Where do you go to use your knives?

I too am blessed to have easy access to Daniel Boone National Forest. I grew up hunting and camping there. Nowadays, I take the 6yo for short hikes there. I still hunt there some as well. It's one of my favorite places on earth. I'm usually surprised to see anyone else in the woods to judge the size of my knife during my trips there as I don't really care for the well worn trail type hikes. At home I have an outdoor fireplace where I use my knife of the day to get a fire going. I also use many of my regular folding and fixed blades in the kitchen as often as I can.
 
91bravo said:
He would surely freak out if he saw my 1311 or my Behemoth Chopper strapped to my pack and the bonfire I have burning in the middle of the wilderness.
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Please try to talk about knives and the related issues, not me.

Here is a general principle I believe to be true about knife use in public. When there is a clear and obvious need to have a knife out and to be using it, people accept it. When there isn't, people become justifiably suspicious.

Clear brush in your front yard with a machete? No problem.

Walk in a shopping mall with a machete hanging off your belt? That's a problem.

Have knives, saws and axes out in the open around a campsite fire? No problem.

Hiking on maintained trails with a large fixed blade hanging conspicuously off of your pack straps for fast access? You should be expected to be greeted with suspicion unless there is a clear and obvious reason for you to be doing so. Don hunting clothing and a gun or bow (in season), and that knife becomes less suspicious. Carry fishing gear near a fishing stream, same thing.

In the dead of Winter, I don't see how an alcohol stove is going to keep people warm?
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If you don't climb or ski tour regularly in the winter, I can understand how you might not know the techniques.

If you have access to Netflix, I highly recommend "Meru". It's a documentary on an expedition to a Himalayan peak led by Conrad Anker. The basic techniques they use on that climb are regularly used by backpackers, climbers and skiers to travel safely in the winter backcountry without relying on wood fires. These core techniques are also the basis for ultralight backpacking and the basis for most successful thru hikes of the AT, PCT and CDT.
 
Mike Pierson said:
Beautiful!
If you ever need a change of pace hit me up! We got enough high desert to go around for everyone out there!
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Will do!

pinnah said:
Please try to talk about knives and the related issues, not me.

Here is a general principle I believe to be true about knife use in public. When there is a clear and obvious need to have a knife out and to be using it, people accept it. When there isn't, people become justifiably suspicious.

Clear brush in your front yard with a machete? No problem.

Walk in a shopping mall with a machete hanging off your belt? That's a problem.

Have knives, saws and axes out in the open around a campsite fire? No problem.

Hiking on maintained trails with a large fixed blade hanging conspicuously off of your pack straps for fast access? You should be expected to be greeted with suspicion unless there is a clear and obvious reason for you to be doing so. Don hunting clothing and a gun or bow (in season), and that knife becomes less suspicious. Carry fishing gear near a fishing stream, same thing.



If you don't climb or ski tour regularly in the winter, I can understand how you might not know the techniques.

If you have access to Netflix, I highly recommend "Meru". It's a documentary on an expedition to a Himalayan peak led by Conrad Anker. The basic techniques they use on that climb are regularly used by backpackers, climbers and skiers to travel safely in the winter backcountry without relying on wood fires. These core techniques are also the basis for ultralight backpacking and the basis for most successful thru hikes of the AT, PCT and CDT.
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WTH are you babbling about? I can walk through public places with a 12" knife on my belt and a .357 on the other side, without anyone batting an eye. Where do you live, Californistan? Well, this here is Alabama and we love our knives and guns and wear them out in public all the time. If you ever spent the night in a cold, vsouthern forest before, you're gonna want to build a wood fire. If you haven't, then I can understand how you are ignorant to the techniques. Alcohol stove fire is not going to keep 4 people warm, like a wood fire, duh. You can't speak for all of us being in your corner of the world. Ever heard of geographical differences? What works in your experience in your location is great! But don't tell me it's what's best for me in my location.
 
pinnah said:
These core techniques are also the basis for ultralight backpacking and the basis for most successful thru hikes of the AT, PCT and CDT.
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I don't learn from watching Netflix shows by the way. I learn by making my own mistakes and seeing what will work for next time! You should get outdoors and spend a few nights in the woods. THIS will let you know what works and what doesn't work, not a Netflix show! ha ha!
 
jackknife said:
Deep breath.

Alcohol stoves and canister stoves and Optimus stoves are all fine. I have a little battered Optimus that goes back to 1972. It works well for what it's supposed to do. BUT...stuff happens. What do you do if one of your party, or you, take a fall and a dunk in a creek, or you have to leave someone while you go for help. Life ain't Mr. Roger's neighborhood, or Pee-wee's playhouse. emergencies happen in remote places as we;; as in town. And when it does, you may need to make a good size fire to warm someone up, or send up a nice smoky sign for the park rangers to investigate, or keep yourself warm when the little valve in your stove leaks or something isn't working as it should be.
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I've been hiking, climbing, camping and ski touring in the winter mountains since the 80s. I've been on several winter trips where people have fallen into streams. None of them required a fire to manage. Knowledge of modern clothing systems and shelter sufficed.

I've also been on a few trips where we bet our lives on making wood fires as a safety plan. These are remote and long ski tour day trips in which carrying normal winter safety gear (stove, sleeping bags) weighs too much and inhibits the ability to make the miles necessary to complete the route. A tarp, small wood stove (to start a large fire or manage a small scout fire), fixed blade and folding saw weigh less than the other gear. In many ways, I consider these trips as dangerous or more dangerous than above treeline trips. Obviously, above tree line, fires are impossible and big knives are counterproductive due to their unnecessary weight.

None of this justifies carrying a fixed blade out in the open while hiking on maintained trails though, which is at the core of the OPs first post. IMO, carrying a fixed blade out in the open on maintained trails on public lands simply attracts suspicion and attention.

In 2014 Karen and I were hiking in the Cleveland wilderness area in California not far from the daughters place in Mission Viejo. There at the trail head was a sign warning of rattle snakes and mountain lions. The old Camillus army issue MK2 came out of the day pack on onto my hip. Screw what the other hikers may think.
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I hiked and camped extensively in the Ventana Wilderness in the Big Sur area in California for several years. It's mountain lion territory. I can see the justification of carrying a fixed blade in an easily accessible manner. That said, if I'm really taking mountain lion (or grizzly or moose) attack seriously a) I'm doing other things to minimize the threat and to respond long before a knife becomes involved and b) if things get close, I want a fire arm and pepper spray before I want a knife.

https://www.nps.gov/pore/planyourvisit/yoursafety_mountainlions.htm
 
pinnah said:
I've been hiking, climbing, camping and ski touring in the winter mountains since the 80s. I've been on several winter trips where people have fallen into streams. None of them required a fire to manage. Knowledge of modern clothing systems and shelter sufficed.

I've also been on a few trips where we bet our lives on making wood fires as a safety plan. These are remote and long ski tour day trips in which carrying normal winter safety gear (stove, sleeping bags) weighs too much and inhibits the ability to make the miles necessary to complete the route. A tarp, small wood stove (to start a large fire or manage a small scout fire), fixed blade and folding saw weigh less than the other gear. In many ways, I consider these trips as dangerous or more dangerous than above treeline trips. Obviously, above tree line, fires are impossible and big knives are counterproductive due to their unnecessary weight.

None of this justifies carrying a fixed blade out in the open while hiking on maintained trails though, which is at the core of the OPs first post. IMO, carrying a fixed blade out in the open on maintained trails on public lands simply attracts suspicion and attention.



I hiked and camped extensively in the Ventana Wilderness in the Big Sur area in California for several years. It's mountain lion territory. I can see the justification of carrying a fixed blade in an easily accessible manner. That said, if I'm really taking mountain lion (or grizzly or moose) attack seriously a) I'm doing other things to minimize the threat and to respond long before a knife becomes involved and b) if things get close, I want a fire arm and pepper spray before I want a knife.

https://www.nps.gov/pore/planyourvisit/yoursafety_mountainlions.htm
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On the other side of the coin:

Nothing wrong at all with carrying a fixed blade out in the open while hiking on maintained trials. It's a conversation topic and other hikers want to know what it is.

If one of my kids falls into a stream while we are in the wilderness, there will be a wood fire to dry and stay warm. I mean come on, duh, common sense right?

Above tree line, fires are possible and you are productive having a large blade, to process wood.

You probably just need to just stick with what works for you, instead of telling everyone here it's THE way to do it.
 
91bravo said:
Will do!



WTH are you babbling about? I can walk through public places with a 12" knife on my belt and a .357 on the other side, without anyone batting an eye. Where do you live, Californistan? Well, this here is Alabama and we love our knives and guns and wear them out in public all the time. If you ever spent the night in a cold, vsouthern forest before, you're gonna want to build a wood fire. If you haven't, then I can understand how you are ignorant to the techniques. Alcohol stove fire is not going to keep 4 people warm, like a wood fire, duh. You can't speak for all of us being in your corner of the world. Ever heard of geographical differences? What works in your experience in your location is great! But don't tell me it's what's best for me in my location.
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Typical winter camp for us.

Untitled by Pinnah, on Flickr

Fires are definitely not needed.

If you don't like documentaries, you can learn a bit about the first ascent of Meru's Shark Fin here.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meru_Peak

Fires weren't possible there. Definitely not needed.

We have different opinions on open carry and can just leave it there.
 
pinnah said:
Typical winter camp for us.

Untitled by Pinnah, on Flickr

Fires are definitely not needed.

If you don't like documentaries, you can learn a bit about the first ascent of Meru's Shark Fin here.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meru_Peak

Fires weren't possible there. Definitely not needed.

We have different opinions on open carry and can just leave it there.
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You keep mentioning Meru, but have you yourself attempted anything like that? I thought you lived in MA? As I understand it the highest peak there is below 3,500ft, so not much of a mountain even by our standards. Also, you aren’t the only mountaineer on this forum, not by any means. Tread carefully.
 
It's not all about need dude. What you fail to understand is, that I WANT a fire and I'd care take a gander, that most folks that go into the woods want a fire as well. Fire is the heart of camp, keeps you warm, cooks lots of food quickly, dries your clothes out, brings a sense of companionship, keeps wild animals away, provides light around your camp area, keeps multiple people warm when hanging out, etc.

Don't ever come backpacking or camping down here. You will be in for a huge culture shock when you see campfires roaring and big, scary knives strapped to packs.
 
pinnah said:
Typical winter camp for us.

Fires are definitely not needed.
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Camping out in the wilderness isn't needed.

Sometimes humans do things for fun including camping. I'd rather have the option of being able to easily make a fire to stay warmer. Comfort and what not...

The idea of people freaking out about a fixed blade on a hip is why I don't like visiting certain localities. No one freaks out here.
 
91bravo said:
It's not all about need dude. What you fail to understand is, that I WANT a fire and I'd care take a gander, that most folks that go into the woods want a fire as well. Fire is the heart of camp, keeps you warm, cooks lots of food quickly, dries your clothes out, brings a sense of companionship, keeps wild animals away, provides light around your camp area, keeps multiple people warm when hanging out, etc.

Don't ever come backpacking or camping down here. You will be in for a huge culture shock when you see campfires roaring and big, scary knives strapped to packs.
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Pilsner said:
You keep mentioning Meru, but have you yourself attempted anything like that? I thought you lived in MA? As I understand it the highest peak there is below 3,500ft, so not much of a mountain even by our standards. Also, you aren’t the only mountaineer on this forum, not by any means. Tread carefully.
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No offence guys, but I gotta laugh about the "babbling & at people being offended because they might "see" a big knife..."

I was the “volunteer ice farmer” @ the Ouray Colorado Ice Climbing Park, & actually made the waterfall ice climbs (over 200) then we would go climb the backcountry frozen waterfall ice all day, race down just to go make more ice at night... They eventually started paying me for my cold miserable wet frozen work...
Was on the Silverton Colorado (the town is at @9218 ft elevation) Avalanche School Board of Directers, and served on the San Juan Cty Search and Rescue...
myself lost a kidney, broke my face & all ribs on right side in a 200 ft fall... all after I had broke a shoulder, my back & skull fracture on active duty...
I know a bit about mountaineering, and staying alive.
Cheers!
 
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Mike Pierson said:
No offence guys, but I gotta laugh...
I was the “volunteer ice farmer” @ the Ouray Colorado Ice Climbing Park, & actually made the waterfall ice climbs (over 200) then we would go climb the backcountry frozen waterfall ice all day, race down just to go make more ice at night... They eventually started paying me for my cold miserable wet frozen work...
Was on the Silverton Colorado (the town is at @9218 ft elevation) Avalanche School Board of Directers, and served on the San Juan Cty Search and Rescue...
myself lost a kidney, broke my face & all ribs on right side in a 200 ft fall... all after I had broke a shoulder, my back & skull fracture on active duty...
I know a bit about mountaineering, and staying alive.
Cheers!
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Good man! Pleasure to make your acquaintance, Mike.

Tom

EDIT: Love those high mountain ranges you have access to. Without travelling abroad, we have to 'make do' with the Scottish Highlands. ;) Here's our pitch this February, my buddy is building the break:

EvDS22s.jpg


You can see the weather coming in...
 
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I have always felt a little uncomfortable carrying a big knife (aka >7" blade) in the woods unless I have a definite need for something like that. I know some hikers will give you funny looks if they see a really big knife, but that is usually about as far as it goes other than perhaps chit chat especially if they like knives. It is all body language and if they sense you're an aggressive type, they will be on alert. I have no problem with the knives folks carry regardless of size. It's a tool.

Most of my woods walks are day hikes and generally I don't carry a big knife. I'll probably have one car camping for messing around the camp site, mostly for the fun of it.

With fires, I like fires. But other than when I was a kid, I don't build unnecessary fires generally. But I do like a fire at the camp site as it provides an activity, warmth, some light, and I consider the effort fun. But I do try to clean up after myself. This is an old discussion that pops up now and then here and we all have our opinions. On public lands, build fires if you are allowed if you want to and if the worst happens, it's good to have the tools to build a fire because of need.
 
Pilsner said:
Good man! Pleasure to make your acquaintance, Mike.

Tom
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I agree with 91bravo in that real knowledge comes from doing things yourself, & figuring things out on your own is the most important skill. Learning proper use of a knife is very important but not learned on Netflix or YouTube, but trial and error.
Listening not talking is the key.
I live where I live now because I feel free here, it is like the Wild West, & self protection is important because the police & ambulances are at least 30 minutes away. It’s a choice, an easy choice,
there are no “pretenders” or posers here...
We can see the mountains from our house, we winter camp in the snow, we backcountry ski & I shot my elk 2 weeks ago at over 9000 ft and field dressed it in the dark with a headlamp in 19 degree weather, in 4 hours...
I would do it all over again if had the chance, and when shit hits the fan I am calm cool and collective because I know what “not” to do.
We survive.
 
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Mike Pierson said:
I agree with 91bravo in that real knowledge comes from doing things yourself, & figuring things out on your own is the most important skill. Learning proper use of a knife is very important but not learned on Netflix or YouTube, but trial and error.
Listening not talking is the key.
I live where I live now because I feel free here, it is like the Wild West, & self protection is important because the police & ambulances are at least 30 minutes away. It’s a choice, an easy choice,
there are no “pretenders” or posers here...
We can see the mountains from our house, we winter camp in the snow, we backcountry ski & I shot my elk 2 weeks ago at over 9000 ft and field dressed it in the dark with a headlamp in 19 degree weather, in 4 hours...
No thanks is necessary... I would do it all over again if had the chance, and when shit hits the fan I am calm cool and collective because I know what “not” to do.
We survive.
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Yep. Agreed. The photo above was from a trip that went South, but it wasn't a disaster because we got down in good order, albeit in a serious hurry. Every decision was carefully weighed and our combined experience was the reason Mountain Rescue weren't up there searching for the bodies. They were already looking for one of two brothers who died the week before from avalanche. I don't think they found him until the thaw. Never take the piss out of the mountains, is my view.
 
91bravo said:
It's not all about need dude. What you fail to understand is, that I WANT a fire and I'd care take a gander, that most folks that go into the woods want a fire as well. Fire is the heart of camp, keeps you warm, cooks lots of food quickly, dries your clothes out, brings a sense of companionship, keeps wild animals away, provides light around your camp area, keeps multiple people warm when hanging out, etc.

Don't ever come backpacking or camping down here. You will be in for a huge culture shock when you see campfires roaring and big, scary knives strapped to packs.
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Don't forget about the mosquitos, a good wood fire keeps them at bay. Those suckers are active year round. I'm about 20 min. from the gulf down here in S.W. Louisiana. True winters down here are almost non existent. I cannot phantom living where an open carry law doesn't exist. Finding a place to try out a knife is pretty easy.
 
I am very fortunate to have easy access to National Forests here in Colorado. However, when the kids were growing up and busy with school and sports, it wasn't really feasible to be gone for 2 or 3 hours (or overnight).

What I did was to buy a portable fire pit from Home Depot, about $70 or so. We would use it for s'mores, cobbler, and all kinds of things like that. Then I could practice woodcraft and firecraft on the back deck and get the kids involved.
 
In this age of cell phones being a Canadian I still keep a emergency candle and matches in my trunk encase I go off the road in winter. The heat from the candle won't keep you comfortable but it will keep you alive.

My crazy ex gf used to go camping in the winter all the time. She had this little portable wood stove that fit inside her tent. One time it was -48c! I didn't go with her on that trip. But I remember her saying if that little stove went out she would probably have died. so she spent 3 days staying up all night feeding the stove wood lol
 
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