whose warranties cover unintentional abuse/breakage?

Fool4Blades · Jan 11, 2005

Cliff Stamp said:
No they never replaced it as I never sent it in to them. It was given to me for a review in the first place and I would never seek a warrenty replacement on that class of blade. Plus I intended to load the blade until it cracked as I wanted to see how far it went and how it cracked. It broke as I expected it would for its type of steel.

After over a hundred reviews, and a fair amount of damaged knives, there have only been a handful of blades I actually attempted to use the warrenty (Tusk, Rtak, Machax, Survival Bowie, Buck/Strider folder are all that come to mind). I would only seek a replacement on a review knife if the maker thought it was a defect and wanted to have work done on a more representative blade. Same goes in general, unless I think its a defect I don't engage the warrenty.

However my point was their reaction to the work was to attack and insult, both me personally and the methods when they had done the *exact same thing* themselves for years and used other similar work to promote their knives in the past, and frankly were far more extreme at times. This is the same company that promoted thier knives as prybars specifically saying how other knives broke and thiers didn't and cut into metals and concrete, hit them with hard objects, pounded them into cracks in rocks etc. .

There is no way you can even begin to place them in the same class with regards to warrenty and customer service with Busse, Swamp Rat, HI, etc. .

-Cliff

Or THAT! Sheesh....Strider knives have the absolute BEST warranty in the business!

Thomas Linton · Jan 11, 2005

Faith can move mountains.

fishbulb · Jan 11, 2005

I remember seeing a thread where somebody put a John Greco knife in a bench vice and cranked on the handle.

Tip broke.

John replaced it.

I'm not sure how his recent retirement would change things, but prior to this I understood that all Greco knives were fully guaranteed.

Billmanweh · Jan 11, 2005

Well, if you charge $500 for your knife, and you promote it as having an unlimited, no questions asked warranty, and pose it with a Special Forces guy in the promo pictures, I'd say you should expect it to be used hard.

You can't have it both ways.

Thomas Linton · Jan 11, 2005

Fool4Blades said:
Or THAT! Sheesh....Strider knives have the absolute BEST warranty in the business!

Perhaps you could help. I went to the Strider Site and I can't find anything about warranty. Which tab do I push?

Fool4Blades · Jan 12, 2005

From the Home page, click on Strider knives and read the small tan colored box. " Strider Knives carry an Unconditional Guarantee."

Unconditional Definition - " Without conditions or reservations; Absolute"

They picked the wording, they WILL stand behind their product.

fishbulb · Jan 12, 2005

Fool4Blades said:
Or THAT! Sheesh....Strider knives have the absolute BEST warranty in the business!

It seems that you can't really get a warranty better than that offered with a Busse or Swamp Rat, unless perhaps a maker would give you two knives for every damaged one you return or some similar gimmick.

Therefore, Strider may have an equally good warranty with other manufactureres in the industry but there is nothing to indicate that they have the "absolute best" one.

Or is there something that I'm missing that puts a Strider warranty head and shoulders above what seem to be quite similar ones from their competitors?

Red_Label · Jan 12, 2005

There is no such thing as "absolute" or "unconditional" in this case. If Strider were to stand behind their wording, then I could take a Strider knife, put it in my vice, pound it with a sledge hammer until it broke and then send it in to be replaced. After I got the replacement, I could do the same thing again right away and send that one back in to be replaced. And so on and so on. There's no way ANY maker, large or small would continue to stand behind their "unconditional" warranty for long in that case. Therefore, they should not be using words such as these to describe their warranties.

cognitivefun · Jan 12, 2005

fishbulb said:
It seems that you can't really get a warranty better than that offered with a Busse or Swamp Rat, unless perhaps a maker would give you two knives for every damaged one you return or some similar gimmick.

Doesn't HI have this warranty on some of their Ang Khola khukris?

Will P. · Jan 12, 2005

Red_Label said:
There is no such thing as "absolute" or "unconditional" in this case. If Strider were to stand behind their wording, then I could take a Strider knife, put it in my vice, pound it with a sledge hammer until it broke and then send it in to be replaced. After I got the replacement, I could do the same thing again right away and send that one back in to be replaced. And so on and so on. There's no way ANY maker, large or small would continue to stand behind their "unconditional" warranty for long in that case. Therefore, they should not be using words such as these to describe their warranties.

You could do that with a Swamp Rat. It wouldn't be very moral, and if they knew they'd be pissed off, but you'd get a new knife.

Here is a quote from Mrs. Busse:

Jennifer_Busse said:
I don't feel that "intentionally destroying" the knife is in keeping with the spirit of fairness that we have extended to our customers in our warranty. However, it is important to point out that we do not shrink from our claims or from our warranty. Therefore, if you feel that intentionally breaking your Battle Rat because you are unhappy with the performance of the edge under heavy impact is fair, that is up to you, as you are the one who gets to make the final call. Our warranty is up to you and is laid out very clearly on our warranty page, "We will honor any guarantee that you give your knife against major damage. TRANSLATION: LIFETIME WARRANTY... NO QUESTIONS ASKED"

Fool4Blades, I just don't get it. Cliff Stamp does objective tests on knives and has to put up with all sorts of crap for it. Awww, did he kick your sacred cow? Not bashing Mike Strider, but unless YOU have been there and done that your yapping and name calling doesn't really compare too well to Cliff's experience.

cognitivefun · Jan 12, 2005

intentional destruction...does any company have to warrant a product this way? I argue that it does not. Intentional destruction would mean that if I melt my knife down with a torch so it's a little puddle, they will have to replace it, and then I melt it down again and they replace it...

C'mon. The thread subject is "unintentional" and that is a key word, don't you agree? If you are testing a knife to see when it will break, how can that be unintentional?

OTOH, if I pry a door open with my Strider folder, I am confident that Strider will fix the knife if it breaks. I didn't intend on breaking the knife, but I was misusing the folder certainly. The intent is important here...my intent was rescue, not testing the folder to see when it breaks.

Thomas Linton · Jan 12, 2005

Fool4Blades said:
From the Home page, click on Strider knives and read the small tan colored box. " Strider Knives carry an Unconditional Guarantee."

Unconditional Definition - " Without conditions or reservations; Absolute"

They picked the wording, they WILL stand behind their product.

Thank you.

crossada · Jan 12, 2005

in todays competitive market it is just good business to put the unconditional warranty on your product because it gives the idea that this knife is better than the one that doesn't have it.

i have never abused any of my knives, even the ones with total destruction warranties but it tells me first and foremost that the maker trusts their product enough that they are willing to go in the hole if the blade fails.

of course the companys that do not have this warranty still have great blades such as Randall Made Knives which put more handmade blades in combat zones than anyother maker put together and they still thrive without the warranty hype

Billmanweh · Jan 12, 2005

cognitivefun said:
C'mon. The thread subject is "unintentional" and that is a key word, don't you agree? If you are testing a knife to see when it will break, how can that be unintentional?

OTOH, if I pry a door open with my Strider folder, I am confident that Strider will fix the knife if it breaks. I didn't intend on breaking the knife, but I was misusing the folder certainly. The intent is important here...my intent was rescue, not testing the folder to see when it breaks.

That's what I was trying to ask

Josh Muller · Jan 13, 2005

loki88 said:
I always have some weird feelings about warranty. If u use a knife for the purpose it is intended to, meaning cutting materials that is softer then the steel it is made of, in the direction of the cutting edge, and u use the knife as a knife how can u break a high quality knife?

i was at work cutting a plastic bag, and the tention of the bag (about 1" of solid plastic material) and my hand slipped farther away from the bag then i intended (put tention on the bag to cut, tention carried my hand foraward after cut was made) and i tagged the corner of a metal table with it.

cut a steak and hit the bone unintentially.

both of wich can chip out a fragile steel if its thin enough, or overly hard.

Roadrunner · Jan 13, 2005

cognitivefun said:
Doesn't HI have this warranty on some of their Ang Khola khukris?

They do, on the chiruwa (full width tang) models. From their website:

mother of 15 inch Ang Kholas -- usually 16 to 17 inches in length, blade 1/2 inch thick, 2+ inches wide, about 1.75 to 2.0+ pounds. Full tang. Break or bend it and get two free!

kesparate · Jan 13, 2005

i agree with some of the people here that trying to get a warrenty replacemnet for a knife you broke while blatantly abusing it is pretty shady, and rather emmbarasing i would think.
i broke a greco wisper by (hang my head in shame) throwing it at a tree. it's a very thin knife with specific design purposes which DO NOT INCLUDE throwing it at trees. now unless i plan to lie to the man, how am i supposed to call him up and demand a replacement? too much gall for me.
why, you may ask, did i throw it at the tree in the first place? all i can say is that it seemed like a good idea at the time.

BH · Jan 13, 2005

I believe if you do a dumbass thing, like put the knife in a vice and intentionally break it just to see if you can, the Strider guys will replace it, but will mark the knife that in a way shows, "Hey this guy is a dumbass" and if you do the same thing again because you're obviously a dumbass, then I believe you're S.O.L., which imho, is what a dumbass who breaks knives to see if they can deserves.

cognitivefun · Jan 13, 2005

Some companies such as HI and Strider are run on a very informal basis in many ways, quite obviously.

Larger companies have a more formal warranty and need to. Strider has never to my knowledge been known to slack off on their "unconditional" warranty, and neither has HI.

I continue to assert that intentionally breaking something is different from misusing something. I misuse my folder when I pry but I am not intentionally prying until it breaks. If I was, I wouldn't personally ask Strider or anyone else to replace it. OTOH, if I abuse or misuse the folder without intending to break it, I would send it in for repair under the "unconditional" warranty.

As these companies grow (if they grow), they may be expected to have more formal guarantees. Spyderco has a neat warranty even though they are a much larger production company. Companies like Zippo have become famous partly due to these "unconditional" guarantees but if you intentionally break one, I don't feel they should be obligated to replace...

rgc · Jan 13, 2005

Ranger Knives has a warranty similar to those mentioned:

"Fixed Blade Knives:
Are guaranteed to be free from defects in materials and workmanship for life. No questions asked. If it fails for any reason send it back and it will be fixed or replaced at no cost to you."

rgc