words, here's one.

View attachment 518530

I've been looking for an excuse to show off this newest acquisition, a Western W49 bowie customized by Bill Siegle based on the Bill Bagwell modifications. Steel pins, very comfortable micarta handle, full convex razor sharp grind, modified hand guard, fully sharpened swedge, original sheath. Made in the 1970s. Rescued and modified more recently by Bill.

This is a quintessential fighting knife, 15" overall length, 18.5oz. Light enough to be fast, heavy enough to do damage, feels as good as it looks.

Maybe not as effective as a similar-sized khukuri, but less likely to raise eyebrows and set off alarms in people that see you with it. You can say that you are celebrating the Alamo, or some such excuse for carrying it. Let me know if that works.

By the way, I've never been into western style bowies and this is my first one. It caught my eye because the modifications are so good, both in concept and execution.

Very nice piece David, thanks for sharing this blade.I always liked bowie style fixed blades too,have few also...Love their reliability and have passion for them.

 

[Bawanna]

I call BS, if I seen somebody totin that beautiful bowie my eye brows would definitely be raised as I backed away in a polite sort of fashion..

That's a nice knife.

I have one similar, don't recall the manufacture, seems like a decent knife, cheap sheath. I'll have to take a look at it again

 

[sirupatespecial]

What makes a good fighting knife? On the theory that a picture is worth a thousand words, here's one.

View attachment 518530

I've been looking for an excuse to show off this newest acquisition, a Western W49 bowie customized by Bill Siegle based on the Bill Bagwell modifications. Steel pins, very comfortable micarta handle, full convex razor sharp grind, modified hand guard, fully sharpened swedge, original sheath. Made in the 1970s. Rescued and modified more recently by Bill.

This is a quintessential fighting knife, 15" overall length, 18.5oz. Light enough to be fast, heavy enough to do damage, feels as good as it looks.

Maybe not as effective as a similar-sized khukuri, but less likely to raise eyebrows and set off alarms in people that see you with it. You can say that you are celebrating the Alamo, or some such excuse for carrying it. Let me know if that works.

By the way, I've never been into western style bowies and this is my first one. It caught my eye because the modifications are so good, both in concept and execution.

When I first saw this thread that is the exact knife I thought of. Actually pictured it in my mind. Nice....

There can be several interpretations of "fighting knife." Dagger, Kukuri, Bowie, Tanto(haven't seen one of those yet), sharpfinger even a shiv. Plenty more examples. But to me, Jim Bowie's knife is exactly what I picture as "The Fighting Knife".

 

[Seriousbladeno1]

If i had to option for ultimate fighting knife than definitely russian Kyzliar DV-2 would be my top choice,closely followed by some other models from Kyzliar and Kyzliar Supreme.Last,but not least few SOG models also well worth to consider for this purpose....If that would be handmade production i would draw a blueprint and very much trust Nepalese Kamis to bring this knife to a life from 5160

 

[J W Bensinger]

If i had to option for ultimate fighting knife than definitely russian Kyzliar DV-2 would be my top choice,closely followed by some other models from Kyzliar and Kyzliar Supreme.Last,but not least few SOG models also well worth to consider for this purpose....If that would be handmade production i would draw a blueprint and very much trust Nepalese Kamis to bring this knife to a life from 5160

I always liked the Kizlyar Phoenix and the Korshun. Not wild about rubber handles but the blade shapes are great.

 

[Scara]

So Seriousblade, I did my experiment and I got slightly mixed results. I tried thrusting and stabbing with a wooden kukri made for me by Bawanna. I set up my mattress with an inch thick foam pad, a dense one, underneath the sheets. At that point I tried thrusting and stabbing. I found that if one tries to stab with a kukri, you have to stab with the tip in line with the shoulder, and not in line with the handle. Attempting to stab in line with the handle will push your hand out towards the blade. Stabbing with the tip in line with the shoulder will not push your hand towards the blade, it will push the handle up into the web of your hand. It is also important to keep a firm grip on the handle, but that isn't a surprise.

So as for results, always stab with the tip in line with the shoulder, and not in line with the handle.

 

[Shavru]

I will throw in that the knife I carried when the highest chance of needing to use it on a person was a Randall Model 13 small an Arky Toothpick at 6 1/2" blade. Gotta remember that was a few years ago LOL. The prices have "changed" a bit since then. Sure wish I had kept that blade and it's stacked leather grip...

 

[Russ Carswell]

Effective fighting knife should be sharp from edges and made up of high carbon steel. Rest depends on the person who is using it and how much expertise he/she has with that knife. My personal fighting knife is a Kukri.

 

[Seriousbladeno1]

I always liked the Kizlyar Phoenix and the Korshun. Not wild about rubber handles but the blade shapes are great.

HI JW

Yes you are right,they seem to me very effectively constructed,not only this fact i love about Kyzliar,but also all combat blades comes with one of the most comprehensive sheaths,available,mole compatible also each knife is individually numbered on the spine i believe......Some of them are purely designed killers,others very multipurpose ones.

If i had an option for most devastating cold weapon than it would be hard to choose-Khukuri vs Samurai sword,khukuri is more durable no doubt,but when it comes to speed and sharpness possibly nothing will exceed katana.

JW-YOU HAVE INCREDIBLE PICTURES OF YOUR OWN PRODUCTION,VERY,VERY NICE! I AM FAN AND ALWAYS WAS, OF LARGE FIXED BLADES,FOLDERS AND SUCH I NEVER LIKED,BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT RELIABLE ANYWHERE CLOSE TO FIXED BLADES...