What would a mountain man use today?

CWL said:
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They used the latest technologies available to them back then to make life easier, so I doubt that they would hold back from any technologies that they could get their hands on today, be it stainless, titanium, goretex, insulation, pack materials, storage, firemaking and of-course firearms.
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I agree. I have done a lot of research in regard to the North American fur trade. And it basicly boiled down to this in central Canada. Canadian traders were much worse than the British when it came to plying the Indians with alcohol. The Brits were in it for the long haul, the H.B.C. was sometimes referred to as Here Before Christ. There was ruthless debauchery of the Indigenous peoples in basicly get rich quick schemes. Trading was a young mans game and if you didn't run a post, you were likely out by age 35 with a worn out body. Large iron tools\ axes etc. were often tossed on river banks when the furs were being run down river to market, as their value was an infitismal pittance compared to the furs. Natives were killed and Europeans were killed in some of the western trade posts, including children. I read one report were some Voyageurs came around a bend in the river and found a native woman hung by the neck dead. She killed herself rather than deal with the white trader that she had to be with, she tried to run away many times but was brought back. From trade sites I have seen and found basicly what the guys here on this forum have been pounding into my thick skull. Or a variation of this theme: Hatchet, folding knife, mid sized knife. In my modern incarnation I carry a folding saw................. I see guys getting their snot in a knot over different forms of outdoor tools\skills\knowledge. I could care less really. I like many different aspects of it all. I enjoy making a fire with a ferro rod. But If my azz is going to freeze off in the north or anywhere really, I'll use gas and a lighter, or whatever does the job, right now. I don't know it all, many times I'm wrong, and I learn all the time from this site. Have fun out there.
 
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The Becker BK5 pictured above is a beaut. and would serve as a great camp knife.
I have one from the Camillus era nicely convexed by Mr. Fisk.
 
Were the mountain men traditionalists? Would they refuse modern high tech stuff? Here’s one bit of evidence.

At the beginning of the Mountain Men era, the flintlock rifle ruled the field. By the end of it, most trappers carried cap locks.

Interesting discussion here: http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/210380/

As for them choosing to carry the GPS...it would be useless. The satellites the Royal Society launched in John Jacob Astor’s day were too primitive to support GPS. :D
 
shunsui said:
AK47, still used by mountain men around the world. :D
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Ya beat me to it, shunsui.

We were a village elders home (one of the tribal leaders). Two room house. A wire ran from the bedroom to the beat up car out front. It went to the battery in order to light the house at night.

Difficult to expand on that without it appearing political, but it enforces your point.
 
But... by the time percussion came into favor, the "mountain man" (fur trade) era was over. And there was a lot of resistance to the "poppers" and "cones" when they first appeared. One could freshen a flint, or fashion one, but one could not make a percussion cap. Just as they could not make a metallic cartridge.
 
Balldboy said:
The Becker BK5 pictured above is a beaut. and would serve as a great camp knife.
I have one from the Camillus era nicely convexed by Mr. Fisk.
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Jerry Fisk emailed me for better pictures of some of my trade knives. He said that he uses features from some of the old trade knives in his research, and that the Mag Camp was influenced by this type of knife.
 
Codger_64 said:
But... by the time percussion came into favor, the "mountain man" (fur trade) era was over. And there was a lot of resistance to the "poppers" and "cones" when they first appeared. One could freshen a flint, or fashion one, but one could not make a percussion cap. Just as they could not make a metallic cartridge.
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In my innocence I suppose that people who specialize in something I know little about, know more about it than I do. http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/210380/

Judging by the quotes provided, percussion caps were used by the late 1830s.

Judging by the quotes, percussion caps were a qualified success.

In response to Zonie

Good stuff, there are many mentions of caps in ledgers of goods going up the river in the 1830's one which I cannot recall the individual party had to remove their caps during the heat of the day as they were going off, this had to be uncomfortable in hostile country, I think all we can safely say about the 1830's in the west was that it was a time of transition from cap to flint, by the 1840's the caps were much more common than a decade earlier.

But then, so were flintlocks. Just ask H. H. Sibley.*

In response to Cooner54

There is a quote in Firearms of the American West 1803-1865 about Russell’s mentioning the burst tube.

"Osborne Russell was hunting near Yellowstone Lake in August of 1837 when his companion "shot a Grizzly Bear and busted the percussion tube of his rifle which obliged us to return to camp to our comrades...and make another tube."

During an 1839 hunt west of Fort Snelling, H. H. Sibley formed a very definite opinion of the relative merits of the flint and percussion locks:

When I raised and leveled my piece, (the bear) was not six feet from its muzzle. Snap! snap! snap! was all I could get out of the infernal rifle, which no persuasion could induce to go off, and O! that I should live to record the fact, the bear got away safe and sound....Now, my opinion...is, that any man calling himself a sportsman who will not use a percussion, when he can procure one, in lieu of a flint-lock gun, should be ...furnished with a strait jacket at the public expense."

zonie
 
What we choose to carry is largely a result of what we are doing, so I would think that a lot would be determined by what, exactly, a "mountain man" would be doing today. After all, there is no more trapping and trading as they did it on the N. American continent, no more intact native cultures here, no more blank areas on the map.... What would a mountain man be doing in 2013? They were the product of their time, and the options of the time. Their descendents are all around us today, and are bankers, auto-mechanics, software developers and musicians. So with that in mind, I'd say they'd be carrying iPhones, commuting to work from the suburbs, looking forward to the Super Bowl, and possibly hanging out on forums like this.

It might be more interesting to ask what a modern-day Mongol would carry, since there are still Steppe cultures living somewhat similarly to the way they lived 500 years ago (albeit minus the large-scale warring and pillaging), though with access to some modern conveniences. What have they adopted, and not adopted?
 
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Smithhammer said:
What would a mountain man be doing in 2013?
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Running shine and/or growing marijuana. I'm only half-joking... because you're right, a lone man or small group probably wouldn't make much of a living off of trapping alone.
 
Some good responses. I think you would see a blend of old and new. I think you would still see a lot of canvas wall tents, or some of the Cabelas tents that have provisions for a stove, as mentioned above. Lots of cast iron. I think you would see newer sleeping bags and water storage/filtration systems. Knives would probably be a mix of old and new, but I think lots of trappers and Buck 110s. Probably SAKs, too. Guns would still be lever actions, bolt actions, and single shots. I believe you would see lots of GPS devices, laptops, cell phones, and solar chargers.
 
Lots of great ideas, I just wanted to see what everyone though.

Remember, they are probably operating off of caches, everything has to be carried on the horse they are riding, and a pack horse.

Some of my ancestors came from the Mongol steppes and raided down into eastern Europe. I would like to see what's inside the modern yurt. National Geographic did a great article maybe about ten years ago on the Mongol way of life in the 20th century (yep, had to be before 2001 ;)). They stuck to a lot of the old ways, but didn't shun new products/ideas. Not quite a coffee house with wifi in a yurt, with yak dung powering the espresso maker, but they were still utilizing both old and new.
 
As an avid backpacker, I find that you really can't beat a mix of the two. Wool as a mid layer, socks, and pant lining is unbeatable. Nothing trumps an arc'teryx parka for light weight waterproofing. Modern flyfishing systems absolutely trump old fishing systems, yet traditional lures will always outdo fancy synthetic lures. A good canvas micarta or real grippy G-10 will outperform most wood scales, but give me a high quality o-1 blade over a new age stainless any day for bushcraft.
 
Not necessarily true. My heavy duty wool capote is quite a bit warmer than my Dickies thinsulate+gor-tex winter hunting coat. When it comes to waterproofing then yes modern gear is best but for warmth wool is hard beat. But I would however rather have some under armor underwear then some flannel long johns.:)

Oh and I bet the mountain men wouldn't mind a blast match and some tinder quick tabs. Yet I would gladly trade my military ECW sleeping system for an original hudson's bay blanket,lol

Zidfeldts said:
There is a reason for "high tech" synthetics: if they are high quality they are warmer than traditional stuff and dry out a lot faster. I can't believe that anyone would opt for wool long johns over what we have available now. A modern parka is a lot warmer than a traditional one and is a lot lighter as well.
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Don't forget a Titanium bottle filled with a single malt Scotch, photo chromic sun glasses, and an Inka Titanium pen.
 
Ulfhedinn said:
When she was in Siberia, she went there with one of those new, space-age parkas, and kept talking about how she was freezing all the time. One of the locals gave her a traditional fur coat (fur on the inside and out), and she seemed surprised that she was comfortable in it, and remarked about how some of the traditional things still trumped the new.
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This is 100% true. My wife and I lived in Mongolia for a year. We spent ridiculous money on modern synthetic gear for her, and she froze her ass off, and this was just in the fall! We got her a fur coat and all was right in the world. One of the main requirements for comfort is getting moisture away from the skin, and trapping a still air envelope uniformly around your body. One of the shortcomings of synthetic materials is that they crush easily, which leads to cold spots. The traditional Mongolian winter coat is a shearling wool coat with the wool facing the inside, and a nice, tight silk fabric on the outside.

In my experience, using a down coat *under* the modern goretex rain coat seriously improved its warmth, mostly by keeping out wind, a big issue.

One of my recent discoveries is possum wool -- in New Zealand, they mix possum and merino wool. I've been tremendously impressed with the warmth:weight ratio on this product. Which leads me to socks. I don't care much for synthetic socks - they always seem to keep my feet 5* cooler than I want. The possum/merino socks are amazing.

Regarding sharp stuff, I'd take a large folding saw, either a camp axe or a tomahawk, a 6~7" fixed blade knife for dressing game, and a multi-tool with a small blade for carving. I'd also take a coarse DMT hone for edge repair, and some crock sticks to put a good edge on. A saw is much more efficient at cutting wood, but has an upper limit to the diameter which can be cut. An axe does not.

Oh, and bear spray.
 
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silenthunterstudios said:
Some of my ancestors came from the Mongol steppes and raided down into eastern Europe. I would like to see what's inside the modern yurt.
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It's still very traditional: hand-made furniture, the central dung-fired stove/oven, steel pots. Water in 20-liter gerry cans. Lots of re-use of plastic containers for cooking food stuffs.

Some herders have adopted wind powered generators, AC/DC inverters and satellite dishes to power their small B&W TV so they can watch the national wrestling matches. :)

They do still use horses and camels as transport: they're more reliable, and have very low overhead cost.
 
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