Why are blades rarely slicey?

In the pre-internet world, a knife was a tool that you typically carried in your pocket. You pulled it out only when you needed to use it. You didn’t worry so much about scratching it, or damaging it. You didn’t much talk about it with others, or ask strangers which knife you should buy. And you didn’t spend a day’s or even a week’s salary on it. We didn’t have knife “communities.”

Fast forward to today, and all that has changed. Yes, there have been some innovations that have improved on the designs of knives, and there are more specialized and sophisticated knives available. But let’s not fool ourselves. They’re still tools. And rather simple ones. But now, we hoard them, brag to strangers about our hoards, solicit strangers as to which to add next. We stress over scuffs and scratches. We find details that are otherwise unimportant to the basic function of the tool, and turn it into something obsession worthy. And we justify spending, at least proportionately, large sums of money for what is still a relatively simple tool. We refer to ourselves as a “community” and in some cases, spend more time comparing knives and “keeping up with the Jones” than we do actually cutting or slicing.

Take note that throughout these observations, I used “we.” I’m certainly not above any of this, and am “guilty” of much of it. I’m simply being honest about where we’ve been and where we are. In a way, it’s a fairly strange transition. To be fair, this same transition has happened with many, many items. The internet has changed us in some absolutely positive ways, but it’s also changed us in some very strange ways as well.

I suppose that’s the end of my Sunday morning philosophizing.
 
This is why I love the Spyderco Mantra 1 & 2. Often ground to .20 BTE, while still a bit larger than my preferences, it is thinner than most factory edges. Add in that the M4 takes a killer edge and the Delica styled and sized handle is loved by many. The offering up of a greater cutting edge length is a nice bonus.
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Spyderco, Opinel and a lot of the traditional knives are slicey to start with. Others you have to do some work to get them slicey. Enjoy my Benchmades but most of them are not slicey until you do some work. Thin grinds = slice. Different strokes for different folks.
 
I don't presume to know what others use their knives for. Nor do I really care.

About fours ago I carried a ZT0301 daily for a year. I cut lots of stuff with it and not once did It fail to cut what I needed it to. Perhaps it is because I don't do food prep or peel apples with my folders that I didn't notice that it was inadequate as a knife?

I lost interest in knives with metal scales so now I carry a Military. And I still don't use a folder for food prep. The Military cuts everything I need it to as well.
 
Pomsbz said:
I've got a theory that a lot of people carrying these knives are not particularly cutting stuff.
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I think that may be a piece of it, but I also think that, for many, many people, the tasks people use folders for these days only require a sharp apex and not ideal slicing geometry. From light work like opening packages to heavier, like cutting zip ties, the only big thing I use my folders for where primary grind geometry makes a big difference is cutting cardboard. Now, I do a lot of that, so I pretty much always have one knife on me with a thin, slicey grind, but for something like cutting thick zip ties a big folder with a less ideal grind cuts just as well and may be more reassuring and comfortable as I'm exerting a fair amount of force to make the cut.
 
WilliamEdward said:
I've heard WE knives has had some thinner blades recently
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Really !
That's good news. I mean they look great and all . . . (and I keep looking) but I want super thin and am willing to put my grinders where my mouth is but when it comes to WE it would be such a shame to take on to a grinder; it would be like cropping the Mona Lisa because I didn't like the back ground.
Hmmmmmm
I'll keep looking (I can't help it anyway).
What's slicy :
Para 2 my next to last purchase (it thins out nicely once you get out aways from the pivot)(I'm not complaining).
Case Trapper (my last purchase)
Check out the Boker Plus Ti handled Titan (440C but works for me; good stuff !).
Hahaha I can't help feeling bad that this distressing thread is partly due to my table banging about thin blades / geometry . . . I feel like I should apologize . . .
. . . maybe once I have had some coffee and get my strength up . . .

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Good point about zip ties - you want a beefier blade for that. Not something I do very often with a knife. fwiw, I prefer to twist them off with pliers. Much easier than cutting 90% of the time.
 
leghog said:
Traditional knives and SAKs --- slicey. Our fathers and grandfathers certainly weren't "underknifed" with them. And neither are we.
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Absolutely.
I do not think cutting needs have changed, simply what people expect their knives to do and have gotten used to doing with them.
Sure nylon cable ties and plastic strapping have come into use but wire and steel strapping was in use before and a good pair of dykes is still the best tool for this job.

People want what they want however, and most of this stuff will actually cut at least.
I can't fault people's choices for thicker blades that don't cut very well, Ive got a few I like. Slicy is best but if I've got one I like that's not so slicy I still use it
 
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“RipD - It has to be demand driven.” Maybe, but how much of that demand is driven by marketing hype and youtube bushcraft wannabes.

People get a lot of their information from different places than they used too.
Many people new to knives today get on their laptop and head to youtube. Once there they find countless videos of fat men slicing chickens, cracker heads stabbing every thing in the junk yard, so called bushcrafters who just happen to walk upon a fresh stack of chain sawed wood to split.

I was reading reviews a while back and noticed the reviews mentioned blade steel, blade strength, handle material, ease of deployment and speed. The whole whip out and deploy silliness usually seemed to be the most important thing that could make or break a knife in the review.
Very rarely will a review talk about how well the knife would actually cut the things people need to cut on a day to day basis.

The result is you now have a whole generation of knife users who were never taught what a knife is really made for. Blade geometry is a concept that is lost on them, unless that concept means pry bar or hard use. They have no concept of how to safely use a knife so that a lock is redundant.

I don't really know why more knives aren't designed to actually cut but I wish more were.
There are modern knives that cut well but they are few and far between.
 
Dean51 said:
“... bushcraft wannabes.

... so called bushcrafters who just happen to walk upon a fresh stack of chain sawed wood to split.

I was reading reviews .... <snip> Very rarely will a review talk about how well the knife would actually cut the things people need to cut on a day to day basis.

The result is you now have a whole generation of knife users who were never taught what a knife is really made for. Blade geometry is a concept that is lost on them, unless that concept means pry bar or hard use. They have no concept of how to safely use a knife so that a lock is redundant.

I don't really know why more knives aren't designed to actually cut but I wish more were.
There are modern knives that cut well but they are few and far between.
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I highlighted a few of your points or mentions. On the bushcraft wannabees, you have to start somewhere and if you're camping or thinking about camping, gotta have a "bushcraft" knife. ;) True about the reviews and yes, how strong a knife is seems to be of the utmost importance. However, being able to field dress a Buick has seemed to be reducing in importance on knives.

I have never broken a knife.... ahhh, broke a blade once when I was a kid on a Case slippie, but they're thin. But since then, I have never broken a blade or even broken the tip off a knife. But I pay attention on the tip thing. Almost all of my modern knives cut pretty darn well, they just aren't necessarily slicers. For me, slicing a sandwich or cutting an apple is really low on the priority list and I seldom do it. I guess if I ordered Subway sandwiches without being sliced, it might be different. But I get them to cut the foot long ones into "3's" versus in half. But I agree that even for cutting, the overly thick blades used are not conductive to good efficient cutting unless you're cutting something that might well break your knife.
 
I grew up carrying "traditional" pocketknives (they were just called 'pocketknives' back then), SAKs, then started carrying moderns as well. The 'moderns' I carry all slice well; my CRK large Insingo and small Inkosi; my Spyderco Native 5 G10 (my current OHO EDC), Delica FFG, Military and PM2; and, of course, I always have my Victorinox SAKs. My Case knives slice very well, too.

There seems to be a lot of 'us vs. them' mentality among many knife enthusiasts. I personally like both 'traditionals' and 'moderns'. But they have to cut very well for my purposes, or else I won't bother. I've tried knives that were like folding prybars. Many people find those same knives useful, but they aren't for me. My cheap little keyring mini-prybar makes a better prybar for me than any overly-obtuse folding knife ever could. I survived with only one knife, a Victorinox Spartan SAK, when I lived in Asia for nearly a decade, and never felt under-knifed (this was back before sweeping knife restrictions on airplanes and elsewhere became a thing).

I don't see the popularity of OHO knives in itself as a negative trend. Of course companies want to make money. That's how one stays in business. There are iconic knife companies whose staples were traditional knives that have gone under. Yes, there is still a market for traditional knives, but it wasn't enough to sustain those long-time companies that folded. The world changes, and if a company wants to survive, it has to adapt to keep up. That's why Victorinox has some knives featuring OHO locking blades, and Case offers options on some models with thumb studs and/or a pocket clip. Like it or not. If not, then don't buy it. I personally don't see liking modern folders as blasphemous, and neither do I see preferring traditionals as somehow lacking and out of touch.

I still never go out without a couple of SAKs on me, and TBH, they generally see more use on most given days than the OHO in my pocket.

Jim
 
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