Why are blades rarely slicey?

Spyderco is one company that, as far as I know, don’t push the image of a hard use, door stabbing, brick splitting knife. And I own several Spydercos because of it.

On the other hand, I also own more rugged knives from brands who favor the thicker blade/grinds, so I guess I’m not better then anybody else.. :)
 
jackknife said:
BUT...fantacy is what sells those overly thick cult worship items that bring in the money.

Jeff Randall said that 90% of the knife market is BS, and I agree with that statement. The so called tactical knives being sold these days have very little to do with cutting. It's all about image and hype. Smoke and mirrors to get the money from young guys with more disposable income that our fathers and grandfathers had, and less common sense. It's all about the fantasy warrior fighting off Chinese paratroopers or the bad boy image of the fast opening knife capable of prying open a tank hatch.

Find it funny that in todays suburban world of office cubicles and computer desks, people think they need a knife far more capable of mayhem than our grandfathers who lived in a rougher environment. Now everyone want be a Rambo. It's about the so called bad a$$ posturing with the latest knife magazine of the month wonder blade you can flick out like a latter day James Dean.

But it's funny that someone like Frank Hamer, legendary Texas ranger who brought many real killers to justice, and who brought down Bonnie and Clyde, carried a pretty good assortment of guns, but his pocket knife was a mundane old well used Barlow knife with worn down blades. Maybe Hamer wasn't worried about image.



Strange how real working cowboys, freight wagon drivers, sailors, soldiers, and lawmen all carried thin bladed pocket knives that had no one hand opening, not even a lock on the blade, yet for generations those old knives did the job they were designed to do; cut things. These days on construction sites all over , the most used knife issn't some high tech folder with a prybar blade, and capable of de-animating enemy series, but a simple low cost sliding blade utility knife like a Husky or Stanley, or Super knife with a razor thin blade about an inch long. They cut insulation, strip cable, cut wall board and anything else on the site that needs to be cut. They cost about 5.99 at Home Depot.

It's all about the hype. But then, maybe the world of the modern office cubicle environment or fast food industry is more dangerous than I thought.
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Yup. It's very telling how all those older guys didn't carry any of the knives that hadn't been invented yet. ;)
 
The more it goes, the more i realise i could do pretty much everything with an Opinel and a mora pro S, both in stainless steel.
With a third, thickest blade, for camping/bushcraft, you Can handle 99.9% of the situations you could one day face.
 
Some people want a corvette, others are satisfied with a tried and true old ford pickup. :cool: My feeling is, if enough people want it it's none of my business why and I don't have a right to criticize. ;) I find most decent knives cut just fine if kept sharp.
 
EDGE RETENTION.
The big hype, what so many are looking for and wanting. For pure cutting performance a hollow grind will out perform other grinds. But will not hold it's edge quite as long. And doesn't hold up to the "hard use" so many are after. Of my daily carriers, my Boker 2004 "cuts" so much better than my Shiro Neon. I like both knives for what each is. I love that CRK puts such great hollow grinds on their blades, they "cut" better than many other knives. They are as popular as they are for much more than just the name.
The industry supplies what is in demand. Edge retention and hard use is what is in demand.
 
The “tactical” knife craze has caused a market flood of thick stock knives. Its a large part of the market now. The demand is still high and that means continuing production.

I love a good thick stock knife, fixed or folder. I also love a thin slicey blade as well. They both have their place and uses.

It does seem like there’s a lack of modern thin stock knives being produced. Off the top of my head only Spyderco comes to mind for modern slicers. Traditional knives are still the slicer kings.
 
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katanas said:
Some people want a corvette, others are satisfied with a tried and true old ford pickup. :cool: My feeling is, if enough people want it it's none of my business why and I don't have a right to criticize. ;) I find most decent knives cut just fine if kept sharp.
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Using your analogy, I'd suggest a good traditional is akin to the corvette and the thick modern tacticool is akin to the pickup.
 
OddBlade OddBlade Hollow grinds cut very well but for slicing through material with the entire blade I feel like the shoulders of a hollow grind create some drag. I still prefer a full flat grind.
 
leghog said:
It may be more telling WHY crowbar thick knives to chop concrete blocks and stab car hoods and 55 gallon drums hadn't been inverted yet. That was Carl's point.
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All comes down to hype and profit. When it's much cheaper to make a simple barlow and that's what all the cowboys are using, why would you spend all that money on R&D to develop knives that are much, much stronger, quicker and easier to use and offer a far broader range of materials? It wasn't until the profit fell off and many, many of the old companies went under that the innovation envelope really got pushed, right? ;)
 
I love how we jump from one knife trend to another on this site. People band together and pat themselves on the back for truly appreciating a specific feature that they believe only "real knives" have. Everything else is tacticool, mall ninja or a pry bar, etc. A true knife aficionado doesn't want or need a knife with a pocket clip, flipper, ball bearing bearing pivot, fall shut closing action, thicker blade, wave opening feature, etc.

The latest trend on this site is the rare and all important "slicey" blade. Never mind that all tasks don't call for slicing. Cutting and slicing aren't the same thing. Try to peel an apple with a "slicey" Spyderco PM2 (or almost any Spyderco for that matter) that everybody praises as the perfect EDC knife. I'm sorry but the PM2 is kind of slicey, but really sucks at peeling fruit and some other tasks because of the tall blade. No knife is perfect for all jobs. There's room for all types of knives in a collection or EDC rotation. We all need to get off our high horses and just buy what we like.

I have a We Knife 705 with 4mm blade stock that I keep hair popping sharp. It cuts and slices the crap out of everything I toss at it. I also have an Opinel #8 in carbon steel that slices the crap out of everything. Both do a better job at peeling an apple than my PM2. When it comes to cutting up carpet the PM2 beats the slicey Opinel. I'll keep all three knives because I like them and they cut what I need them to cut.

Wonder what the next Bladeforums "that's not a knife" trend will be. Perhaps only knives chipped out of stone will be considered real knives. ;)
 
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Just a couple thoughts
1.Search for the perfect knife that does everything leads to heavy duty knives and away from pure slicers
2. If your going to build knives with heavy duty locks, you likely will put a heavy duty blade on also
3. Many of these makers don't go back that many years and are from the "tactical" era
4. agree that traditional knives did not leave you under knifed.
 
Insipid Moniker said:
...When it's much cheaper to make a simple barlow and that's what all the cowboys are using, why would you spend all that money on R&D to develop knives that are much, much stronger, quicker and easier to use and offer a far broader range of materials?....
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Easier to use? That's arguable, hence this thread.
 
I can't argue that point 115Italian 115Italian . My neon goes through cardboard like its butter, the Boker not so much.
Everyone has their own personal test methods for sharpness, cutting performance, etc... Be it just gliding the edge with their thumb, slicing phone book paper, whatever.... I use a large firm carrot to make sure my knife is sharp enough for use and how well it cuts, "residual effects of a lifetime in the kitchen". Take that full flat grind and the hollow grind and cut through a carrot and you will feel a very noticable difference.
 
halden.doerge said:
... Which is to say, it’s all about what people think they want, not what works.
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Like fishing lures, it's about sales and not about what necessarily works. One needs a little experience to make the "what works" judgments without assistance. It is also why 4" fixed blades are generally preferred, but most want something big at first. I know I did. No big thing. I still like the big ones but seldom use them. With folders... the majority seems to fall in the 3 > 4" blade length camp for using. Most flippers and AO knives have thick steel; they seem to need the weight. I can understand the design perspective with flippers, but most knives are just too thick to use for normal everyday tasks. I think that's why the Spyderco Delica and similar knives are so popular and the reason that traditional knives should be more popular.
 
Gayle Bradley’s, Spyderco Advocate, Doug Ritter mini (all in M4) are great slicers. My Zt 0770 also in M4 is quite a sliver. Maybe M4 is part of it but I find different uses for different types of blades. Sometimes I want a sliver sometimes I want something more robust
 
jackknife said:
BUT...fantasy is what sells those overly thick cult worship items that bring in the money.

Jeff Randall said that 90% of the knife market is BS, and I agree with that statement. The so called tactical knives being sold these days have very little to do with cutting. It's all about image and hype. Smoke and mirrors to get the money from young guys with more disposable income that our fathers and grandfathers had, and less common sense. It's all about the fantasy warrior fighting off Chinese paratroopers or the bad boy image of the fast opening knife capable of prying open a tank hatch.

Find it funny that in today's suburban world of office cubicles and computer desks, people think they need a knife far more capable of mayhem than our grandfathers who lived in a rougher environment. Now everyone want be a Rambo. It's about the so called bad a$$ posturing with the latest knife magazine of the month wonder blade you can flick out like a latter day James Dean.
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People seem to quote that Jeff Randall thing a lot. I personally don't care what he thinks, but I'm old enough to have formed my own opinions on what works. The Rambo-James Dean things not only affects young people. It is about sales. That's okay as far as I'm concerned. If you are truly interested in simply owning or carrying a knife that cuts, the Delica or Endura and SAKs do that quite well if you keep them sharp. But again, what's the fun in that? We need flippers and rock strong locks just in case we are going to stab something or want to deploy a knife a bit more quickly or to open your knife that one time in perhaps months when you're on a ladder and only have one hand to safely use. But again, that's okay. I enjoy this stuff too.

The steel choices used with knives are amazing these days. I enjoy this aspect. But I don't enjoy how the newest steel is always the best.
 
It has to be demand driven. They wouldn't make thick blades if people didn't buy them.

There are plenty of of slicey knives. I have a Spyderco Chaparral in my pocket right now - doesn't get much slicier for a modern folder with a clip. Most flat grinds are slicey unless the blade is ridiculously thick at the top. If I can't quarter an apple with it by cutting (as opposed to breaking it apart) it's not a blade I want to EDC. I suspect most people carrying thick blades would be better served with thinner ones in terms of cutting. But preferences are complicated. My criteria for a good EDC are not the same as others.
 
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