When is a trade complete?

FlaMtnBkr

FlaMtnBkr

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Just curious what others thoughts on this are.

When you agree to a trade when is it complete? Once you agree to it? Or once each person gets the knife in hand and has a chance to look it over and make sure it is what they expected, and/or that the knife meets the trade description?
 
I'd say once both parties receive their item and both confirm that they are pleased. Of course, the parties may agree otherwise (e.g. "As Is" or "buyer accepts risk of loss/damage", etc.). I always wait until I have confirmation that the other person has received the item, and that he is pleased, before I post feedback.

I try to be conservative in my ratings and descriptions because I believe it's better to under-promise and over-deliver. If I were, however, to send a knife to someone, and they truly were not pleased, then I would offer to reverse the transaction or compensate them somehow to make them comfortable with the deal (within reason, of course).
 
That has always been my take on it as well. I just did a trade and he got his knife last Friday and I just got my package since the PO didn't deliver it and I had to go pick it up in town.

One knife was advertised as reprofiled by a popular member here, but otherwise new. I'm not real happy with the sharpening job as it is scratched, the edge radius not smooth, and the thumb studs have been ground down some as well as a flat spot on the edge at the tip. I also misunderstood and thought the second knife was NIB but is used. So I'm not happy or excited with the trade which I think I should be.

I traded a NIB sprint run knife and the guy said something that implied he already sharpened the knife over the weekend when I told him I hadn't got the knife yet. If so the knife is no longer new so even if I wanted to reverse the deal I'm now stuck with a knife that quite a bit of value is gone. Not sure what to do at this point. I emailed him earlier today and waiting for a reply.
 
The guy who got yours and re-sharpened it before confirming your satisfaction did a major no no. That is plain out dumb, who is this member?

Also, using a selling point such as "sharpened by a pro" just to get it and see it looks like poo is something else that needs addressed. I never trade for a rehsarpened knife without seeing a good pic o the edge. Too many people out there who think they are good at re-sharpening when in truth they are very poor at it.
 
There are NO set rules on trades....it could be whatever both parties agree to prior to shipping the knives.

Assumption is what causes problems.

Details should be discussed and pics traded.

If both parties openly agree to a trial period thats fine, but if it is just something that is assumed thats where the trouble could start. (IMO)
 
i've never purchased a knife on the forum, don't know if that dis-qualifies me from commenting,,,i have however bought things..and have sold a few things i have made...again,,,not on the forum...but business is business where ever, when ever...

i very seldom ask for up front money...the only exception is when i am asked to carve a custom walking/hiking staff...unless otherwise directed...i only use high quality oak or waxwood for the staff, i buy them from martial arts stores, those are the most difficult to break,,,imho,,,and...they are not cheap...

so i ask the customer to front the money for the staff and shipping....usually less than 50 bucks,,,and i require that money be sent to me as a money order or personal check...

meanwhile,,i go ahead and order the staff, paying for it myself...the money order/check when recieved is put in a file,,,i don't cash it...this up-front money ensures to me a customer is committed to the deal,,,which averages approx 185 bucks per stick..and approx..50 hours to design, decorate carve, paint and so on...works out to about..3.70 an hour...LOL...i also email pics as the work progresses...

i ship the stick for approval and once the customer is happy,,,i accept payment either paypal or whatever...if the customer is not satisfied...i pay for return shipping and start all over...never had a dis-satisfied customer so i've never had to implement that policy,,,,,

let me expplain the reason for the money order/check...it has only happened once...i overbooked myself for Christmas delivery one year...by one staff...i had rec'd the check from the customer approx 6 weeks prior to realizing i could not make the deadline,,,so i sent the customer the check back, explaining my situation...the customer was so impressed with the way i handled the situation, especially not cashing the check, i later learned he had been telling a bunch of folks over in yahoo chat, i was the most honorable person he'd ever met,,,,

point of this long-winded treatise, if you will, is simply this,,,if i'm not making the customer happy, i will have no more customers, and i won't be happy...if i make the customer happy, i will have more customers,,,and i will be happy...

both side MUST be happy with the tranaction if not, one or the other must do what it takes to make the other happy...it's simply good business

with all that being said...i apologize for the length of this post...

God Bless...

Lee
 
bigmark408 said:
There are NO set rules on trades....it could be whatever both parties agree to prior to shipping the knives...

If both parties openly agree to a trial period thats fine, but if it is just something that is assumed thats where the trouble could start. (IMO)
Click to expand...

This is significant. While I believe the CONVENTION here is that the deal is not complete until both parties are satisfied, it is not a RULE, in that it does not show up in Spark's rules threads at the top of this forum. His SUGGESTION for having a good buying/selling/trading experince is:

"5. IF YOU WANT AN INSPECTION PERIOD OR RIGHT TO RETURN A PRODUCT, AGREE TO IT IN ADVANCE. CYA CYA CYA CYA
CYA - it will save hard feelings all around."

It would probably be a good idea for all participants in this forum to train themselves to reflexively add language to all their buy/sell/trade posts such as:

"The deal is not complete until both parties are satisfied; neither party will spend, sell, trade, modify, etc. their end of the deal until the other party indicates his satisfaction with the deal."
 
A deal is a "completed" deal when both parties are happy.

There simply is no other way on BFC, period
 
IamMatt said:
It would probably be a good idea for all participants in this forum to train themselves to reflexively add language to all their buy/sell/trade posts such as:

"The deal is not complete until both parties are satisfied; neither party will spend, sell, trade, modify, etc. their end of the deal until the other party indicates his satisfaction with the deal."
Click to expand...

I disagree. It should simply be expected out of any quality individual. No one should get a free pass just because it is not written in the rules or stated in the OP. Anyone unwilling to undo a trade that would basically say/use as leverage, "sorry, its not in the rules", has no business trading imo.
 
This is like spending the money before the other party receives the item.

I hate to even use the term but- Common Sense would dictate you don't screw with something prior to both parties acknowledging receipt and satisfaction of the transaction.
 
I view the trade forums as a long distance swap meet. If both parties were face to face, any differences in value could be hammered out on the spot. The only difference is the time it takes to evaluate the item. I also understand that value is subjective.

For me it boils down to "both parties" must be satisfied to call the trade done. The only variable is the length of the inspection process. I think 3 to 4 days after receipt is plenty, barring any personal calamities on either end.

The items traded and any make up cash should not be used in any way till both parties agree that the trade is satisfactory. Both parties should communicate as soon as possible their satisfaction or dissatisfaction. I'm usually chomping at the bit to use that newly acquired knife the minute it shows up.

Getting back to that "value is subjective" notion, I don't care what the reason is if you don't like the knife etc that I sent. The color doesn't match your handbag, your 20x Loupe showed tool marks on the liners---I don't care. "I'm not satisfied" is good enough for me. I don't mind a few extra minutes and a few extra bucks spent reshipping to get back to square one.
 
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FlaMtnBkr said:
That has always been my take on it as well. I just did a trade and he got his knife last Friday and I just got my package since the PO didn't deliver it and I had to go pick it up in town.

One knife was advertised as reprofiled by a popular member here, but otherwise new. I'm not real happy with the sharpening job as it is scratched, the edge radius not smooth, and the thumb studs have been ground down some as well as a flat spot on the edge at the tip. I also misunderstood and thought the second knife was NIB but is used. So I'm not happy or excited with the trade which I think I should be.

I traded a NIB sprint run knife and the guy said something that implied he already sharpened the knife over the weekend when I told him I hadn't got the knife yet. If so the knife is no longer new so even if I wanted to reverse the deal I'm now stuck with a knife that quite a bit of value is gone. Not sure what to do at this point. I emailed him earlier today and waiting for a reply.
Click to expand...

I would definitely not want to buy anything from that member. Not only is he dishonest but also incompetent (besides Vassili, I don't know anyone who would grind down thumbstuds). I think you should send him a link to this thread so that he sees what our take is. Should he not offer you any kind of reparation I would advise you to start another thread exposing the guy.
 
I would expect that member to step up and offer the cost of a replacement knife to send and then reverse the trade.

Until both parties are good to go one should not be grinding anything but their teeth!!!
 
wolfmann601 said:
A deal is a "completed" deal when both parties are happy.

There simply is no other way on BFC, period
Click to expand...

That sums it up. Anyone saying anything else that lessons the above is sadly mistaken.
 
Bastid said:
That sums it up. Anyone saying anything else that lessons the above is sadly mistaken.
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I respectfully disagree.

There are to many variables.

Everyone needs to be arranged and agreed upon up front in emails with pics and all terms must be agreed upon before any payment or shipping.

There are those out there that are searching the forums looking to take advantage (scammers).

Assuming, is just asking for trouble (IMO).

Put it all in writing upfront. :)
 
Put it all in writing up front.
Click to expand...

I respectfully disagree. Lawyers have to put everything in writing- people with integrity don't.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfmann601
A deal is a "completed" deal when both parties are happy.

There simply is no other way on BFC, period
Click to expand...

That sums it up. Anyone saying anything else that lessons the above is sadly mistaken.
Click to expand...

That's the coin of the realm.
 
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